A complementary leveling system beyond level cap?

Will this game have a secondary leveling system beyond the initial level cap?
I will give an example :
Bob reaches level cap and can now start leveling his ''Paragon'' level from 1 to 999. Very simple
The name Paragon i just made up, please just work with me here.
Paragon level will not be tied to progression and is a standalone leveling system from character level.
This has been done in other games and i would like to see it in Ashes of Creation too.

With the AOC experience being as open and dynamic as it is, this system would introduce even more reasons to keep playing in order to progress and show off your experience in the game after your character reached level cap. I will even throw in an additional idea of adding rewards to these ''Paragon levels'' To give more interest for players to level it up. but that's another story.

Has this ever been discussed?
How do you guys feel about it.

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Comments

Songcaller

SWG boomed under horizontal progression and died when vertical progression replaced horizontal progression.

CriminalCupcake

You say you made up the name of paragon lvls as if you've never played Diablo, and i think that's a lie. We dont need bonus leveling. This isnt a Blizzard game.

Dreoh

djhifi wrote: »

Frostshot wrote: »

I would prefer that they never raise the level cap at all. Raising level cap causes issues with power creep, balancing, and eventually stat squishes.

That said, AoC will have multiple other areas of advancement involved, guild system, religion systems. I'm not an expert on all this stuff but you can read through the wiki and learn what we know so far.

Vertical progression (for example: level cap increase, champion xp of some sort, gear item level increase, etc, etc) will ALWAYS be better than horizontal progression because you will get to a point where the game seems stalled and everyone will eventually burnout.

Even if people say they won't, thats just an illusion.

So definitely +1 here for vertical progression over horizontal.

That's definitely not true, and it's mighty presumptuous of you to put words into people's mouths.

Tons of people play GW2 very consistently and it has no vertical progression. And that's even with not taking living world updates into consideration.

Noaani

Dreoh wrote: »

Tons of people play GW2 very consistently and it has no vertical progression.

No, GW2 does have vertical progression.

The vertical progression the game does has is a lot less prevalent than it is in most other games, and there are systems in the game to disguise it even further, but the game does in fact have vertical progression.

I mean, the game has 80 levels, that in itself is vertical progression. There are also multiple stages of gear upgrades to work for, which is the stock standard form of vertical progression in most games aside from gaining levels.

It is fair to say that GW2 has less vertical progression than other games. I totally agree there. However, saying it has no vertical progression is as factually incorrect as saying vertical progression is always better than horizontal (it is usually better, but not always, imo).

Dreoh

Noaani wrote: »

I mean, the game has 80 levels, that in itself is vertical progression. There are also multiple stages of gear upgrades to work for, which is the stock standard form of vertical progression in most games aside from gaining levels.

That's extremely disingenuous to say and honestly it's outright ridiculous for you to make that point, by that logic every single game has vertical progression so this argument doesn't matter at all.

This thread isn't about progression, it's about developers extending the end game power levels arbitrarily

GW2 does not have vertical progression, the only time they ever did anything close was making ascended gear, which is only on par with the previously existing legendary gear.

Noaani

Dreoh wrote: »

That's extremely disingenuous to say and honestly it's outright ridiculous for you to make that point, by that logic every single game has vertical progression so this argument doesn't matter at all.

In terms of MMO's, as far as I am aware, yes they do.

Both the comment that vertical progression is always better, and the comment that GW2 only has horizontal progression are incorrect - even if they are mostly true.

You can't say that I am being disingenuous for pointing out that you are slightly wrong when you yourself are pointing out that someone else is slightly wrong.

Vhaeyne

For Ashes specifically they have a sort of horizontal progression system in place already.

https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Religions
Looks specifically at benefits, augments, and progression.

This may not be the horizontal progression system you have in mind, but it is the horizontal progression system they plan on going with.

Dreoh

Noaani wrote: »

Dreoh wrote: »

That's extremely disingenuous to say and honestly it's outright ridiculous for you to make that point, by that logic every single game has vertical progression so this argument doesn't matter at all.

In terms of MMO's, as far as I am aware, yes they do.

Both the comment that vertical progression is always better, and the comment that GW2 only has horizontal progression are incorrect - even if they are mostly true.

You can't say that I am being disingenuous for pointing out that you are slightly wrong when you yourself are pointing out that someone else is slightly wrong.

Except I'm not wrong? Literally other than Ascended gear there has been NO power or level cap increases. All new gear has remained on par with the gear released at launch day. You are absolutely making a bad faith argument here or are just not understanding what vertical progression is in this context.

Noaani

Dreoh wrote: »

You are absolutely making a bad faith argument here or are just not understanding what vertical progression is in this context.

Not at all.

I specifically said they have less vertical progression than other games, you are the one that said there is none, and then went on to name some.

The comment that started all of this was you pointing out that someone else was wrong when they said vertical progression was always better. That poster was wrong, vertical progression is only *almost* always better.

Likewise, GW2 doesn't have absolutely no vertical progression, it has *almost* no vertical progression.

Ostaff

To me, there should never be level cap increases, only horizontal openings of new zones that require stats or a type of skill that were not previously added into any other zones which are needed in order to be raised in order to traverse that zone properly and these stats would have little if any impact on the other zone play.

Beekeeper

Paragon levels in something like Diablo 3 always seemed like really lazy rewards for really boring content.

Noaani

Beekeeper wrote: »

Paragon levels in something like Diablo 3 always seemed like really lazy rewards for really boring content.

Isn't that Blizzard games in general though?

Enigmatic Sage

imo, solid no for me on paragon levels.
end game progression should be focused around the nodes and their creeps until an expansion allows for further progression in levels, nodes and creeps.
gear, mounts and artisan skills obviously is in direct relation to these progressions.

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