About the decision to remove prone, and possibility of removing crouch as well

How a player can move is the most fundamental way one interacts with the environment. The ability to crouch, prone, jump, and climb are basic, obvious means of exploration that anyone would do without much thought if you were exploring a new place.

I want to feel immersed in AoC. I want to be able to interact with the environment in ways that are rational and reasonable, like ducking behind a barrel to avoid ranged attacks, or sneaking through tall grass on our bellies to launch a surprise assault. I want to be able to climb a rock to get away from the pack of wolves chasing me. I want my movement to be an aspect of war strategy, like positioning a heavy armor squad prone on the other side of a small hill, and routing the enemy into it. I want to crouch or prone to get under an obstacle, or lose line of sight with an enemy.

Most of all, I don't want to feel like a capsule. It makes no sense to play a humanoid, but be unable to crouch, prone, jump, or climb.

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Comments

Lash

I thought it was a good thing to remove this. If it it in the game people expect the game to be designed around it. It creates a lot more work for the devs when they already have enough on their plate. There is also the fact that mob AI has to interact with it in a way that does not just break the game.

mobtek

prone I can see the arguments for, crouch, nope I really enjoyed the livestream where that was shown in the UE5 reveal stream

Arya_Yeshe

Prone creates a lot of bugs and glitches in many games

I don't want the devs wasting their time with such useless thing, let they focus on things that matter

Nuub

Arya_Yeshe wrote: »

Prone creates a lot of bugs and glitches in many games

So do a lot of other systems. This is not a reason not to do it, its part of the process of creation.

CROW3

Prone is silly in a high-fantasy game.

Arya_Yeshe

Nuub wrote: »

Arya_Yeshe wrote: »

Prone creates a lot of bugs and glitches in many games

So do a lot of other systems. This is not a reason not to do it, its part of the process of creation.

It's not the same.

Who will prone during combat?
Prone during mining?

Prone is just silly and creates bugs on stuff that aren't even the backbone of the game.

mobtek

Arya_Yeshe wrote: »

Nuub wrote: »

Arya_Yeshe wrote: »

Prone creates a lot of bugs and glitches in many games

So do a lot of other systems. This is not a reason not to do it, its part of the process of creation.

Prone during mining?

YES

okay I'm back in the adding prone camp now
plus prone would be great for exploring strange out of the way places to do with exploration IMHO

Talents

Well, they didn't remove prone, prone was never in the game in the first place.

As for crouch, crouch was never planned for either, it's just that UE5 added crouching as a default functionality so that's why they added it because why not, it's basically just a tick of a box in UE5.

George_Black

Which mmo does prones?

CROW3

George_Black wrote: »

Which mmo does prones?

Every mmo. It's called death.

Gizban

Talents wrote: »

Well, they didn't remove prone, prone was never in the game in the first place.

As for crouch, crouch was never planned for either, it's just that UE5 added crouching as a default functionality so that's why they added it because why not, it's basically just a tick of a box in UE5.

Thank you for pointing out that prone was never in the game. The title is misleading in that respect.

There was a question read on one of the update streams and Steven was unambiguous when he said 'no' to prone.

Taaku

I say add it! Make some hidden entrances into mines / dungeons. Where you would have to find them and then crawl in.

novercalis

CROW3 wrote: »

George_Black wrote: »

Which mmo does prones?

Every mmo. It's called death.

Calibix

Devi'l advocate here, but NW did have prone. You could use it to set up ambushes. It was one of the few actually good things about NW. There were iirc certain "secret" tunnels you could only fit through by crouching or proning.

SamSlade

wait, so we have no environmental interactions at all? No crouch, prone, vault, climb, hide, etcetera?

That, combined with the lack of actual action combat targeting(mouse over lock-on is not skill based combat) kind of puts the kybosh on this game. Auto-locking spam combat has no place in a modern PvP game.

Arya_Yeshe

If you wanna prone for taking a nap you can do it when you die.

FuryBladeborne

SamSlade wrote: »

wait, so we have no environmental interactions at all? No crouch, prone, vault, climb, hide, etcetera?

That, combined with the lack of actual action combat targeting(mouse over lock-on is not skill based combat) kind of puts the kybosh on this game. Auto-locking spam combat has no place in a modern PvP game.

Vault, climb, hide, etc. is going to be class based. Here is a video showing a ranger (or rouge) doing parkour like movement climbing walls, jumping, rolling, etc. At the time Steven discussed how such movement will be limited to specific classes and climbing will be limited to specific locations. i.e. You can't just climb over any point of a city wall, but there will be areas that can be climbed so they need to be guarded.

On the recent livestream where he was talking talking about the fact that there is no prone, he did say there will be crouching. The intent is to focus stealth and ambush capabilities on the classes that are good at those things.

While I would personally prefer that all classes could use realistic stealth such as going prone behind rocks and bushes, I can understand limiting it to improve the benefits for stealth classes as they will be comparatively better at their jobs.

Nuub

SamSlade wrote: »

wait, so we have no environmental interactions at all? No crouch, prone, vault, climb, hide, etcetera?

That, combined with the lack of actual action combat targeting(mouse over lock-on is not skill based combat) kind of puts the kybosh on this game. Auto-locking spam combat has no place in a modern PvP game.

You misunderstand. in the current build, you can crouch, jump, and some climbing. As @Talents said, prone was not in the game, I thought it was but had been removed. In a recent stream, it was said that cover such as bushes, and loss of line of sight, would remove your nameplate from appearing to other players. So, you can kinda hide in that respect. Rogues also have a hide skill that obscures the player.

Nuub

@FuryBladeborne thanks for the contribution to the thread! I hadn't seen that video and its really cool!

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