Taking another player's item should flag you.

I don't think this is too hot of a take but I think if someone takes items off another player's corpse, it should flag them.

To take this idea further, I think the perfect implementation of this system would have it so that any item that is looted from another player is tagged as "stolen." I think this should include completed items dropped by corrupted players. If you have a stolen item in your inventory, you are flagged for pvp. If you are killed, you drop all stolen items. In my head, the stolen flag would be removed if the item is put into storage or returned to its original owner.

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tinukeda

Instead of flagging the looter how about making it extremely difficult to sell or use the items instead?
I assume you're talking about resources, not actual items which only drop off of red/corrupt players.

mainedutch

tinukeda wrote: »

Instead of flagging the looter how about making it extremely difficult to sell or use the items instead?
I assume you're talking about resources, not actual items which only drop off of red/corrupt players.

I think simply flagging the looter is a simpler and more intuitive implementation personally.

I also wouldn't be surprised if they plan this already because glint off corpses is labeled as 'stolen.'

But 100% players should be flagged if they loot your corpse. This has been the only reason I've wanted to engage in open-world PVP so far, but I can't get retribution for all my thieves because of corruption.

Vhaeyne

I am now very sure that the current implementation is the intended implementation.

Something you may like about the current system that I like. The current system creates drama or as Steven calls it. "Player friction".

This is a good thing.

You are going to be way more invested in the story of you getting revenge on the guy who took your loot than whatever blizzard is calling lore these days.

If/when you get revenge it may be a better reward than any drop in the game.

tinukeda

Ah I'm used to solo farming far from other players where even a 5 minute ride back to the body poses little/no risk of loss

mcstackerson

tinukeda wrote: »

Instead of flagging the looter how about making it extremely difficult to sell or use the items instead?
I assume you're talking about resources, not actual items which only drop off of red/corrupt players.

I would have it include items dropped by corrupted players.

For me, I think the idea is to give players a chance to recover stolen items and get revenge, not devalue the items. Trying to increase the risk a little, not decrease the reward.

mainedutch

Vhaeyne wrote: »

I am now very sure that the current implementation is the intended implementation.

Something you may like about the current system that I like. The current system creates drama or as Steven calls it. "Player friction".

This is not intended gameplay.

Go to 11:01:45 on this interview with Steven from only 2 days ago: https://twitch.tv/videos/2298227762

Steven describes PvP flagging will be implemented for looting corpses, along with a lot of other stuff.

"If you do loot that body after a successful time you will be flagged and become a valid target for PvP."

This is the way it should be. Risk vs. reward. You might want to think twice about taking someone's stuff!

tinukeda

mcstackerson wrote: »

I would have it include items dropped by corrupted players.

For me, I think the idea is to give players a chance to recover stolen items and get revenge, not devalue the items. Trying to increase the risk a little, not decrease the reward.

I disagree. The corrupt player knew the risks of going corrupt and still chose to do so. Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

mcstackerson

tinukeda wrote: »

mcstackerson wrote: »

I would have it include items dropped by corrupted players.

For me, I think the idea is to give players a chance to recover stolen items and get revenge, not devalue the items. Trying to increase the risk a little, not decrease the reward.

I disagree. The corrupt player knew the risks of going corrupt and still chose to do so. Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

For the corrupted thing, it's not as much about the corrupted player being able to get the stuff back as much as it's about random players running in and taking the items.

tinukeda

mcstackerson wrote: »

For the corrupted thing, it's not as much about the corrupted player being able to get the stuff back as much as it's about random players running in and taking the items.

Oh so resources taken? That already devalues every time there's a death, so encouraging people to kill to get it back would just delete even more of the items.

Thinking further on "flag if you loot": seems like this could be exploited: 'decoy' character dies intentionally in order to tempt others to loot and then their waiting buddies jump the looter. Basically getting to rob the looter for free?

Ebro Epaito

/agree it should flag you for a period of time.....

mcstackerson

tinukeda wrote: »

mcstackerson wrote: »

For the corrupted thing, it's not as much about the corrupted player being able to get the stuff back as much as it's about random players running in and taking the items.

Oh so resources taken? That already devalues every time there's a death, so encouraging people to kill to get it back would just delete even more of the items.

Thinking further on "flag if you loot": seems like this could be exploited: 'decoy' character dies intentionally in order to tempt others to loot and then their waiting buddies jump the looter. Basically getting to rob the looter for free?

On the corrupted front, the scenario is you kill a corrupted player and someone else runs up and takes the loot. I don't think that's fair, and if people want to continue to fight over the loot, they should be able to.

On your second paragraph, I think if you choose to loot a player's corpse, you are choosing to steal from them. If you get baited by this system, you deserve it. They are robbing the robber.

Arya_Yeshe

tinukeda wrote: »

Instead of flagging the looter how about making it extremely difficult to sell or use the items instead?
I assume you're talking about resources, not actual items which only drop off of red/corrupt players.

no, that not cool for the game and not fun, there shouldn't be more chores and more hurdles at all but more outcomes instead

Arya_Yeshe

mcstackerson wrote: »

I don't think this is too hot of a take but I think if someone takes items off another player's corpse, it should flag them.

To take this idea further, I think the perfect implementation of this system would have it so that any item that is looted from another player is tagged as "stolen." I think this should include completed items dropped by corrupted players. If you have a stolen item in your inventory, you are flagged for pvp. If you are killed, you drop all stolen items. In my head, the stolen flag would be removed if the item is put into storage or returned to its original owner.

I agree with you, but the guys in Intrepid who put together the ideas of the flagging system are not real pvp or real players, they are just carebears who want to cut wood in the forest and never get attacked by anyone... this is why the flagging system is based oncarebear hatred instead of being based on fun and logic

Morgalf

agreed

mcstackerson

Arya_Yeshe wrote: »

mcstackerson wrote: »

I don't think this is too hot of a take but I think if someone takes items off another player's corpse, it should flag them.

To take this idea further, I think the perfect implementation of this system would have it so that any item that is looted from another player is tagged as "stolen." I think this should include completed items dropped by corrupted players. If you have a stolen item in your inventory, you are flagged for pvp. If you are killed, you drop all stolen items. In my head, the stolen flag would be removed if the item is put into storage or returned to its original owner.

I agree with you, but the guys in Intrepid who put together the ideas of the flagging system are not real pvp or real players, they are just carebears who want to cut wood in the forest and never get attacked by anyone... this is why the flagging system is based oncarebear hatred instead of being based on fun and logic

I disagree

I've played with the devs and I know they are pvpers. Some of them are extremely bloodthirsty. The flagging system was always about encouraging people to have a reason to take a risk on a kill and avoid a situation where you instantly attack everyone you see.

They modeled the current system closely after one from another game, and I think the core is good, it just needs to be tweaked.

mainedutch

Arya_Yeshe wrote: »

mcstackerson wrote: »

I don't think this is too hot of a take but I think if someone takes items off another player's corpse, it should flag them.

To take this idea further, I think the perfect implementation of this system would have it so that any item that is looted from another player is tagged as "stolen." I think this should include completed items dropped by corrupted players. If you have a stolen item in your inventory, you are flagged for pvp. If you are killed, you drop all stolen items. In my head, the stolen flag would be removed if the item is put into storage or returned to its original owner.

I agree with you, but the guys in Intrepid who put together the ideas of the flagging system are not real pvp or real players, they are just carebears who want to cut wood in the forest and never get attacked by anyone... this is why the flagging system is based oncarebear hatred instead of being based on fun and logic

Judging that the flagging system is far from completed (and ignoring the fact you actually haven't played the game --- you don't have 'alpha two' next to your name, so you can't lie about it either), your opinion is super moot.

Also, Steven is designing this game based on ArcheAge, one of the greatest PvP MMOs out there.

If you can't wrap your head around the idea that killing people for sake of killing people is griefing and that corruption makes you think twice before engaging in PvP, you're a griefer. There's no argument.

There are tons of PvP events available where people are automatically flagged that you can attack.

And it seems some people are becoming confused: the idea here is not that you get corrupted for looting peoples' corpses, you simply become flagged for PvP as a combatant, which lets others attack you freely.

Vhaeyne

mainedutch wrote: »

Go to 11:01:45 on this interview with Steven from only 2 days ago: https://twitch.tv/videos/2298227762

Steven describes PvP flagging will be implemented for looting corpses, along with a lot of other stuff.

"If you do loot that body after a successful time you will be flagged and become a valid target for PvP."

This is the way it should be. Risk vs. reward. You might want to think twice about taking someone's stuff!

I listened to this early today and again just now.

I missed the part where he said he has a concept where you could be flagged for a "short time" after looting some body's.

This disappoints me, but it may be interesting if this all interacts with the bag system well. Which is something I have never seen him talk about before.

My feedback is still the same. I don't think you should flag for looting other players ever.

mcstackerson

Vhaeyne wrote: »

mainedutch wrote: »

Go to 11:01:45 on this interview with Steven from only 2 days ago: https://twitch.tv/videos/2298227762

Steven describes PvP flagging will be implemented for looting corpses, along with a lot of other stuff.

"If you do loot that body after a successful time you will be flagged and become a valid target for PvP."

This is the way it should be. Risk vs. reward. You might want to think twice about taking someone's stuff!

I listened to this early today and again just now.

I missed the part where he said he has a concept where you could be flagged for a "short time" after looting some body's.

This disappoints me, but it may be interesting if this all interacts with the bag system well. Which is something I have never seen him talk about before.

My feedback is still the same. I don't think you should flag for looting other players ever.

11:03:25 is where he talks about the flagging thing. Bag progression he starts talking about at 11:03:00

Sorry if I'm making you repeat yourself but why don't you think someone should be flagged for stealing from someone's corpse?

Noaani

mcstackerson wrote: »

Sorry if I'm making you repeat yourself but why don't you think someone should be flagged for stealing from someone's corpse?

For me (not speaking for Vhaeyne, but imagine it's similar), looting a corpse like this creates player friction. The fact that two threads like this exist tells us all that it does indeed create friction.

To me, the best solutuon would be putting a 0.5 second channel on looting a corpse, giving people bags that doubles the time it takes for people not in their group to loot their corpse if they are killed, and give a guild perk that doubles the time it takes for people nor in your guild to loot corpses your guild members have killed.

That way, if some random player comes along and loots a corpse, you at least have yourself to blame a little bit, but it will still happen frequently enough to be that point of friction.

Vhaeyne

mcstackerson wrote: »

Sorry if I'm making you repeat yourself but why don't you think someone should be flagged for stealing from someone's corpse?

No worry's,

I covered this in the other thread on the topic, but I will try to distill it down better here.

It is mostly the idea that you "could" sneak in there and steal stuff without being seen. Like the Risk vs Reward of someone actually having to see you. The temptation at play for the would be thief.

If the game forces you purple it kind of rats you out. If feels to me like force flagging would be an over reaction that removes some of the temptation to steal. The more difficult the crime the less likely people are to do crimes.

I think it would be better if people were more tempted to create player friction of their own.

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