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Loot systems

NikaiNikai Member
edited September 2020 in General Discussion
What are some loot systems people would be keen to see in AoC? I've come from WoW and master loot was their best system for raiding and the visual confirmation of rolling when ina small group was always a decent system imo but I'd like to hear if there is a better way

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    GrievousnessGrievousness Member
    We kind of already had this discussion and it was terrible.
    Have fun reading:
    https://forums.ashesofcreation.com/discussion/45283/loot-system/p1

    (Honestly don't read it if you aren't a masochist.)
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    Great BraeGreat Brae Member
    Nikai wrote: »
    What are some loot systems people would be keen to see in AoC? I've come from WoW and master loot was their best system for raiding and the visual confirmation of rolling when ina small group was always a decent system imo but I'd like to hear if there is a better way

    I actually like WoW's personal loot better, had too many run in's with ninja master looters.

    I prefer click on corpse looting then looting things that randomly pops up on the ground after a kill.
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    NikaiNikai Member
    Yeah from what i read on the last discussion I think we definitely just need options. Master loot and need before greed rolls are all i think we really need but i can see plenty of people arguing for personal loot too, especially in pug raid situations.

    And yeah click on corpse is preferable to diablo arpg style, i feel like this area could maybe use some creative work though. If it feels like looting in WoW im gonna be a bit disappointed, in that we've been using that system for decades. Anyone have any ideas on how it could be improved?
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    WarthWarth Member
    edited September 2020
    It has been already confirmed that there won't be any type of personal loot in Ashes. It's a game about community, looting is a big part of that.

    The secret is to simply not join a group with a loot master you don't trust. Demand them to change it to a fair system or leave the party.

    Ashes will have a couple of different loot distribution options:
    • Master Loot
    • Need/Greed
    • Round Robin
    • FFA
    • Auction System
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    TragnarTragnar Member
    Personally I despise Personal loot, because it completely eradicates social interactions after killing a boss. I am really glad that Ashes wants to have these social interactions, even though they can result in a very bad and negative experience.

    Trick is to find people that you can trust and have fun with. Every time I play I put people like this into ignore list and never allow them to group up with me again. Doesn't mean I want to prevent them from doing these things, because that will cheapen the trust in the players I'll be playing with.
    “Ignorance, the root and stem of all evil.”

    ― Plato
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    NikaiNikai Member
    I feel that, some of the most fun ive had is when it comes down to rolling on the loot, with or without a game system assisting and seeing rolling a 99 to beat your mates, or losing/winning a roll by 1
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    insomniainsomnia Member
    I remember i was in a dungeon and at the last boss, the tank and leader of the group, had changed the loot system to master loot, without us knowing. He claimed to link all the items that dropped, so we could roll on it. But he had also said the boss could drop an item he wanted. Or my friend told me the boss might drop an item he also wanted. They were both warriors,
    I prefer a need/greed. But that can also be exploited. I once was in a group, in swtor, where a guy needed on everything. His excuse was he needed money... I told him everybody does. I have also tried where one needed for an alt. I told him i had all the classes, so with that excuse, i could need on everything
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    NikaiNikai Member
    edited September 2020
    insomnia wrote: »
    I remember i was in a dungeon and at the last boss, the tank and leader of the group, had changed the loot system to master loot, without us knowing. He claimed to link all the items that dropped, so we could roll on it. But he had also said the boss could drop an item he wanted. Or my friend told me the boss might drop an item he also wanted. They were both warriors,
    I prefer a need/greed. But that can also be exploited. I once was in a group, in swtor, where a guy needed on everything. His excuse was he needed money... I told him everybody does. I have also tried where one needed for an alt. I told him i had all the classes, so with that excuse, i could need on everything

    Sorry to hear about your negative experiences, everyone has them but if you learn from it and clearly lay out the loot rules at the start its not an issue. If someone in a pug is being shady and trying to say they have to have master loot, it is up to you to determine the validity of that players claim. Do you trust them? Why do you trust them? Video game decisions mirroring that of real life is an art form. Risk vs Reward would be nothing without Risk.
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    TragnarTragnar Member
    Trying to control player behavior is what led WoW to being more shit with every year. Don't try to invent systems that should protect players from negative interactions, they are part of life and it doesn't matter if it is fictional, online or in the real world
    “Ignorance, the root and stem of all evil.”

    ― Plato
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    CaerylCaeryl Member
    Just remove Master Loot and leave the rest of the options. High Bid should be the default so at least everyone in the raid walks away with something for their time.
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    PandiumPandium Member, Settler, Kickstarter
    Caeryl wrote: »
    Just remove Master Loot and leave the rest of the options. High Bid should be the default so at least everyone in the raid walks away with something for their time.

    +1
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    KhronusKhronus Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    I always see people dreading master looter because of bad situations they encountered. From my perspective, people expect too much. Joining a guild, getting to know them, developing your own community of "good" people.....that's what this is all about. If someone is playing the game for 1's and 0's, they are trash. The 1's and 0's will flow endlessly through proper leadership.

    The way I run my guild loot is quite simple. I am the master looter. Each class has a class officer who is in charge of loot for their specific class. If a tank item drops, the tank class officer decides where it goes based on their discussions with the raiders of that class. Ranger and rogue item drops, class officers can figure out where it goes that would benefit the group the most. An item that gives someone a 10 dps increase vs someone getting a 200 dps increase would clearly go to the 200dps increase. Common sense and being a decent person will always win with me.

    "Me me me" does not work. Those people get kicked. Toxic people get kicked. Players who want to work as a team and understand the need for progression from all are who profit and have fun. I went from having people say why they deserve the gear to people saying "send it to XXXX, this should boost his dps a ton" and "player XXXX gets that piece because they haven't received anything this week". Super quick explanation and I send it. I can't fathom doing ML in a guild with just one leader who decides where it goes.....or having people just roll need all the time. Barbaric.

    Most people won't understand this and that's ok. Those are the ones who get kicked haha.
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    RhaelahRhaelah Member
    Caeryl wrote: »
    High Bid should be the default so at least everyone in the raid walks away with something for their time.

    I like the idea of a "high bid" option. Idk if thats the same as "auction system" like @Warth said, but its new and interesting.
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    GrievousnessGrievousness Member
    KHRONUS wrote: »
    . From my perspective, people expect too much.

    This is over 9000% right.
    Most people in the MMO playerbase never have to hand out loot.
    It's probably for the best because most don't want any responsibility anyway.
    They have zero clue what it is like or only know it from pugs which can always result in a bad experience.

    Also most people don't actually think about how likely it is to get an item in a raid.
    If you for example have a 40 man party and a boss drops 2 item pieces you need 20 kills until you could split equally.
    What that means is that it isn't even unlikely to raid for even weeks without item progress.
    And we are not even talking about the quality of the items......

    Frankly, it literally does not matter if you have a fair loot distribution anyways.
    There is always one guy crying over exactly nothing and this guy is usually the first to quit over nothing which is why he won't get loot anyway.
    Eventually ending up on a forum raging over it for ages.
    Rhaelah wrote: »
    I like the idea of a "high bid" option. Idk if thats the same as "auction system" like @Warth said, but its new and interesting.

    Actually it is not new but pretty old, people already did it back in Wotlk ( roughly 2010 ) using master looter.
    It just didn't become popular because it is more reliable to have someone pay for a boost than hoping that the bids will end up high enough to get you some cash.
    It is not an entirely bad system, it is just not good enough to justify using it.
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