What would make a perfect endgame?

I just wanna see what the ashes community has to say. In my perfect endgame it would be something with fighting over territory or rising up against the biggest guild something along like in game politics that would bring together the community as a whole for like a big event. Something memorable

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Javionn

Noaani wrote: »

Javionn wrote: »

So basically you’re saying that the game is gonna be a race to monopolization.

I'm saying top end open world content is.

While it is fun to think that the rest of the server would come together to stop you, this isn't really something that actually happens.

The best thing players can ask for is that the developers place limitations on how much content can be monopolized, and how much more powerful the people that monopolize that content can get.

With a game that’s solely focusing on traveling on foot and limited fast travel, I’m positive that there will be some sort of server event that would lead to “KoS if you see these guys.” You’re right it’s almost unlikely for a server to do this but if they’re focusing on social interaction I can safely say that people will do this. You’re gonna have guilds come together for a one time thing you’re gonna have people talk about you, you will build a bad reputation as a guild which will lead to something like that, Atleast that’s what I’d expect. If It was me, I would be talking to guild leaders and random people I see on the roads to come for that guild that takes the fun away from us.. but that’s only my assumptions and ideas.

Noaani

Javionn wrote: »

With a game that’s solely focusing on traveling on foot and limited fast travel, I’m positive that there will be some sort of server event that would lead to “KoS if you see these guys.” You’re right it’s almost unlikely for a server to do this but if they’re focusing on social interaction I can safely say that people will do this. You’re gonna have guilds come together for a one time thing you’re gonna have people talk about you, you will build a bad reputation as a guild which will lead to something like that, Atleast that’s what I’d expect. If It was me, I would be talking to guild leaders and random people I see on the roads to come for that guild that takes the fun away from us.. but that’s only my assumptions and ideas.

That isn't going to happen, because of the lack of fast travel.

If me and my guild were forced to travel by foot/mount, and everyone else was able to port around, then I could see the possibility of an attempt at this. A slim possibility, but a possibility nontheless.

However, with these people wanting to chase us down also not having fast travel, I can't see them even bothering. This is especially true when you consider that the content we would have a monopoly on is the only non-node means of gaining a flying mount.

I can see some people attempting to stop us at the content itself, this will happen basially every spawn. However, the closest thing they can have to success is if the encounters have a despawn mechanic and they are able to stop us getting a kill.

However, since by that point our goal would be preventing others getting the rewards, rather than getting them for ourselves, we would consider that a win for us.

Ostaff

George Black wrote: »

Yearly expansions.
5 lv cap increase
New/rebalanced abilities
New gear tier
New epic world boss
New zones
New raid bosses
1-2 new instanced content
New siegable castle

One grand, new system every 2 years

I agree with Vhaeyne, I hate level increase creap. Instead they should do a more horizontal move in that they open up brand new zones the make your old skills mostly useless and causing you to learn new skills to do well in that zone. Ie. New damage types that need new types of resistances and mobs have immunities or high resistances to other zones damage types. Magics debuffs and etc. So in a simple example, a Lava zone that greatly reduces all "water" based damage, and most the creatures are basically immune to fire damage, its lava not water so water mounts and ships that were previously used are worthless they will need to supply themselves with lava resistant ships. The mobs deal "lava" damage so players will need to outfit themselves with lava resistant apparel and maybe "earth" type damage for injuring the creatures? As I said, this is a very simple example, but hopefully you can see where I am trying to take it

Make your elite uber level character feel like a newbie again without actually hindering all the other players in the other zones, keeping "item" degeneration that reduces the value of "older" items out of the ball game cause the items needed in the new world really don't hinder the items from the older zones as they are just "different" not "more powerful".

Noaani

Ostaff wrote: »

I agree with Vhaeyne, I hate level increase creap. Instead they should do a more horizontal move in that they open up brand new zones the make your old skills mostly useless and causing you to learn new skills to do well in that zone. Ie. New damage types that need new types of resistances and mobs have immunities or high resistances to other zones damage types.

How is this any different to adding horizontal progression?

I mean, in both cases your old abilities are just as strong on the old content, but not effective on the new content. In both cases you need to learn new abilities to be able to take on the content, and you need to acquire new gear in order to be able to survive against it.

I mean, you are literally saying you want virtival progression, you just don't want it to be called that.

Ostaff wrote: »

Make your elite uber level character feel like a newbie again without actually hindering all the other players in the other zones, keeping "item" degeneration that reduces the value of "older" items out of the ball game

This isn't a consequence of vertical progression, it is a consequence of shit developers.

I agree that I don't want this either. That is why I don't play games made by shit developers.

Javionn

Noaani wrote: »

Javionn wrote: »

With a game that’s solely focusing on traveling on foot and limited fast travel, I’m positive that there will be some sort of server event that would lead to “KoS if you see these guys.” You’re right it’s almost unlikely for a server to do this but if they’re focusing on social interaction I can safely say that people will do this. You’re gonna have guilds come together for a one time thing you’re gonna have people talk about you, you will build a bad reputation as a guild which will lead to something like that, Atleast that’s what I’d expect. If It was me, I would be talking to guild leaders and random people I see on the roads to come for that guild that takes the fun away from us.. but that’s only my assumptions and ideas.

That isn't going to happen, because of the lack of fast travel.

If me and my guild were forced to travel by foot/mount, and everyone else was able to port around, then I could see the possibility of an attempt at this. A slim possibility, but a possibility nontheless.

However, with these people wanting to chase us down also not having fast travel, I can't see them even bothering. This is especially true when you consider that the content we would have a monopoly on is the only non-node means of gaining a flying mount.

I can see some people attempting to stop us at the content itself, this will happen basially every spawn. However, the closest thing they can have to success is if the encounters have a despawn mechanic and they are able to stop us getting a kill.

However, since by that point our goal would be preventing others getting the rewards, rather than getting them for ourselves, we would consider that a win for us.

I’m willing to give this a go in the server I play regardless of the ups and downs. I like challenges and this will only make me want to bring you down even more 😆so whatever happens I’m willing to try for the hell of it.

Noaani

Javionn wrote: »

I’m willing to give this a go in the server I play regardless of the ups and downs. I like challenges and this will only make me want to bring you down even more 😆so whatever happens I’m willing to try for the hell of it.

Oh, there are always a few people willing to give it a go, and some of them even actually do give it a go.

The thing is, you need dozens, if not hundreds of people. More to the point, you need them at the exact right time. If you are 10 minutes late getting there, we are gone.

I've yet to see the level of organization needed to pull this off exist outside of a guild. More power to you if you pull it off, but in the mean time it would perhaps be in your best interests to agree with me that it would be good if the people you were wanting to fight like this were only able to get one tier of gear above everyone else, not two tiers.

PlagueMonk

This might sound like a bit of a broken record (since i have mentioned parts of this in various other threads) but.....

1) NO level cap increase. Once you get to 50 (or whatever the cap is) it will stay there. Period. I find it absolutely silly that every year or so you completely render all that hard earned gear useless, forcing you to go get the same shit again only better in dungeons that are artificially created just to hold this new gear. WoW is a prime example of this and was ultimately what made me quit playing.

I would much rather have all those same endgame dungeons ALWAYS be a challenge.

2) Have a lateral progression system after reaching cap level similar to DAoC, WAR or ESO. ESO has a much more robust system than the other two called the Champion system .

These passive abilities are small but over time can increase your skills significantly. Maybe enough to equal 1-2 actual levels but not enough to render endgame content trivial. So having a lot of points invested in lateral progression could help make that endgame content a bit easier but that's it.

3) Have something worth fighting for. In DAoC it was a place called Darkness Falls. If you controlled the RvR map, your realm gained access to DF, a deep dungeon filled with the best stuff and required more than just 1 raid to tackle some of the content at the very bottom. This is an extremely simplistic description so I would encourage you to google it. DF was what kept me coming back to DAoC for many years.

A similar concept could be implemented in AoC, either through the node system or city system. The top node/city could gain access to something like DF but there would need to be some way to allow it to change hands often so it's competitive on a daily basis.

P0NCH0

Hard AF raids would be the perfect endgame.

Nagash

Me becoming a world boss would be great

Zyfrig

For me true endgame is about community, not content.

Ideally there is a (soft) capped equal playing field at the top where what really counts is not how for you've progressed into the game but in the way you actually play it and how much of an impact you make on your friends and foes. Becoming renowned for your deeds over time because they affect other players or the world in memorable ways, even if just on a small or even individual scale. You may become known for the best trade deals, the most off-meta builds that are succesful in their niche, the most effective PvP group, the most steady PvE successes etc etc. To make a name for yourself in the area you wish to specialize in.

I believe it's possible for the game to support and even stimulate this social renown in various ways. At the end of the day this -to me- is what an MMO is all about. Interacting with other real players in a lasting and meaningful way. Of course, the game mechanics will have to remain somewhat enticing, but if the world does not 'feel' socially alive, it won't really matter.

Arkethos

One thing that really kept me going in FFXI was the ability to switch jobs (main & sub), exploring new classes, trying new combos or filling necessary roles in raids. It was as on-the-fly as FFXIV (which I feel is too convenient), but it was nice to have my same character and not need to switch to some alt when I wanted/needed to try something different.

End game for me in FFXI was about getting various classes to max level and getting the gear for those classes to then be a dynamic asset for my guild. I essentially did the same sort of thing in WoW, but had to do it with multiple characters due to static class assignment.

While I’d like to see AOC allow for class changing, it should be something that requires you to be in your home so that it’s “cost” is based on location and travel time.

I don’t know that the level cap increase is the most creative or constructive way to add to end game enjoyment. It is usually just a time sink, rather than something that actually delivers for the player. It also makes returning players (took a break for school or military for example) feel significantly behind if they were at the level cap and now have a bunch of grinding to do just to get back to where they were. The one saving grace here is that it was mentioned on stream that there is no damage-level penalty when attacking things higher than you. So the skill of a player still has value, rather than just the number next to their portrait.

Crafting consumables and high end desirable items always has a place in my heart. An expansive system that doesn’t constantly move the goal posts (level cap), but rather one that becomes more about quality and depth over time. Strengthens you character’s reputation as a supplier of goods and services, and the more you put into it, the more you’d get out of it. I’d like to run an Inn out of the main city areas that is somewhat of a crossroads or staging point for people doing resource gathering, dungeon runs or whatever. Somehow being an oasis for the weary, a gathering point for the bold or a hideout for those on the run.

City building and defending the home. I feel it’s not only in the journey, but maintaining a foothold in a region so as not to be knocked out of standing by a rival city within the node, that makes it worthwhile. The fragility or impermanence of the node system will hopefully keep us engaged. Not to mention being raided by a sieging guild. This builds community by investment of time and resources towards a common goal... and can lead to epic shifts in power and influence depending on how player counts and activity levels may change over time.

Vhaeyne

Arkethos wrote: »

One thing that really kept me going in FFXI was the ability to switch jobs (main & sub), exploring new classes, trying new combos or filling necessary roles in raids. It was as on-the-fly as FFXIV (which I feel is too convenient), but it was nice to have my same character and not need to switch to some alt when I wanted/needed to try something different.

End game for me in FFXI was about getting various classes to max level and getting the gear for those classes to then be a dynamic asset for my guild. I essentially did the same sort of thing in WoW, but had to do it with multiple characters due to static class assignment.

While I’d like to see AOC allow for class changing, it should be something that requires you to be in your home so that it’s “cost” is based on location and travel time.

I don’t know that the level cap increase is the most creative or constructive way to add to end game enjoyment. It is usually just a time sink, rather than something that actually delivers for the player. It also makes returning players (took a break for school or military for example) feel significantly behind if they were at the level cap and now have a bunch of grinding to do just to get back to where they were. The one saving grace here is that it was mentioned on stream that there is no damage-level penalty when attacking things higher than you. So the skill of a player still has value, rather than just the number next to their portrait.

Crafting consumables and high end desirable items always has a place in my heart. An expansive system that doesn’t constantly move the goal posts (level cap), but rather one that becomes more about quality and depth over time. Strengthens you character’s reputation as a supplier of goods and services, and the more you put into it, the more you’d get out of it. I’d like to run an Inn out of the main city areas that is somewhat of a crossroads or staging point for people doing resource gathering, dungeon runs or whatever. Somehow being an oasis for the weary, a gathering point for the bold or a hideout for those on the run.

City building and defending the home. I feel it’s not only in the journey, but maintaining a foothold in a region so as not to be knocked out of standing by a rival city within the node, that makes it worthwhile. The fragility or impermanence of the node system will hopefully keep us engaged. Not to mention being raided by a sieging guild. This builds community by investment of time and resources towards a common goal... and can lead to epic shifts in power and influence depending on how player counts and activity levels may change over time.

As someone who has played FFXI and FFXIV. I have to say that multiple jobs per character would not work in Ashes. It should never be seriously considered for a game with open world PvP.

Part of what ruins both FFXIV and FFXI is that everyone can, and does do everything. Sure it is convenient that I can swap over to tank or healer, and head back out the dungeon in a pinch, but this also creates a expectation that everyone should be able to do this. It is not enough to have just PLD capped and geared. You end up Needing DRK and WAR too just in case. (why not? the gear sets are so close anyway.)

In open world PvP this could be catastrophic because once one Job is doing better in the meta everyone is playing it for months on end. When it comes to crafting it would be even worst. Everyone doing everything would ruin the economy.

With an expected leveling speed of 4-6 hours a day for 40 days. Most people are not, and should not want to make many alts. The idea is to keep people so invested in their main that they don't care about alts. When you have to resort to making alts you are just board with the game. It is you not enjoying the game enough on one job to so you switch to try and mine out more fun from other areas of the game. It should be seen as the failure of game design it is, and not something to be encouraged as a feature.

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