Not really feeling the whole front flip Dwarfs...

I understand Intrepid is taking its own direction on races and lore for Ashes...Perhaps not trying to fall into fantasy tropes or intellectual property thresholds.

But logically speaking I don't feel a mountain carving and tunneling race (Dünir) would jump flip... "Stoic and stout" seems more rotund, staunch and stocky... a 'regular' jump with perhaps a dodge roll seems a better fit.

(Verbal NDA lifted personal experience alpha tester, So actual hands on impression of the race as it currently being offered)

The islander dwarfs/halflings (Niküa) might seem fine with such athleticism.

I hope Intreprid might already have such details in the pipeline but just not implemented yet.

If not I hope they might reconsider the Jump Flip for mountain dorfs...

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Shergrim

they should probably let go of their 20 year old EQ design choices and get with the times, it will only benefit them i'd wager! it's AoC and not EQ

RocketFarmer

Suggest: Swap the front flip for a jump or slide that uproots the earth, creating difficult terrain for the opponent. Or just let them slide between the legs of the opponent.

For jumping gaps let them use their weapon or shield as a kind of pole vault to gain a little more height and distance.

When sprinting downhill they should be more prone to tumbling, knocking over friend and foe due to the momentum of their small, yet denser proportions.

When sprinting uphill, dwarves should have a slight advantage, especially in caves.

In general, dwarves should be better at moving forward than running away.

Gimlog

What about the acrobatic jump when in character creation you make a skinny dwarf and once a certain marker of muscles/fat is paste you get a more heavier jump ?
Don't seem to hard to implement later on in the development.

Uncommon Sense

My Solution was simple.

Dunir: Heavy set swing arm jump.

Nikua: Flippy pygmies.

Nagash

Uncommon Sense wrote: »

My Solution was simple.

Dunir: Heavy set swing arm jump.

Nikua: Flippy pygmies.

They have to have Tiki masks

Uncommon Sense

The other significant yet overlooked issue with the flip jump is how does it it effect pvp hit boxes?

Does the flip jump prevent head shots?

If there is a perceived pvp advantage by selecting the smallest race due to hitbox detection advantages and then have a jump skill prevent head shots when jumping...The PVP playing field will not look great.

Yes Nagash Tiki masks and other cosmetics* are fine

Khronus

I very much dislike the dwarf flips.

Songcaller

The main issue I see is combat effectiveness for the Front Flips. In most racial cases they can jump forward, turn back in mid-jump and still maintain forward movement, and thus, enable a Parthian shot tactic (shooting while moving in a different direction due to jumps ((Like WoW)), but the Dwarven Flip prevents the same dynamic Range in terms of Parthian Shots and kiting. You would find it difficult to perform Parthian Shots/Kite Melee characters and fight at the same time with the front flips. I hope I make sense. In effect, the Dwarves are gimped by the front flips in terms of combat effectiveness. I hope the Parthian Shot makes it to the full game but I would hope all races with ranged parameters would be able to perform the Parthian Shot rather than most being able but not all.

Zeshio

I mean tighter, thicker muscle tends to lend itself to short, strong bursts of energy, vs. lean muscle which is more for endurance. So if a dwarf is packed with muscle, it's actually somewhat reasonable to believe they could jump pretty dang well.

Uncommon Sense

Neurath wrote: »

The main issue I see is combat effectiveness for the Front Flips. In most racial cases they can jump forward, turn back in mid-jump and still maintain forward movement, and thus, enable a Parthian shot tactic (shooting while moving in a different direction due to jumps ((Like WoW)), but the Dwarven Flip prevents the same dynamic Range in terms of Parthian Shots and kiting. You would find it difficult to perform Parthian Shots/Kite Melee characters and fight at the same time with the front flips. I hope I make sense. In effect, the Dwarves are gimped by the front flips in terms of combat effectiveness. I hope the Parthian Shot makes it to the full game but I would hope all races with ranged parameters would be able to perform the Parthian Shot rather than most being able but not all.

Another Interesting consequence of a flip jump...I thought hit boxes were an serious issue, but hadn't even considered attacks with a bow/ranged while jumping or jump turn re face kiting. I cant remember if momentum is maintained while jump turning or if mid air jump redirection is a thing...but yeah that make the flip a whole other issue entirely appreciate that insight @Zeshio

Conrad

Flips are stupid af on dwarves. They aren't elves, they are walking tanks for gods sake xP

ThexBlackxKnight

The flipping makes Dunir Dwarves look silly , whimsical, gnome like...

Saedu

I don't play dwarf classes very often, but when I tried one and saw the flip I thought it was AWESOME!

Maezriel

I can suspend my disbelief for front flipping Dwarves. I do think it shouldn't be an every single jump thing but it's not as immersion breaking as somethings I've seen in video games

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ev0IsH3sSOw

Ventharien

Shergrim wrote: »

shitty take as usual
you seem to only care for the devs vision and not what the actual players want..it's a recipe for disaster...is this why you no longer work for activision!?

Because the dev's vision is the only thing that matters. As that's what will be done. If players bring up a point they agree with, then that's the new thing that matters. If that's a problem for you, there's a wide range of other games to play.

Dygz

At least this is a quick and easy fix if the devs decide to remove the flip.
I don't think there needs to be much justification for why you don't like the flip.
But, the reasons people are giving to support why the flip should be removed, like Middle Earth Dwarves never flipped when they jumped or stoic people would never jump or stout people can't jump aren't valid.

How a person casts a Fireball mid-flip might be valid.
But, again, I don't think it will take that much to convince the devs to remove a flip from a jump.

Nerror

The front flip is fine considering how the Dunir currently look like gnomes.

If the devs listen to player feedback and make them look wider and beefier, I think they should remove the front flip. If they don't, and insist on keeping the Dunir as is, I am ok with the gnome flip.

Sholer

Hey people Where did you see the flipping dwarfs? Is there a video or something?

RocketFarmer

No video with the NDA in place.

Jamation

Sholer wrote: »

Hey people Where did you see the flipping dwarfs? Is there a video or something?

I'm not sure if this is what everyone's been referring to, but there is a jump flip in one of their older videos on their YouTube channel. Whether it's changed or not I'm not sure since I've never picked dwarves:

The flip in question occurs around 33:31

https://youtube.com/watch?v=8WQ_BBwK5LA

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