24/7 pvp during guild/node wars

Thanks to Jahlon's clarification of this on discord

I wanna hear forum people's opinions on this design choice. For me this is literally the best news I've heard about Ashes in the past 2 years of me following the game. This literally makes the game L3 for me.

But what is yall's take on this? Do you think this would push people away from joining guilds? Do you think this could lead to very bad experiences for casual players whose Mayor decided to declare a war on a stronger node?

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Noaani

The two questions I would then want to know is - how long do these wars last - and are they by mutual consent or not.

Ludullu

Noaani wrote: »

The two questions I would then want to know is - how long do these wars last - and are they by mutual consent or not.

I think it's over when you've done the task during prime-time, so quite likely it's a 1-2 day thing. Unless Intrepid go real hardcore and make the tasks so damn hard that it takes either side weeks to complete it.

For guild wars there's a way to surrender, though I think there's some cost to it too (as well as declaration), so it won't be just a "dec whoever you want at any moment w/o any price on your side".

For nodes though, it seems as if Mayors can just declare them. Or at least I don't think we've heard concrete details on this point.

But this is definitely something that's gotta be tested extensively during alpha2, cause I can definitely see how maaaaaaany people would hate this design.

MainQuestt

very very very interesting I liked it !!

Mag7spy

This is pretty much how i expected it to be, but yes some people will avoid places that war a lot. It was the same in BDO they would just stay guildless but it means they get less perks. There is no reason in a game that has pvp to not have wars and such, then it just be a pve game plus corruption system.

Ludullu

Otr wrote: »

I do not know how to define casual in the context of AoC.

I'd say purely in this context, it'd be someone who just wants to do their non-pvx activity (of which there are many). One could argue that the whole premise of the game is that pretty much every activity in the game is pvx, but at that point we have a game with 0 appeal to casuals, cause a mad Mayor could always fuck up that casual's entire livelihood. And the Mayor in question could be on either side of the war too, so it's not like you could easily vote him out.

Warth

I just hope that there isn't any artificially set time limit. There should only be 3 ways out of the war:

One side wins
One side surrenders
Both sides agree to a ceasefire

Dygz

You can quit a guild if you don't want to participate in 24/7 PvP during a guild war.
Might even be able to re-join afterwards, depending on how casual the guild is.

Okeydoke

I think it's really good news. Still some unanswered questions about the system, like if mutual consent between warring guilds is required, the cost to declare war, and how easy or consequential it will be for people to drop guild to avoid a war.

But extremely good news either way. The idea that guild/node wars would only be during primetime never sat right with me.

Dygz

Otr wrote: »

I was reading on wiki that it will not be possible to play the game without PvP at all.

The actual dev quote is that it might be possible, but neither Steven or Jeffrey want to 100% guarantee an individual can do so.

But, yes, during a Guild War, members of those guilds are flagged a Combatant to each other until the war is over. During Node Wars, citizens of those Nodes are flagged a Combatant to each other until the war is over.

Hinotori

So happy they're going in this direction!

Nerror

Yeah this sounds like a good choice for guild and node wars. And I definitely also think a guild should be able to war-dec another guild in a non-consensual way. The cost of this should be based on several parameters like guild size, guild level, recent activity levels of all members, the levels of all the guild members, the amount of active wars both guilds are already active in, etc. All parameters should be weighted differently probably, and be paid daily to prevent guilds gaming the system by just war-dec'ing each other for some sort of protection.

Dolyem

Oh lawd I wonder how costly it will be for materials to declare guild wars. If its as simple as declaring hostilities, my gaming experience is going to be fantastic.

Dygz

Do you have a link for it?
It's been a few weeks since I listened to it and have had time to hunt down the link again.

Azherae

I think it would make certain random/casual non-cohesive guilds form less often.

I don't have a real opinion on whether or not they should or shouldn't form.

If anything I think it would go the other way, guilds would form, and the 'pressures' of 'not containing members that do things that other guilds find worthy of War Dec' might result in some people not being allowed to stay in their guilds.

No opinion on that either, really. Up to Steven what he wants to happen mostly and I'm fine either way.

I don't speak for my group in this post.

Sigtyr

In my opinion this is awesome. The more recreational PvP I can participate in the better. This should also help to placate the fears some people have about others going corrupt to gank them. Someone like me who PvPs mostly for fun is going to do this way more often than they flag on greens. Any time spent killing other guilds in a war is time not spent killing greens for resources.

Ludullu

Otr wrote: »

If on that map there are metropolises, then this smaller node must be quite far from the stronger node, as they are not siblings. Metropolises have a large zone of influence, over 20% of the map.
PvE players might want to move and live in larger safer nodes.

Even equal Lvl 3 nodes can still be neighbors (or very close to each other) even if they're vassals of different metropoli, due to how nodes can grow and weird shapes of other nodes around them. The simulation of nodes video showed a few lvl4 nodes directly next to lvl3 nodes, but they were vassals of different higher lvl nodes.

And telling PvE nodes from their preferred lands or from a land where they have a ton of good reputation and their own corner of the market and a good farming system setup could definitely make some people stop playing (that is if the alternative is dying every other hour because you're at war). Now, that might just be the design Steven wants to go with and is ok with consequences of, but we'll have to see how it pans out.

Sigtyr wrote: »

This should also help to placate the fears some people have about others going corrupt to gank them. Someone like me who PvPs mostly for fun is going to do this way more often than they flag on greens. Any time spent killing other guilds in a war is time not spent killing greens for resources.

That's the thing though. If you're a PvE player picking flowers in a node at war, the warring node's citizens can kill you w/o corrupting themselves. This is a much more aggressive system than the corruption one.

Dygz

Can't really have PvE Nodes.
It's possible to have unofficial PvE servers that have a relatively low amount of PvP combat.

Dygz

Otr wrote: »

Dygz wrote: »

Do you have a link for it?
It's been a few weeks since I listened to it and have had time to hunt down the link again.

Ashes of Creation is a PvX game. Players will naturally encounter both PvP and PvE elements.[95][96][97] It is unlikely that a player could purely focus on just PvP or just PvE.[97]
https://youtu.be/3UIqmWTGZ2k?t=2005

Haha!
Right! The question is about PvP, but Steven kinda answered for both PvP and PvE.
I'll have to try to remember that in the future when I need to find that link.
Thanks!

Mag7spy

If you only focus on pvp you aren't getting gear so its impossible to only focus on pvp that is pretty clear. OR if you have a guild war there are mobs around and there for you have to deal with pve and pvp.

Hinotori

Dygz wrote: »

Can't really have PvE Nodes.
It's possible to have unofficial PvE servers that have a relatively low amount of PvP combat.

This is what I foresee happening. I think the hard core PVE players will have to have their own community run server like RP players.

Those who pvp or don't care will just pick whatever server.

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