Before I get too Excited, PVP\PVE by Choice?

My question is, will pvp\pve be separated? Or will this be a forced pvp game?

From some of the videos I have been watching, it looks like you will have to pvp to maintain your housing. Is this the case or will there also be pve housing that is just where you go for some buildcraft?

Is the game open world pvp too, or can you choose to do some immersive questing or relaxing gathering without being ganked? Sometimes I like the intensity of pvp but I am a much bigger fan of immersive content.

Before the hardcore types get too judgy, I like the idea of a massive world with content to suit a large population so that the MMO-world feels beyond immense. Im not sure why developers have decided to cater to one small aspect of a game when this only leads to creating a game that seems small and finite, in both what a player can do in the game and how long the game can hold players' attention spans.

I have never had long queues for WvW, Arenas, or Battlegrounds so I never understand why developers are willing to lose such a large amount of revenue from players who do not want pvp, or only want to pvp on their terms.

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Azherae

Forced PvP, open world.

No safety except in one case that you must work quite heavily to get in the first place.

The Creative Director of the game would like to be unique and achieve a dream moreso than make more money.

You can be forced into PvP at basically any time. If you have questions about that, there's lots of resources to check, but 'quick version answer' is yes, if you have gathered items and I want them, I will kill you and take them.

Ludullu

Orobahn wrote: »

I have never had long queues for WvW, Arenas, or Battlegrounds so I never understand why developers are willing to lose such a large amount of revenue from players who do not want pvp, or only want to pvp on their terms.

Sometimes it's about making a game you wanna make and not just about making the most money

Orobahn

Thanks. That definitely answers my questions.

Kovrm

Well, hopefully you stay with us. I have a feeling the game isn't going to end up a gankfest. The community feels pretty balanced in terms of pvpers and pveers, and I think the direction that IS is wanting to take things will end up having pvp and pve players cooperating in various different ways.

a basic example, in my mind, would be pve people ask pvpers for security, or escorts of caravans. pvpers can have pveers crafting gear for them in return, etc etc.

Not a perfect example, but hopefully you get my point. While it is a PvX game, it has been stated many times that there will non-pvp oriented ways to progress thru the game, and have an actual impact on the world just the same.

SirChancelot

Orobahn wrote: »

My question is, will pvp\pve be separated? Or will this be a forced pvp game?

From some of the videos I have been watching, it looks like you will have to pvp to maintain your housing. Is this the case or will there also be pve housing that is just where you go for some buildcraft?

Is the game open world pvp too, or can you choose to do some immersive questing or relaxing gathering without being ganked? Sometimes I like the intensity of pvp but I am a much bigger fan of immersive content.

Before the hardcore types get too judgy, I like the idea of a massive world with content to suit a large population so that the MMO-world feels beyond immense. Im not sure why developers have decided to cater to one small aspect of a game when this only leads to creating a game that seems small and finite, in both what a player can do in the game and how long the game can hold players' attention spans.

I have never had long queues for WvW, Arenas, or Battlegrounds so I never understand why developers are willing to lose such a large amount of revenue from players who do not want pvp, or only want to pvp on their terms.

In the games defense there will be a system in place to minimize random murder

Dolyem

It's regulated murder. It will happen but it won't be a constant griefing thing.

Azherae

SirChancelot wrote: »

Orobahn wrote: »

My question is, will pvp\pve be separated? Or will this be a forced pvp game?

From some of the videos I have been watching, it looks like you will have to pvp to maintain your housing. Is this the case or will there also be pve housing that is just where you go for some buildcraft?

Is the game open world pvp too, or can you choose to do some immersive questing or relaxing gathering without being ganked? Sometimes I like the intensity of pvp but I am a much bigger fan of immersive content.

Before the hardcore types get too judgy, I like the idea of a massive world with content to suit a large population so that the MMO-world feels beyond immense. Im not sure why developers have decided to cater to one small aspect of a game when this only leads to creating a game that seems small and finite, in both what a player can do in the game and how long the game can hold players' attention spans.

I have never had long queues for WvW, Arenas, or Battlegrounds so I never understand why developers are willing to lose such a large amount of revenue from players who do not want pvp, or only want to pvp on their terms.

In the games defense there will be a system in place to minimize random murder

idk if it matters to you when you're addressing this type of post but this isn't convincing, and neither is 'there appear to be half PvEr and half PvPer claims.

It's just a numbers thing, Doves and Hawks, etc. The experience of players who don't want forced PvP is negatively affected by even 10% of the population being willing to kill them for any reason, far less resources.

Just noting that you're probably not as likely to convince anyone this way now that people have had these experiences for years (as OP seems to have).

Ludullu

Azherae wrote: »

Just noting that you're probably not as likely to convince anyone this way now that people have had these experiences for years (as OP seems to have).

My only problem with said experiences is that they're usually exist in faction-based games where there's no "pvp", there's only PK genocide, because it's encouraged by the game.

Now I definitely understand and agree with your point here, but I do think the mechanic might change some people's minds, if they try it out.

Taleof2Cities

Waiting for @Dygz to make a grand entrance and give perspective (as primarily a PvE player) ... but still likes what Ashes is doing.

Azherae

NiKr wrote: »

Azherae wrote: »

Just noting that you're probably not as likely to convince anyone this way now that people have had these experiences for years (as OP seems to have).

My only problem with said experiences is that they're usually exist in faction-based games where there's no "pvp", there's only PK genocide, because it's encouraged by the game.

Now I definitely understand and agree with your point here, but I do think the mechanic might change some people's minds, if they try it out.

Some yes, but in my limited game psychology experience, those people are not going to make the same complaint/post as the OP.

That's a response (to me) to people who 'start to complain the corruption system won't work'. Not those who 'want flagging'. Their goals are different.

Dygz

Orobahn wrote: »

My question is, will pvp\pve be separated? Or will this be a forced pvp game?

From some of the videos I have been watching, it looks like you will have to pvp to maintain your housing. Is this the case or will there also be pve housing that is just where you go for some buildcraft?

Is the game open world pvp too, or can you choose to do some immersive questing or relaxing gathering without being ganked? Sometimes I like the intensity of pvp but I am a much bigger fan of immersive content.

Before the hardcore types get too judgy, I like the idea of a massive world with content to suit a large population so that the MMO-world feels beyond immense. Im not sure why developers have decided to cater to one small aspect of a game when this only leads to creating a game that seems small and finite, in both what a player can do in the game and how long the game can hold players' attention spans.

I have never had long queues for WvW, Arenas, or Battlegrounds so I never understand why developers are willing to lose such a large amount of revenue from players who do not want pvp, or only want to pvp on their terms.

Yes.

Depraved

Orobahn wrote: »

My question is, will pvp\pve be separated? Or will this be a forced pvp game?

From some of the videos I have been watching, it looks like you will have to pvp to maintain your housing. Is this the case or will there also be pve housing that is just where you go for some buildcraft?

Is the game open world pvp too, or can you choose to do some immersive questing or relaxing gathering without being ganked? Sometimes I like the intensity of pvp but I am a much bigger fan of immersive content.

Before the hardcore types get too judgy, I like the idea of a massive world with content to suit a large population so that the MMO-world feels beyond immense. Im not sure why developers have decided to cater to one small aspect of a game when this only leads to creating a game that seems small and finite, in both what a player can do in the game and how long the game can hold players' attention spans.

I have never had long queues for WvW, Arenas, or Battlegrounds so I never understand why developers are willing to lose such a large amount of revenue from players who do not want pvp, or only want to pvp on their terms.

you arent forced to do anything. everything is optional.

you can choose to pve and fight mobs, or just chop trees, mine rocks or stay in town all day.
you can choose to attack other players, or not
and if you get attacked, you have choices. you can choose to die like a b...fight back or run away

Okeydoke

Forced pvp, yes. You can't opt out of it. When you die you by a corrupted killer, you will lose a portion of your gatherables, unclear at the moment how much, somewhere between 25-50%. You won't lose your gear or anything like that, just a portion of your gatherables.

There will be a corruption system to curtail how often it happens and to introduce risk and potential loss to the killers.

You can read more about the system here.
https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Player_flagging

Warth

If someone wants to murder you.

Sounds like you aren't the target audience for the game to be frank with you.

Trying it just takes 15$ for a month. So you can just wait and see if you like it upon launch

Less excitement is usually a good thing

JCBBlueDevil

I'm genuinely excited for full fledged open world PvP. To my knowledge you dont lose everything if you defend yourself. It actually benefits you to defend yourself. Something that I would like to see is the inability to see another person's level in the open world. There is no reason some random person should know exactly what level/class you are and if they want to PvP/gank they shouldn't be able to make a decision based on that info. Sure they could look at gear, but from what I can tell there is going to be a mass amount of cosmetics, so that's going to be a difficult feat. I just think if you are going to PvP then PvP, someone's level/class shouldn't be a part of the decision to fight. Maybe you get lucky and the person is lower level, has less skills and lower gear. Or maybe, the person is a true grinder and you made a mistake to target them.

I'm typically not an aggressor in open world PvP though, so maybe my perspective is flawed 🤷‍♂️. Either way I'm excited for this game even if I have to wait years to play it.

Underdelve

JCBBlueDevil wrote: »

I'm genuinely excited for full fledged open world PvP. To my knowledge you dont lose everything if you defend yourself. It actually benefits you to defend yourself. Something that I would like to see is the inability to see another person's level in the open world. There is no reason some random person should know exactly what level/class you are and if they want to PvP/gank they shouldn't be able to make a decision based on that info. Sure they could look at gear, but from what I can tell there is going to be a mass amount of cosmetics, so that's going to be a difficult feat. I just think if you are going to PvP then PvP, someone's level/class shouldn't be a part of the decision to fight. Maybe you get lucky and the person is lower level, has less skills and lower gear. Or maybe, the person is a true grinder and you made a mistake to target them.

I'm typically not an aggressor in open world PvP though, so maybe my perspective is flawed 🤷‍♂️. Either way I'm excited for this game even if I have to wait years to play it.

I believe there will be some form of assessment available, though not to the point where you will know exactly all gear they have equipped nor the abilities they may have at their disposal to defend themselves. I am uncertain if character level will be included in the assessment. It could be that you may be able to ascertain character level based on the tier level of the gear they are wearing.

https://ashesofcreation.wiki/PvP#Threat_assessment

But I agree, some "Fog of War" helps make such encounters more tense, and, for me, more fun

Ludullu

JCBBlueDevil wrote: »

I'm typically not an aggressor in open world PvP though, so maybe my perspective is flawed 🤷‍♂️. Either way I'm excited for this game even if I have to wait years to play it.

It is fairly flawed. As a pvper of 12 years with pretty much exactly the same system as Ashes will have - I fought exactly against people who were similar to my strength or stronger, because it was beyond boring to fight a weak person.

So knowing my target's rough strength would be much better than going in blind. But as Torc linked, that will already be the case in Ashes.

JCBBlueDevil

NiKr wrote: »

JCBBlueDevil wrote: »

I'm typically not an aggressor in open world PvP though, so maybe my perspective is flawed 🤷‍♂️. Either way I'm excited for this game even if I have to wait years to play it.

It is fairly flawed. As a pvper of 12 years with pretty much exactly the same system as Ashes will have - I fought exactly against people who were similar to my strength or stronger, because it was beyond boring to fight a weak person.

So knowing my target's rough strength would be much better than going in blind. But as Torc linked, that will already be the case in Ashes.

That is a great perspective to have, but I'm afraid not everyone sees it as a challenge as you do. However, being subscription based does make the chances of the community be stronger and I can see more people having the same stance as you. I love the idea that it is true open world PvP because it makes the game just that much more immersive, but I feel that in most MMO's people abuse that information about levels/gear. I do like that you can ascertain info about a target, but it doesnt give you exact info, and it shouldn't. I'm sure we will see more info in the future.

Azherae

NiKr wrote: »

JCBBlueDevil wrote: »

I'm typically not an aggressor in open world PvP though, so maybe my perspective is flawed 🤷‍♂️. Either way I'm excited for this game even if I have to wait years to play it.

It is fairly flawed. As a pvper of 12 years with pretty much exactly the same system as Ashes will have - I fought exactly against people who were similar to my strength or stronger, because it was beyond boring to fight a weak person.

So knowing my target's rough strength would be much better than going in blind. But as Torc linked, that will already be the case in Ashes.

But did the weak people drop 25-50% of their stuff?

Ludullu

Azherae wrote: »

But did the weak people drop 25-50% of their stuff?

Imo weak people won't have valuable resources. We'll see how it works out in Ashes though, maybe I'm wrong on that assumption.

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