CROW3 wrote: » Between racial augments, religious augments, weapon augments, class augments, and social augments I guarantee some folks will be hawking the class METAs for each of the 64 combos. I’m sure there will be guilds that only raid with the FotM META spec. That’s just going to happen. However, there are so many permutations I don’t think we’re going to see a homogeneous race/class population. I think there’s a large enough population that just wants to play the combo they want to play. …but we’ll see.
worddog wrote: » CROW3 wrote: » Between racial augments, religious augments, weapon augments, class augments, and social augments I guarantee some folks will be hawking the class METAs for each of the 64 combos. I’m sure there will be guilds that only raid with the FotM META spec. That’s just going to happen. However, there are so many permutations I don’t think we’re going to see a homogeneous race/class population. I think there’s a large enough population that just wants to play the combo they want to play. …but we’ll see. I'm mainly just concerned with how specific the race benefits will be. Like if a race is just straight up better with heavy armor than any other race.
SirChancelot wrote: » worddog wrote: » CROW3 wrote: » Between racial augments, religious augments, weapon augments, class augments, and social augments I guarantee some folks will be hawking the class METAs for each of the 64 combos. I’m sure there will be guilds that only raid with the FotM META spec. That’s just going to happen. However, there are so many permutations I don’t think we’re going to see a homogeneous race/class population. I think there’s a large enough population that just wants to play the combo they want to play. …but we’ll see. I'm mainly just concerned with how specific the race benefits will be. Like if a race is just straight up better with heavy armor than any other race. That's one of the things I've been curious to see how it pans out. If something like the Ren'Kai just always have a bigger health pool, they will be a common choice for most tank characters. But they have said multiple times that they want there to be many options, choices, paths to success, whatever... so they are trying to prevent any kind of meta from dominating. So maybe we might see the Py'rai have a natural dodge chance, Dunir get armor bonuses, Tulnar have higher Regen rates. Something to keep multiple races competitive.
CROW3 wrote: » Beers heal dwarves.
CROW3 wrote: » Hey, the drinks are good as long as you leave your horse and your religion outside. 😉 I’d still like to see an agnostic augment.
worddog wrote: » SirChancelot wrote: » worddog wrote: » CROW3 wrote: » Between racial augments, religious augments, weapon augments, class augments, and social augments I guarantee some folks will be hawking the class METAs for each of the 64 combos. I’m sure there will be guilds that only raid with the FotM META spec. That’s just going to happen. However, there are so many permutations I don’t think we’re going to see a homogeneous race/class population. I think there’s a large enough population that just wants to play the combo they want to play. …but we’ll see. I'm mainly just concerned with how specific the race benefits will be. Like if a race is just straight up better with heavy armor than any other race. That's one of the things I've been curious to see how it pans out. If something like the Ren'Kai just always have a bigger health pool, they will be a common choice for most tank characters. But they have said multiple times that they want there to be many options, choices, paths to success, whatever... so they are trying to prevent any kind of meta from dominating. So maybe we might see the Py'rai have a natural dodge chance, Dunir get armor bonuses, Tulnar have higher Regen rates. Something to keep multiple races competitive. I'm assuming they mean that depending on your class combo anything could be relevant. But I'm 99% sure that Pure Cleric and Pure Tank will always dominate PvE, so their races will probably be optimized.
worddog wrote: » If races have direct power associated with them, won't every class have an objectively correct race? If one race has the best stats for tanks, won't every tank be that race? If one race has the best stats for healing, won't every cleric be that race? Are we going to see every archetype basically be the same race?
bancrofti wrote: » worddog wrote: » If races have direct power associated with them, won't every class have an objectively correct race? If one race has the best stats for tanks, won't every tank be that race? If one race has the best stats for healing, won't every cleric be that race? Are we going to see every archetype basically be the same race? Maybe, just maybe, you are betting in extremes here. There will be 64 archetypes, 8 tank base archetypes, and many "back up" archetypes that can cover this role. If you think like that, that's no purpose for the existence of races in MMOs. Let me pull a little imagination here, with some of the thoughts our friend insomnia put on the table: 1. If you want to play tank and pick the dwarf race, maybe your bonus will be longer CCs so that you could benefit more from picking a tank or a fighter as your secondary class. 2. If you want to play tank and pick the elf race, maybe your racial bonus will be higher spell resistance, which will turn you unstoppable vs magical archetypes or bosses if you pick the mage as your second class, but not too efficient in controlling the battlefield in a certain way, like the dwarf one. 3. Or you can just want to be a little more flexible, and pick the dwarf race and choose the mage as your secondary class, making your spell resistance grow higher than normal tanks but lower than the elvish spellshields and still maintain that longer CC duration (which will be lower than a guardian, for example, but you will be more functional against magic spells). Taking away the race augments will put on the corner the diversity purposed by Steven when he announced that will be 64 archetypes that will feel different. Besides that, as well said, there will be more just than race augments, so, I imagine that two elven tanks can feel different depending on the different choices of weapon, religion and class augments they made.
SirChancelot wrote: » worddog wrote: » SirChancelot wrote: » worddog wrote: » CROW3 wrote: » Between racial augments, religious augments, weapon augments, class augments, and social augments I guarantee some folks will be hawking the class METAs for each of the 64 combos. I’m sure there will be guilds that only raid with the FotM META spec. That’s just going to happen. However, there are so many permutations I don’t think we’re going to see a homogeneous race/class population. I think there’s a large enough population that just wants to play the combo they want to play. …but we’ll see. I'm mainly just concerned with how specific the race benefits will be. Like if a race is just straight up better with heavy armor than any other race. That's one of the things I've been curious to see how it pans out. If something like the Ren'Kai just always have a bigger health pool, they will be a common choice for most tank characters. But they have said multiple times that they want there to be many options, choices, paths to success, whatever... so they are trying to prevent any kind of meta from dominating. So maybe we might see the Py'rai have a natural dodge chance, Dunir get armor bonuses, Tulnar have higher Regen rates. Something to keep multiple races competitive. I'm assuming they mean that depending on your class combo anything could be relevant. But I'm 99% sure that Pure Cleric and Pure Tank will always dominate PvE, so their races will probably be optimized. That's a pretty big assumption. A tank/cleric might be better with built in self heals Or a cleric/bard might have heals with buff or more AOE heal effects that are better for large group content. We won't really know until we get to play with them.
worddog wrote: » SirChancelot wrote: » worddog wrote: » SirChancelot wrote: » worddog wrote: » CROW3 wrote: » Between racial augments, religious augments, weapon augments, class augments, and social augments I guarantee some folks will be hawking the class METAs for each of the 64 combos. I’m sure there will be guilds that only raid with the FotM META spec. That’s just going to happen. However, there are so many permutations I don’t think we’re going to see a homogeneous race/class population. I think there’s a large enough population that just wants to play the combo they want to play. …but we’ll see. I'm mainly just concerned with how specific the race benefits will be. Like if a race is just straight up better with heavy armor than any other race. That's one of the things I've been curious to see how it pans out. If something like the Ren'Kai just always have a bigger health pool, they will be a common choice for most tank characters. But they have said multiple times that they want there to be many options, choices, paths to success, whatever... so they are trying to prevent any kind of meta from dominating. So maybe we might see the Py'rai have a natural dodge chance, Dunir get armor bonuses, Tulnar have higher Regen rates. Something to keep multiple races competitive. I'm assuming they mean that depending on your class combo anything could be relevant. But I'm 99% sure that Pure Cleric and Pure Tank will always dominate PvE, so their races will probably be optimized. That's a pretty big assumption. A tank/cleric might be better with built in self heals Or a cleric/bard might have heals with buff or more AOE heal effects that are better for large group content. We won't really know until we get to play with them. Steven said no subclass would be able to replace a cleric as a healer. I assume a Pure Tank + Pure Cleric will massivly outperform a TankCleric + Cleric/whatever
SirChancelot wrote: » worddog wrote: » SirChancelot wrote: » worddog wrote: » SirChancelot wrote: » worddog wrote: » CROW3 wrote: » Between racial augments, religious augments, weapon augments, class augments, and social augments I guarantee some folks will be hawking the class METAs for each of the 64 combos. I’m sure there will be guilds that only raid with the FotM META spec. That’s just going to happen. However, there are so many permutations I don’t think we’re going to see a homogeneous race/class population. I think there’s a large enough population that just wants to play the combo they want to play. …but we’ll see. I'm mainly just concerned with how specific the race benefits will be. Like if a race is just straight up better with heavy armor than any other race. That's one of the things I've been curious to see how it pans out. If something like the Ren'Kai just always have a bigger health pool, they will be a common choice for most tank characters. But they have said multiple times that they want there to be many options, choices, paths to success, whatever... so they are trying to prevent any kind of meta from dominating. So maybe we might see the Py'rai have a natural dodge chance, Dunir get armor bonuses, Tulnar have higher Regen rates. Something to keep multiple races competitive. I'm assuming they mean that depending on your class combo anything could be relevant. But I'm 99% sure that Pure Cleric and Pure Tank will always dominate PvE, so their races will probably be optimized. That's a pretty big assumption. A tank/cleric might be better with built in self heals Or a cleric/bard might have heals with buff or more AOE heal effects that are better for large group content. We won't really know until we get to play with them. Steven said no subclass would be able to replace a cleric as a healer. I assume a Pure Tank + Pure Cleric will massivly outperform a TankCleric + Cleric/whatever Not exactly He said you would not be able to completely erase the need for a cleric, but that could be for utility effects the cleric has, not necessarily as a healer. A bard/healer built to be a healer can fill the role of healer, but you can still need a cleric in the group for other functions. But this is kind of just theory crafting for now... I'm pretty sure they have said they will actively avoid any combination (tank/tank included) "massively out performing" any other. He has said all combinations should be competitive.
worddog wrote: » SirChancelot wrote: » worddog wrote: » SirChancelot wrote: » worddog wrote: » SirChancelot wrote: » worddog wrote: » CROW3 wrote: » Between racial augments, religious augments, weapon augments, class augments, and social augments I guarantee some folks will be hawking the class METAs for each of the 64 combos. I’m sure there will be guilds that only raid with the FotM META spec. That’s just going to happen. However, there are so many permutations I don’t think we’re going to see a homogeneous race/class population. I think there’s a large enough population that just wants to play the combo they want to play. …but we’ll see. I'm mainly just concerned with how specific the race benefits will be. Like if a race is just straight up better with heavy armor than any other race. That's one of the things I've been curious to see how it pans out. If something like the Ren'Kai just always have a bigger health pool, they will be a common choice for most tank characters. But they have said multiple times that they want there to be many options, choices, paths to success, whatever... so they are trying to prevent any kind of meta from dominating. So maybe we might see the Py'rai have a natural dodge chance, Dunir get armor bonuses, Tulnar have higher Regen rates. Something to keep multiple races competitive. I'm assuming they mean that depending on your class combo anything could be relevant. But I'm 99% sure that Pure Cleric and Pure Tank will always dominate PvE, so their races will probably be optimized. That's a pretty big assumption. A tank/cleric might be better with built in self heals Or a cleric/bard might have heals with buff or more AOE heal effects that are better for large group content. We won't really know until we get to play with them. Steven said no subclass would be able to replace a cleric as a healer. I assume a Pure Tank + Pure Cleric will massivly outperform a TankCleric + Cleric/whatever Not exactly He said you would not be able to completely erase the need for a cleric, but that could be for utility effects the cleric has, not necessarily as a healer. A bard/healer built to be a healer can fill the role of healer, but you can still need a cleric in the group for other functions. But this is kind of just theory crafting for now... I'm pretty sure they have said they will actively avoid any combination (tank/tank included) "massively out performing" any other. He has said all combinations should be competitive. From what I saw, any archetype that uses cleric as their secondary class will get a lot of self healing, but very little ways to heal other players. So Bard/Cleric would actually be more of a self sustaining support rather than buff+heals.
