Dreadphul wrote: » It doesn't have to be perfect, Intrepid.
Noaani wrote: » However, even if we assume the game started actual development in 2018, if you look at other MMORPG's, the development time should be expected to last 7 - 10 years. This puts us at a release of 2025 - 2028 being actually reasonable and in line with other MMORPG's - keeping in mind that this is if we assume development started in full earlier than it actually did. Having an expectation that the game will release sooner than that is unreasonable on your part.
Dreadphul wrote: » sorry, everyone. i was using a bar set by a tiny little game that took just over 4 years to complete. not to complete the testing phases. i'm talking from pasture to dinner table, ready to eat. what was the name of that tiny little game that was start to finish in just over 4 years? Windows Solitaire? No...that wasn't it. Something smaller. Oh, I remember. World of Warcraft.
Dreadphul wrote: » what was the name of that tiny little game that was start to finish in just over 4 years? Windows Solitaire? No...that wasn't it. Something smaller. Oh, I remember. World of Warcraft.
Dreadphul wrote: » Or maybe I've just been hustled out of $250 bucks that i gave to some dude and his buddies who made a small game and figured out how to maximize it's earnings by making it appear much bigger than what it is and never actually releasing it.
Neurath wrote: » We might be able to skip DDR5 and get DDR6 by the time AoC is launched lol.
Dreadphul wrote: » Noaani wrote: » Dreadphul wrote: » sorry, everyone. i was using a bar set by a tiny little game that took just over 4 years to complete. not to complete the testing phases. i'm talking from pasture to dinner table, ready to eat. what was the name of that tiny little game that was start to finish in just over 4 years? Windows Solitaire? No...that wasn't it. Something smaller. Oh, I remember. World of Warcraft. I can see your confusion here. Perhaps it would help if you compare contemporary games. GTS San Andreas took 21 months to develop, and was released in 2004 (the same year as WoW). GTA5 was released in 2008, and took 3 years to develop - almost twice as long. So, the development time from 2004 to 2008 almost doubled. GTA6 started actual development in 2015, and is still in the works now - so it can be assumed that there has been another doubling (at least) since 2008. So, it WoW took 4 years to develop, that means the average MMO from the late 2000's should have taken 8 years to develop, and the average MMO today should take 16 years to develop. Clearly, that doesn't quite track, so perhaps we should look at a linear addition of time to develop a game rather than a multiplication. GTA;SA took 21 months, GTA6 has taken 84 months so far. Thus, there has been an increase in development time of 63 months. If we apply this to MMOs using WoW as our base, with WoW taking 48 - 60 months to develop (best guess), that puts MMO development time today at 111 - 123 months (about 9 or 10 years). Either way, while you think you are being reasonably here, you very much are not. Expect Ashes in 2025 - 2028. That is reasonable. Complain if it hasn't been released by 2030. Edit to add, it is absolutely worth pointing out two things with the above numbers, just to illustrate how harsh I am being on Intrepid in the above. GTA6 actually started development in 2012, it just didn't hit full swing until 2015. This is the same as how Ashes "started" in 2017, but didn't hit full swing until 2020 or 2021. Also, Rockstar is an existing studio, with existing infrastructure, existing systems etc. As such, they are more easily able to get in to the swing of things than a new studio like Intrepid. As such, even the above dates are not actually fair on Intrepid. However, you, OP, are being completely unreasonable. Like, totally, completely unreasonable. It was just over 4 years, like I said. Closer to 4 years than 5. Also, I am not being unreasonable. Demanding perfection would be unreasonable. Are there gamers demanding that? Sure. Sucks to be them. They'll always be disappointed. This game will NOT be perfect when it releases, no matter how much time they take. If it's great, the streamers will say it's great and then tear it apart two months later because that gets them views and views is how they get their money. None of the games I really like are perfect. That's fine. It's a bar that can't be meant. I'm not even asking for the full game. Just Alpha. I played New World at the start and shortly after 60, I ran into the insane amount of bugs. I didn't feel robbed of my $50. I had fun leveling to 60 and then playing until the bugs just became too much for it to be fun. I got my $50 out of it. AGS fixing the bugs and then paying streamers to advertise that the game was good again was just a very nice bonus. I'm not hard to please. I gave these guys $250 but it wasn't $200 extra for 5 times the game. It was for early access. If this is early access, when's the game coming out? Before VR advancements or whatever is coming scraps the whole thing because AoC is on a platform that can't compete? I hope so. They may not care about my clock but....ever advancing tech has its own clock and I think the advancements that are coming aren't going to be small jumps we saw in the past like Atari to Nintendo but more like Atari to PS4. When I dream of AI and VR being used together in future MMORPG's, I think Atari to PS4 might be falling short of what's going to happen. There's a clock for AoC, like it or not.
Noaani wrote: » Dreadphul wrote: » sorry, everyone. i was using a bar set by a tiny little game that took just over 4 years to complete. not to complete the testing phases. i'm talking from pasture to dinner table, ready to eat. what was the name of that tiny little game that was start to finish in just over 4 years? Windows Solitaire? No...that wasn't it. Something smaller. Oh, I remember. World of Warcraft. I can see your confusion here. Perhaps it would help if you compare contemporary games. GTS San Andreas took 21 months to develop, and was released in 2004 (the same year as WoW). GTA5 was released in 2008, and took 3 years to develop - almost twice as long. So, the development time from 2004 to 2008 almost doubled. GTA6 started actual development in 2015, and is still in the works now - so it can be assumed that there has been another doubling (at least) since 2008. So, it WoW took 4 years to develop, that means the average MMO from the late 2000's should have taken 8 years to develop, and the average MMO today should take 16 years to develop. Clearly, that doesn't quite track, so perhaps we should look at a linear addition of time to develop a game rather than a multiplication. GTA;SA took 21 months, GTA6 has taken 84 months so far. Thus, there has been an increase in development time of 63 months. If we apply this to MMOs using WoW as our base, with WoW taking 48 - 60 months to develop (best guess), that puts MMO development time today at 111 - 123 months (about 9 or 10 years). Either way, while you think you are being reasonably here, you very much are not. Expect Ashes in 2025 - 2028. That is reasonable. Complain if it hasn't been released by 2030. Edit to add, it is absolutely worth pointing out two things with the above numbers, just to illustrate how harsh I am being on Intrepid in the above. GTA6 actually started development in 2012, it just didn't hit full swing until 2015. This is the same as how Ashes "started" in 2017, but didn't hit full swing until 2020 or 2021. Also, Rockstar is an existing studio, with existing infrastructure, existing systems etc. As such, they are more easily able to get in to the swing of things than a new studio like Intrepid. As such, even the above dates are not actually fair on Intrepid. However, you, OP, are being completely unreasonable. Like, totally, completely unreasonable.
Dreadphul wrote: » Noaani wrote: » Dreadphul wrote: » sorry, everyone. i was using a bar set by a tiny little game that took just over 4 years to complete. not to complete the testing phases. i'm talking from pasture to dinner table, ready to eat. what was the name of that tiny little game that was start to finish in just over 4 years? Windows Solitaire? No...that wasn't it. Something smaller. Oh, I remember. World of Warcraft. I can see your confusion here. Perhaps it would help if you compare contemporary games. GTS San Andreas took 21 months to develop, and was released in 2004 (the same year as WoW). GTA5 was released in 2008, and took 3 years to develop - almost twice as long. So, the development time from 2004 to 2008 almost doubled. GTA6 started actual development in 2015, and is still in the works now - so it can be assumed that there has been another doubling (at least) since 2008. So, it WoW took 4 years to develop, that means the average MMO from the late 2000's should have taken 8 years to develop, and the average MMO today should take 16 years to develop. Clearly, that doesn't quite track, so perhaps we should look at a linear addition of time to develop a game rather than a multiplication. GTA;SA took 21 months, GTA6 has taken 84 months so far. Thus, there has been an increase in development time of 63 months. If we apply this to MMOs using WoW as our base, with WoW taking 48 - 60 months to develop (best guess), that puts MMO development time today at 111 - 123 months (about 9 or 10 years). Either way, while you think you are being reasonably here, you very much are not. Expect Ashes in 2025 - 2028. That is reasonable. Complain if it hasn't been released by 2030. Edit to add, it is absolutely worth pointing out two things with the above numbers, just to illustrate how harsh I am being on Intrepid in the above. GTA6 actually started development in 2012, it just didn't hit full swing until 2015. This is the same as how Ashes "started" in 2017, but didn't hit full swing until 2020 or 2021. Also, Rockstar is an existing studio, with existing infrastructure, existing systems etc. As such, they are more easily able to get in to the swing of things than a new studio like Intrepid. As such, even the above dates are not actually fair on Intrepid. However, you, OP, are being completely unreasonable. Like, totally, completely unreasonable. It was just over 4 years, like I said. Closer to 4 years than 5.
Dreadphul wrote: » Noaani wrote: » Dreadphul wrote: » sorry, everyone. i was using a bar set by a tiny little game that took just over 4 years to complete. not to complete the testing phases. i'm talking from pasture to dinner table, ready to eat. what was the name of that tiny little game that was start to finish in just over 4 years? Windows Solitaire? No...that wasn't it. Something smaller. Oh, I remember. World of Warcraft. I can see your confusion here. Perhaps it would help if you compare contemporary games. GTS San Andreas took 21 months to develop, and was released in 2004 (the same year as WoW). [...] However, you, OP, are being completely unreasonable. Like, totally, completely unreasonable. Also, I am not being unreasonable. Demanding perfection would be unreasonable. Are there gamers demanding that? Sure. Sucks to be them. They'll always be disappointed. This game will NOT be perfect when it releases, no matter how much time they take. I'm not even asking for the full game. Just Alpha. I played New World at the start and shortly after 60, I ran into the insane amount of bugs. I didn't feel robbed of my $50.
Noaani wrote: » Dreadphul wrote: » sorry, everyone. i was using a bar set by a tiny little game that took just over 4 years to complete. not to complete the testing phases. i'm talking from pasture to dinner table, ready to eat. what was the name of that tiny little game that was start to finish in just over 4 years? Windows Solitaire? No...that wasn't it. Something smaller. Oh, I remember. World of Warcraft. I can see your confusion here. Perhaps it would help if you compare contemporary games. GTS San Andreas took 21 months to develop, and was released in 2004 (the same year as WoW). [...] However, you, OP, are being completely unreasonable. Like, totally, completely unreasonable.
