Player housing/ Freehold proposal since people seem to be worried

Instead of looking at Freeholds as their own separate thing, people really need to look at them as player housing, and honestly I feel like it'd be a good idea for Intrepid to depict all housing in a Tier system. Such as what follows.

Tier 1: apartments
Tier 2: node level 3 static housing
Tier 3: node level 4 static housing upgrades
Tier 4: node level 5 static housing upgrades
Tier 5: node level 6 static housing upgrades
Tier 6: freeholds

Disclaimer, these are ideas and suggestion for how things can progress amongst player housing.

Tier 1: Apartments would have bare bones housing amenities. Maybe a small garden, a small animal like a chicken that can produce, some storage, and maybe some basic furniture perks and an artisan station (not master)

Tier 2: basic housing amenities with more space than an apartment. Slightly bigger gardening options, maybe a medium animal and small animal. Limited storage yet greater than apartments, limited furniture yet more options than apartments. 2 artisan stations (not master)

Tier 3: moderate housing amenities with more space than tier 2. Slightly bigger gardening options, a couple medium animals and small animals. More storage and furniture options than tier 2. 3 artisan stations (not master)

Tier 4: high housing amenities with more space than tier 3. Bigger gardening options, a large animal, a couple medium animals, and small animals. More storage and furniture options than tier 3. 3 artisan stations, 1 mastered excluding processing.

Tier 5: Royal housing amenities with more space than tier 4. Bigger gardening options, a large animal, several medium animals, and small animals. More storage and furniture options than tier 4 . 3 artisan stations, 2 mastered including processing.

Tier 5: Freehold. Substantially bigger gardening options, a stable option. Top tier storage and furniture options. Artisan stations including mastered processing. Business options. All of the freehold perks mentioned in their showcase. Etc.

Let me know what you all think of this as compared to "oh God I can't have a freehold so the game is ruined"

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Comments

JamesSunderland

Noaani wrote: »

And thus Dygz point is true.

Most people are not expecting to be content with instanced housing - they will want a freehold. That is literally the point being made here.

Nope, Dygz point isn't true.

Because even if most people wants freeholds for whatever purpose, most people can still be content with having an instanced apartment because its better to have one than not have one. It's not exclusionary Noaani, that's the second time i see you trying to pull a Black-or-white Fallacy against me hahaha.

Noaani

JamesSunderland wrote: »

Noaani wrote: »

And thus Dygz point is true.

Most people are not expecting to be content with instanced housing - they will want a freehold. That is literally the point being made here.

Nope, Dygz point isn't true.

Because even if most people wants freeholds for whatever purpose, most people can still be content with having an instanced apartment because its better to have one than not have one. It's not exclusionary Noaani, that's the second time i see you trying to pull a Black-or-white Fallacy against me hahaha.

I think your understanding of the word "content" is off here.

As always, there are a few. However, the best to use for this situation is "a state of satisfaction". Many players - perhaps even most players - will have an instanced appartment in Ashes. However, that does not mean they are satisfied with that - they are not content with it.

Most players will want more - whether that is in node housing or a freehold.

I mean, that is kind of the point of the system. There is supposed to be a demand on limited housing options, people are supposed to want it, meaning people are supposed to not be content with instanced housing.

JamesSunderland

Noaani wrote: »

I think your understanding of the word "content" is off here.

As always, there are a few. However, the best to use for this situation is "a state of satisfaction". Many players - perhaps even most players - will have an instanced appartment in Ashes. However, that does not mean they are satisfied with that - they are not content with it.

Most players will want more - whether that is in node housing or a freehold.

I mean, that is kind of the point of the system. There is supposed to be a demand on limited housing options, people are supposed to want it, meaning people are supposed to not be content with instanced housing.

I certainly do understand the everlasting greedy human desire for more and better.
But i also do understand that people can be very content by having something very good specially if its near the apex of the best instead of nothing.
Like wanting iPhone 14 but still being content by having your iPhone 12 instead of nothing.

The main divisor of Freehold and instanced housing is the Freehold top tier processing.
Isn't it reasonable to say only processors will never be content without a freehold, while people who aren't processors will still certainly want the freehold but can still be content with instanced housing instead of nothing?
So there will certainly be demand for them, such level of demand varies from person to person.

But it seems like for you content means "completely satisfied" instead of simple content.
Your semantics and unusual meanings always amazes me.

Noaani

JamesSunderland wrote: »

But i also do understand that people can be very content by having something very good specially if its near the apex of the best instead of nothing.

Freeholds offer the ability for players to progress in processing, they allow players to set up businesses, they allow players to influence the spawn rate of resources and mobs in the game world, they have storage space, they allow players to have some control over a portion of the otherwise chaotic game world, they allow players to display their style to others, they give players a PvP free space in the open world (even if only indoors), they give player a guaranteed means of gathering.

What does instanced housing do again?

If instanced housing was close to freeholds in terms of functionality, I'd agree with you that Dygz is wrong. However, freeholds have function, instanced housing essentially does not.

Using your iphone example, freeholds may be an iphone whatever (don't care, Apple is the most evil company in tech, I don't follow their products and think significantly less of people that use them), but an instanced appartment is more akin to a Motorola DynaTAC 8000x.

The leasehold suggestion I have made would fit your comments here of housing that is near the apex but not the best. That is something I would expect many people to be content with.

JamesSunderland

Noaani wrote: »

Freeholds offer the ability for players to progress in processing, they allow players to set up businesses, they allow players to influence the spawn rate of resources and mobs in the game world, they have storage space, they allow players to have some control over a portion of the otherwise chaotic game world, they allow players to display their style to others, they give players a PvP free space in the open world (even if only indoors), they give player a guaranteed means of gathering.

Freeholds offer the ability for players to progress in processing, they allow players to set up businesses.

they allow players to influence the spawn rate of resources and mobs in the game world
citation needed.

they have storage space
instanced housing also has.

they allow players to have some control over a portion of the otherwise chaotic game world
irrelevant.

they allow players to display their style to others.
Players can also check your style if they visit your instanced housing. quite irrelevant still.

they give players a PvP free space in the open world (even if only indoors) Insane relevance

they give player a guaranteed means of gathering.
instanced housing also has.

Do you wanna try again tho?

Noaani

JamesSunderland wrote: »

Noaani wrote: »

Freeholds offer the ability for players to progress in processing, they allow players to set up businesses, they allow players to influence the spawn rate of resources and mobs in the game world, they have storage space, they allow players to have some control over a portion of the otherwise chaotic game world, they allow players to display their style to others, they give players a PvP free space in the open world (even if only indoors), they give player a guaranteed means of gathering.

Freeholds offer the ability for players to progress in processing, they allow players to set up businesses.

they allow players to influence the spawn rate of resources and mobs in the game world
citation needed.

Actions like ridding an area of invasive species or performing crop rotations on freehold farms may have a positive effect on that area's land health value.

they have storage space
instanced housing also has.

Perhaps.

they allow players to have some control over a portion of the otherwise chaotic game world
irrelevant.

When we are talking about player desire (content), things players may desire are not irrelevent.

they allow players to display their style to others.
Players can also check your style if they visit your instanced housing. quite irrelevant still.

Not even remotely the same thing.

Only people that already know you will come and visit your instanced home.

they give players a PvP free space in the open world (even if only indoors) Insane relevance

they give player a guaranteed means of gathering.
instanced housing also has.

Other than essentially pot plants - which appear to be their own thing that also happen in freeholds - citation needed.

Do you wanna try again tho?

Nah, we're still working through this lot.

It is entierly possible that there may be some expansion on what you can do in instanced and in node housing. However, we can't really talk about what may happen.

As we know now, they are wholely inadaquate.

To be honest though, I don't want instanced housing to be adaquate. Adaquate housing should mean players have an hour or more (ideally 90 minutes or more) of activities they *can* do in their housing per day - and I don't want people spending that much time in their instanced house.

Azherae

We're up to calling people 'RP clowns' now?

Dolyem

https://youtu.be/iB752TiNepA

Dygz

willsummon wrote: »

You are thinking from a no-consequence World PVP. Griefing, which is 90% of the problem in most MMOs, is stated to have penalties in AoC.

I'm not thinking about griefing. Open Seas is FFA PvP.
Griefing is not possible there.
And, there can be plenty of PvP on the mainland that is not griefing.
Especially with Caravans and Castle Sieges.

willsummon wrote: »

Crafting guilds could come together and make it clear griefing PVP will not be tolerated where they are, and with penalties on griefing, they can enforce this.

I'm not talking about griefing PvP.

willsummon wrote: »

That being say, group endgame PVP could be insane.

Ashes doesn't have an endgame.

willsummon wrote: »

While not really mentioned one way or another. It is a logical guess that maps will not update in node area that have not been visits since changes in that node. Giving a fog of war situation.
The possible exemption being the rise and fall of metropolis nodes.

Not a literal fog of war. We'll have to see how maps update.
That has nothing to do with areas of peace.
Dunno why we would only be considering Metros.

willsummon wrote: »

The game world of AoC is very, very large.
If this is the case, which I hope, a crafty PVP guild can go to a far corner of the game world, where no one is at, and building a small kingdom, such as a city level node and vassal nodes for it. When that guild is ready, they can launch PVP attacks on the rest of the game world, with everyone else being unsure where the PVP guild is based at.

It's going to take more than one guild to build a City.
And that Node will very like be Sieged before reaching the City Stage.
I wonder if it can considered to be a PvP Guild if they don't PvP before Stage 5.
Most likely the guild will have to do some PvP to have the resources and services to reach Stage 5.

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