Throne and Liberty further proves Ashes needs Factions

Probably the most important feedback I will bring over to AoC.

If you're not apart of the mega super multi guild that controls the server you are not allowed to play the game. Meaning you either get the benefits of being the #1 guild on the server and snowball or you become content to be farmed by the #1 guild and quit the game to do something more fun.

New World had this, Throne and Liberty has this and Arche Age 2 will have this. These games have all failed or are going to fail.

Add factions to Ashes to prevent this problem. Two factions is great. Three would be the best design.

Small scale GvG has little to no accessibility which means less players playing in the game and spending money. Good luck.

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Githal

You all will be surprised how different AOC is from lineage 2.
But i would guess most of you will be part of zerg group anyway. So you are not concerned at all.

iccer

Veeshan wrote: »

Ludullu_(NiKr) wrote: »

Githal wrote: »

Guess it's not easy to have vision of how things will work... After a2 lunches and you see what I am talking about on practice,we Will talk again

In that comment I literally explained how mass pvp in L2 worked. A game where a party had only 3 dps characters. And the zerg's reaction was taken from personal experience from both sides: attacking a zerg and being a part of one.

So no, I don't need to have vision of things, because I have direct experiences of a game that is literally AoC's inspiration.

Problem with alot of these people complaining about PvP/zergs and all that are mostly coming from people who have never played a single game that is similiar to AoC or has large scale open world pvp at all.

Exactly. That was also my point, it seems like people are taking out of their ass, arguing with people who actually HAVE played mass open-world PvP games (that are an inspiration to AoC), and know how things work.

I wouldn't have a problem with it, if this was something new, and we just had no idea how it would turn out when we actually get to play the game. Discussion and arguments are good in that case.
But the thing is, it's not new, it's been done in other games, we know how mass PvP works, we know how zergs work, and we know because we have actually experienced all of that, are are not talking about theoretical stuff.

And the thing is, I haven't played L2, yet my experience is nearly the same as @Ludullu_(NiKr)'s, for example.
Why? Because these things that we are talking about are generally true for all other similar games that have mass open-world PvP.
When another person comes in, and starts arguing against these things, saying the opposite, it just means they haven't actually played these sort of games, and are not talking from their experience.

Solid_Sneak

Githal wrote: »

You all will be surprised how different AOC is from lineage 2.
But i would guess most of you will be part of zerg group anyway. So you are not concerned at all.

Hey, I too have gripes with L2, so in a way, let's hope we are both surprised by the changes 🥳

Mag7spy

I find it funny people are still saying zergs are unorganized. All of you need to paly throne and liberty get get some mmorpg experience since it prob has been 20 years since you have done pvp.

It will help modernize your experience going into AoC on the current landscape.

If im doing a large scale war with my guild i have multiple people leading large groups of people. If we are talking about 400 people most likely that content wont have them all on a single tight spot but multiple objectives + flank squads / groups.

If you think that won't be coordinated you again do not understand the current landscape. Most zerg style groups are people that can get people together / coordinate those groups as well.

Yall really don't get how serious people are taking these games. I have about 5 guilds in the beta but 3 were focused on pvp that is like 150 players. You better believe they were as organized as they needed to be to win fights / get bosses.

*Edit

And this didn't have my main people as well or the people I mainly have to organize guild things for perspective.

Solid_Sneak

Mag7spy wrote: »

I find it funny people are still saying zergs are unorganized. All of you need to paly throne and liberty get get some mmorpg experience since it prob has been 20 years since you have done pvp.

It will help modernize your experience going into AoC on the current landscape.

If im doing a large scale war with my guild i have multiple people leading large groups of people. If we are talking about 400 people most likely that content wont have them all on a single tight spot but multiple objectives + flank squads / groups.

If you think that won't be coordinated you again do not understand the current landscape. Most zerg style groups are people that can get people together / coordinate those groups as well.

Yall really don't get how serious people are taking these games. I have about 5 guilds in the beta but 3 were focused on pvp that is like 150 players. You better believe they were as organized as they needed to be to win fights / get bosses.

*Edit

And this didn't have my main people as well or the people I mainly have to organize guild things for perspective.

Ah yes, Throne and Liberty, 10 years to develop the same old cashgrab Korean shovelware that even Koreans won't play cause of how bad it is.

Congratulations on you and your own, you are the most elite dung divers the world has ever seen.

Githal

Solid_Sneak wrote: »

Mag7spy wrote: »

I find it funny people are still saying zergs are unorganized. All of you need to paly throne and liberty get get some mmorpg experience since it prob has been 20 years since you have done pvp.

It will help modernize your experience going into AoC on the current landscape.

If im doing a large scale war with my guild i have multiple people leading large groups of people. If we are talking about 400 people most likely that content wont have them all on a single tight spot but multiple objectives + flank squads / groups.

If you think that won't be coordinated you again do not understand the current landscape. Most zerg style groups are people that can get people together / coordinate those groups as well.

Yall really don't get how serious people are taking these games. I have about 5 guilds in the beta but 3 were focused on pvp that is like 150 players. You better believe they were as organized as they needed to be to win fights / get bosses.

*Edit

And this didn't have my main people as well or the people I mainly have to organize guild things for perspective.

Ah yes, Throne and Liberty, 10 years to develop the same old cashgrab Korean shovelware that even Koreans won't play cause of how bad it is.

Congratulations on you and your own, you are the most elite dung divers the world has ever seen.

What he is talking about is not connected to Throne and liberty at all. Its the way zergs function. And this will apply to any game.

Ludullu

Mag7spy wrote: »

Most zerg style groups are people that can get people together / coordinate those groups as well.

And as I keep saying, if they ARE that coordinated - they deserve what they get. I don't want well-coordinated big groups to suddenly lose simply because the game has op aoes.

And judging by those score numbers, there can be at least 3 sides to that server with roughly similar score values between the sides, and I'm sure that this is far from all the guilds on the server.

So it comes down to people's willingness to fight against the zerg and their skill compared to the zerg's.

And as a ton of people have been saying for years now - people are pussies now and never want to rebel (ironic, considering your guild's name

), so yes, zergs will dominate. But it won't be because of aoes or game design. It will be because players are shitty weaklings now.

Githal wrote: »

But i would guess most of you will be part of zerg group anyway. So you are not concerned at all.

Yes, my small node guild will definitely be a huge zerg

Aszkalon

Ludullu_(NiKr) wrote: »

Yes, my small node guild will definitely be a huge zerg

I think what he means is - > we will seek Allies beyond our normal Guild-Size and be part of something greater.

Which is by no means a wrong Decision, right ? Riiight ? No one will take down a Node of Level Three, Four - or above, only with a single Guild with like 20 Members, right ?

That would be absurd. Or only a Node which is likely Level Three and where all Citizens completely suck as Defenders. lol

Ludullu

Aszkalon wrote: »

I think what he means is - > we will seek Allies beyond our normal Guild-Size and be part of something greater.

Nah, I do think he means that we'll be in zerg guilds. But even if he does mean what you're saying - no, I will not be a part of a zerg, because I'll always be opposing one.

Aszkalon

Ludullu_(NiKr) wrote: »

I will not be a part of a zerg, because I'll always be opposing one.

So You will gain the [Outnumbered, but not outgunned]-Achievement.

Balrog21

World is way to big to have one guild run the server.

Aszkalon

Balrog21 wrote: »

World is way to big to have one guild run the server.

Exactly.

The " One gigantic Zerg Alliance will dominate everything without Resistance " is a Fear by many here, i have the Impression sometimes.

But i must say it is also kinda a little bit a pessimistic Approach. Who can honestly claim on a Nine-Thousand-People Server that they will always be an invincible Zerg Alliance or something like that ?

This is only possible when all other Forces never band together against oneself.

Seeing as People will definitely play in way more different Node-Places than just Five to Nine Nodes, out of like the full Eighty-Five or so on the whole Worldmap,

how is someone even supposed to gather like half the whole Server ? This shooooouuuld be impossible.

Lastly,
i imagine such a Server getting lonely really quick, when all other Players who are not in the Mood for this, are tired of being dominated by lets say - > +2000 to +4000 People (<- maximum) who think they must PvP everyone who could possibly be outside their own Alliance.

Not even with Streamers like dear Asmongold i could imagine such sick Groups to form. And i know MANY People always love to follow him.

Ayeveegaming1

I would hope that if the guilds are out there zerging, that there would be other guilds attacking the base of the zerg guild, weaking the base of said zerg. There can be so many tangents to go from this. I suggest peopel read The Art of War by Sun Tzu.

https://youtu.be/jxcMRkqaQdw?si=DuE1qz9sjo0AqOHT

Mag7spy

Ludullu_(NiKr) wrote: »

Mag7spy wrote: »

Most zerg style groups are people that can get people together / coordinate those groups as well.

And as I keep saying, if they ARE that coordinated - they deserve what they get. I don't want well-coordinated big groups to suddenly lose simply because the game has op aoes.

And judging by those score numbers, there can be at least 3 sides to that server with roughly similar score values between the sides, and I'm sure that this is far from all the guilds on the server.

So it comes down to people's willingness to fight against the zerg and their skill compared to the zerg's.

And as a ton of people have been saying for years now - people are pussies now and never want to rebel (ironic, considering your guild's name ), so yes, zergs will dominate. But it won't be because of aoes or game design. It will be because players are shitty weaklings now.

Githal wrote: »

But i would guess most of you will be part of zerg group anyway. So you are not concerned at all.

Yes, my small node guild will definitely be a huge zerg

Mainly wasn't really talking about what they should and shouldnt get, though i agree people that are more coordinated and win should get what they aim for.

I really want to dispel this zergs or large numbers of players are not organized thing, cause that isnt really reality.

Mag7spy

Solid_Sneak wrote: »

Mag7spy wrote: »

I find it funny people are still saying zergs are unorganized. All of you need to paly throne and liberty get get some mmorpg experience since it prob has been 20 years since you have done pvp.

It will help modernize your experience going into AoC on the current landscape.

If im doing a large scale war with my guild i have multiple people leading large groups of people. If we are talking about 400 people most likely that content wont have them all on a single tight spot but multiple objectives + flank squads / groups.

If you think that won't be coordinated you again do not understand the current landscape. Most zerg style groups are people that can get people together / coordinate those groups as well.

Yall really don't get how serious people are taking these games. I have about 5 guilds in the beta but 3 were focused on pvp that is like 150 players. You better believe they were as organized as they needed to be to win fights / get bosses.

*Edit

And this didn't have my main people as well or the people I mainly have to organize guild things for perspective.

Ah yes, Throne and Liberty, 10 years to develop the same old cashgrab Korean shovelware that even Koreans won't play cause of how bad it is.

Congratulations on you and your own, you are the most elite dung divers the world has ever seen.

ITs always the casual players that don't understand and are the same people complaining when they die in pvp.

Depraved

Mag7spy wrote: »

@Depraved you play the beta?

i just logged in to test the new skills. only made a level 20 char that's it ;3

didn't feel like doing everything all over again to lose it in a few days xD

Depraved

deathwish wrote: »

Probably the most important feedback I will bring over to AoC.

If you're not apart of the mega super multi guild that controls the server you are not allowed to play the game. Meaning you either get the benefits of being the #1 guild on the server and snowball or you become content to be farmed by the #1 guild and quit the game to do something more fun.

New World had this, Throne and Liberty has this and Arche Age 2 will have this. These games have all failed or are going to fail.

Add factions to Ashes to prevent this problem. Two factions is great. Three would be the best design.

Small scale GvG has little to no accessibility which means less players playing in the game and spending money. Good luck.

games with factions are even worse when you try to avoid the problem you described. in a non faction game, people can easily oppose the winning side. cant do that in a faction game unless you reroll, since you are stuck (only nw made it kind of easy, that's it)

one side can still dominate and farm everyone else in a faction game, then people just start rerolling and joining that side...its even worse than no factions xD

Smaashley

Throne and Liberty doesn't prove anything. It's gonna be a dead P2W game in 6 months. Let Intrepid rock the MMORPG genre.

Aszkalon

Smaashley wrote: »

Throne and Liberty doesn't prove anything. It's gonna be a dead P2W game in 6 months. Let Intrepid rock the MMORPG genre.

I don't know anything about Throne and Liberty - > but i agree with You instantly ! Let Intrepid ROCK the MMORPG Genre. It is about time someone worthy lifts the Hammer that are MMO's and lead the Genre to Greatness.

Mag7spy

Smaashley wrote: »

Throne and Liberty doesn't prove anything. It's gonna be a dead P2W game in 6 months. Let Intrepid rock the MMORPG genre.

I feel that wont be the case based on how people were playing the game and excited for it, ontop of the changes and new content coming.

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