Taking another player's item should flag you.

I don't think this is too hot of a take but I think if someone takes items off another player's corpse, it should flag them.

To take this idea further, I think the perfect implementation of this system would have it so that any item that is looted from another player is tagged as "stolen." I think this should include completed items dropped by corrupted players. If you have a stolen item in your inventory, you are flagged for pvp. If you are killed, you drop all stolen items. In my head, the stolen flag would be removed if the item is put into storage or returned to its original owner.

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nanfoodle

I hate that I PvE people can loot your body. In PvP only the people that killed you should be able to loot your body. Not just some Joe walking by.

Zehlan

Simple solution If u die a 5 minute timer goes on your corpse anybody looting within that timer is flagged, of course party members and guildies excluded from being flagged after that free game should of bought a faster horse.

CROW3

@mcstackerson - I agree with your basic premise: theft of player items flags you purple. The devil’s in the details though.

Is the idea that you are perma purple while an item that was stolen at any point is in your inventory? Or is there a timer? Or if you put into storage then take it out you’re no longer purple?

I’m a fan of keeping it simple, 15 min purple flag.
- Steal another item? Back to 15 mins (i.e. I don’t think you need to stack the timer).
- timer persists through logout
- no silly loopholes to reduce the timer

tinukeda

mcstackerson wrote: »

On your second paragraph, I think if you choose to loot a player's corpse, you are choosing to steal from them. If you get baited by this system, you deserve it. They are robbing the robber.

So, you're forgiving the first crime and condemning the second? If the first player died while corrupt they chose to be the criminal in the first place, there's no "stealing from them", they're the criminal! EDIT: sorry, confused this with the overall topic. Still a sketchy baiting system like that I think would be a turnoff for some players; if a body appears to be 'free loot', why wouldn't someone loot it?

tinukeda

After seeing more opinions, I do now think that a brief period of time of flagged after looting a corpse would be reasonable. That would prevent people from diving in and snagging loot w/o repercussions but not be a big deal for someone in the wild that come across a body. Nobody around? Loot and run!

VampirePeterpan

I agree, at least flagged to the owner

Apok

I don't know if it's all the survival games I've played but I think it's fine the way it is. If you do flag for taking items I'll probably use it to bait people and hide in a bush waiting for them to take my body.

Log in on an alt with a piece of rare poop and die, go back to my main and wait for someone to grab it.

mcstackerson

Vhaeyne wrote: »

mcstackerson wrote: »

Sorry if I'm making you repeat yourself but why don't you think someone should be flagged for stealing from someone's corpse?

No worry's,

I covered this in the other thread on the topic, but I will try to distill it down better here.

It is mostly the idea that you "could" sneak in there and steal stuff without being seen. Like the Risk vs Reward of someone actually having to see you. The temptation at play for the would be thief.

If the game forces you purple it kind of rats you out. If feels to me like force flagging would be an over reaction that removes some of the temptation to steal. The more difficult the crime the less likely people are to do crimes.

I think it would be better if people were more tempted to create player friction of their own.

I get what you are saying with how the going purple thing doesn't allow you to sneak loot but the way it is now though, it doesn't matter if someone sees you, so there is no risk stealing.

Caeryl

Phew we're really on what, thread 3 or 4 on this topic?

Well, I'll echo myself again. I don't think looting should flag you, but the corpse should remain unlootable for 5 minutes by randos. Only the killer should be able to loot before that.

We're already seeing circumvention of the corruption system by having perma-green pack mules following griefers around. Player friction should be inspiring revenge and payback to reclaim your stolen goods, which is currently impossible because your stolen goods got picked up 0.5 seconds after you died and now sit in the inventory of a corrupt player's non-combatant buddy.

mainedutch

Caeryl wrote: »

.
We're already seeing circumvention of the corruption system by having perma-green pack mules following griefers around. Player friction should be inspiring revenge and payback to reclaim your stolen goods, which is currently impossible because your stolen goods got picked up 0.5 seconds after you died and now sit in the inventory of a corrupt player's non-combatant buddy.

This doesn't make sense.

"Player friction should inspire you to reclaim your goods that get stolen in 0.5 seconds."

You disagree with having people flag as combatants if they steal your loot, but you think you should try to reclaim them some other way?

That's... I mean that's literally the entire point of flagging people when they loot your dead body. So you can get a chance to get your loot back without having to become corrupted...

Regardless we already know the feature is being implemented, exactly as it should. It will in not negatively affect anyone. Just don't loot someone else's stuff and you'll be fine. By looting someone else's body, you're essentially opting in for a brief period of time. That's a risk you choose.

This change will only add more interest to the environment and welcome more open world PvP because I guarantee you so many people are still going to try and loot corpses. I can't wait.

Corpier

I like the idea that looting the corpse of someone else that isn't corrupted that someone didn't kill themself flags them as a combatant until they have sold, laundered, banked, or returned the items. Alternatively I would also accept giving a window of time when only the player who died or the ones that killed them can loot the body until some time has passed.

However I don't like the idea of flagging for taking items off a corrupted player. I would prefer if in the finished game corrupted players, or even players in general, have loot rules similar to npcs applied to them that make being able to loot dependent on tagging or being in the group doing 60% of the damage. This would prevent a corrupted player's friends from immediately grabbing the dropped items and running or mobbing the now flagged person.

Noaani

mainedutch wrote: »

You disagree with having people flag as combatants if they steal your loot, but you think you should try to reclaim them some other way?

You are looking at it from the perspective of the person that had that loot stolen, Caeryl appears to be looking at it from the perspective of the person that would be taking the loot.

If that player would flag for combat on taking that loot, it is a disincentive to taking it. That is why some people are asking for it - they want that disincentive.

So it isn't a case of disagreeing with the flagging in terms of causing friction, it is a case of disagreeing with the flagging as that will reduce (or near eliminate) the instances where this even happens.

Basically, you are both looking at the same thing from different perspectives, and coming up with different opinions.

Caeryl

mainedutch wrote: »

Caeryl wrote: »

.
We're already seeing circumvention of the corruption system by having perma-green pack mules following griefers around. Player friction should be inspiring revenge and payback to reclaim your stolen goods, which is currently impossible because your stolen goods got picked up 0.5 seconds after you died and now sit in the inventory of a corrupt player's non-combatant buddy.

This doesn't make sense.

"Player friction should inspire you to reclaim your goods that get stolen in 0.5 seconds."

You disagree with having people flag as combatants if they steal your loot, but you think you should try to reclaim them some other way?

That's... I mean that's literally the entire point of flagging people when they loot your dead body. So you can get a chance to get your loot back without having to become corrupted...

Regardless we already know the feature is being implemented, exactly as it should. It will in not negatively affect anyone. Just don't loot someone else's stuff and you'll be fine. By looting someone else's body, you're essentially opting in for a brief period of time. That's a risk you choose.

This change will only add more interest to the environment and welcome more open world PvP because I guarantee you so many people are still going to try and loot corpses. I can't wait.

You misunderstood.

The solution isn't to flag people that loot; it's to prevent looting at all for a set amount of time unless you actually killed that person.

Right now corpses are lootable by anyone the moment you die, regardless of if you die in PvP or PvE. This is a twofold problem:

1) Corpse runs are pointless if the intention is to recoup lost materials (the primary thing you lose), meaning there is no reason to return even if it'd only take you a couple minutes, because your stuff is gone 90%+ of the time

2) If you win a PvP encounter, someone could sweep the loot off your kill before you can

The primary issue is 1, which isn't solved by flagging players on looting, only by preventing uninvolved players from grabbing your stuff.

Exceptions for partymembers or other allied players would have a space in there to work out, and flagging players in addition to the delay timer would be good, but this free-for-all they've got going on isn't going to work.

Vhaeyne

mcstackerson wrote: »

Vhaeyne wrote: »

mcstackerson wrote: »

Sorry if I'm making you repeat yourself but why don't you think someone should be flagged for stealing from someone's corpse?

No worry's,

I covered this in the other thread on the topic, but I will try to distill it down better here.

It is mostly the idea that you "could" sneak in there and steal stuff without being seen. Like the Risk vs Reward of someone actually having to see you. The temptation at play for the would be thief.

If the game forces you purple it kind of rats you out. If feels to me like force flagging would be an over reaction that removes some of the temptation to steal. The more difficult the crime the less likely people are to do crimes.

I think it would be better if people were more tempted to create player friction of their own.

I get what you are saying with how the going purple thing doesn't allow you to sneak loot but the way it is now though, it doesn't matter if someone sees you, so there is no risk stealing.

We could actually have the best of both worlds. You stay white, but if someone attacks you with stolen glint you automatically flag purple.

That would be a better system IMO.

caldrin

Think I seen a post going around from one of the devs saying that people will get flagged for looting other players its just not in game yet.

Gizban

tinukeda wrote: »

mcstackerson wrote: »

For the corrupted thing, it's not as much about the corrupted player being able to get the stuff back as much as it's about random players running in and taking the items.

Oh so resources taken? That already devalues every time there's a death, so encouraging people to kill to get it back would just delete even more of the items.

Thinking further on "flag if you loot": seems like this could be exploited: 'decoy' character dies intentionally in order to tempt others to loot and then their waiting buddies jump the looter. Basically getting to rob the looter for free?

Killing them after they stole from you is more about retribution.

Who's going to waste their time with 'decoy' death in a subscription game with xp debt?

And even if they do, it's on the thief. Crime apologists are something else.

Its_Me

Steven has already stated there are a lot of mechanics not yet in game due to this being alpha. A couple of the things he mentioned was the ability to improve your bags with an interaction stat so that they take longer to loot upon your death and introducing flagging someone outside your raid/guild that loots a body.

eastonl

Vhaeyne wrote: »

mainedutch wrote: »

Go to 11:01:45 on this interview with Steven from only 2 days ago: https://twitch.tv/videos/2298227762

Steven describes PvP flagging will be implemented for looting corpses, along with a lot of other stuff.

"If you do loot that body after a successful time you will be flagged and become a valid target for PvP."

This is the way it should be. Risk vs. reward. You might want to think twice about taking someone's stuff!

I listened to this early today and again just now.

I missed the part where he said he has a concept where you could be flagged for a "short time" after looting some body's.

This disappoints me, but it may be interesting if this all interacts with the bag system well. Which is something I have never seen him talk about before.

My feedback is still the same. I don't think you should flag for looting other players ever.

Don't loot a corpse that isnt yours. Simple. I see someone looting my corpse and they're getting smoked - no filter

Aszkalon

mcstackerson wrote: »

Very often the Person who can "loot You", is the only One who may as well get a Hand on it -> before it vanishes after like Five to Seven Minutes.

If you are not just killing Goblins in the North of Lionhold -> but are killed in a Place where several Elite Mobs run around and spawn like they have nothing better to do every Minute,

you might as well never get your dropped Stuff back.

Plus it would flood the Land with an immense PvP-Mindset and not with a friendly one.

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