The 2 Main Reasons people are quitting P2 already

1.Leveling
The current leveling experience is beyond awful. Obviously we're desperately missing alternative progression paths with Questing and Story Arcs, but even without those features it's laughably obvious that Intrepid put absolutely no thought into what a current player's leveling experience is going to look like.

There are only a very small amount of suitable grinding spots in the game and the mob distribution across the map is annoyingly random. Overall the world feels like it is completely void of any understanding how people are actually leveling right now.

How about grouping up mobs in a way that makes sense for people to pull those packs instead of scattering them around an entire zone for no reason when that is the only way you guys provide to level? How about providing enough mobs to kill so more than a single group can populate a PoI? How about temporarily raising the XP for killing mobs so this insanely monotonous grind at least feels somewhat rewarding? How about you provide alternative mob spawns when you take crucial ones away to spawn things like Freeholds? How about adding temporary grinding spots to service the massively increased server capacity?

Even for somebody that is part of an organized hardcore guild and has a much higher tolerance for tedious grinding than the average player, the leveling experience is incredibly draining and most definitely not fun whatsoever. It really feels like the Developers are completely disconnected from what leveling currently looks like because it's so much easier to just boost yourself up with an admin command.

2.Gathering
The feedback from Phase 1 was loud and clear. There are simply not enough resources to gather, especially copper. And for some reason, absolutely nothing has been done about this for P2 besides a cheeky comment from Steven that there apparently is enough copper being gathered and it's apparently just sitting around in player's inventories. What a bunch of BS.

Gathering currently is completely unenjoyable and I know a lot of people that normally love gathering and crafting, but simply can't enjoy it in AoC, because running around for hours and not being able to find resources kills any amount of motivation to test the profession system. This once again feels like a major system that Intrepid pushed into the game without investing a single thought into the actual player experience.

If Intrepid wants people to engage in the crafting system so bad, how about we don't lock the most basic materials behind hours of mindlessly running around without any direction in hopes of finally finding what you need to get started?

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Overall thoughts on Phase 2

Let's be honest, this should be barely allowed to be called Phase 2. It's literally just Phase 1 with 2 new races, a "not remotely close to being shippable" extension to the desert, storefronts that lack even the most basic of quality of life features on top of making the entire launch experience miserable by shoving tons of players into the same world while not providing meaningful countermeasures to ensure people still have a decent time.

Phase 2 is significantly more buggy, the server performance is a lot less stable and the amount of disconnects & crashes people are experiencing is way higher than in Phase 1. Overall it is pretty obvious Intrepid rushed Phase 2 out to be able to deliver an update before Christmas and completely disregarded the player expectations in the process. Overall this release makes me a lot less optimistic about the future of this game if this is the type of update we can expect every 2 months.

Unless we get some massive sweeping changes to these very obvious pain points in the very near future, the player retention will drop massively within the next month of two. And while that's expected to a certain degree because of general fatigue, the poorly designed leveling progression and gathering experience will without a doubt be the main reasons for that drop.

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Comments

Shinto

I do wish that Steven’s vision for a more old school grindier approach for Ashes was more evidently advertised and transparent such as being included on the web page or on the alpha purchase page for example. Had I known that was his intention for the game, I would not have paid to have myself and someone else enrolled for the alpha. I’m assuming that was intentional though to encourage more people to pay for the alpha and get more revenue.

I think there’s a lot of great ideas for the game. I also appreciate the monthly updates and openness with the public regarding timeline and development plans/progress. However the main reason I was fine with paying over $100 per person for two people to help test a game in the early stages (which is not the norm for mmos) is because I was fine contributing my money and time testing a game that had goals that aligned with my own ideals for an end product. I thought the initial gameplay that was lacking in quests for level progression was due to the nature of being an alpha but am now suspecting that is the intention and plan for the future after seeing Steven’s quotes about Ashes being on the “grindier side.”

I would have liked to join last week’s few test sessions where characters were given max levels so the developers could test specific aspects of the game, but these session were hosted during normal work hours multiple times. They were over by the time work and dinner were done so I was unable to participate, unfortunately. I did like the idea of those very specific tests, though, which would allow the developers to test specific things they wanted to work on, provided a goal and framework for players to know how they could contribute to testing, while also providing a rewarding experience for testers to see the potential of the game (max level means the opportunity to explore all the different skills and builds a player could look forward to).

nanfoodle

Shinto wrote: »

I do wish that Steven’s vision for a more old school grindier approach for Ashes was more evidently advertised and transparent such as being included on the web page or on the alpha purchase page for example. Had I known that was his intention for the game, I would not have paid to have myself and someone else enrolled for the alpha. I’m assuming that was intentional though to encourage more people to pay for the alpha and get more revenue.

I think there’s a lot of great ideas for the game. I also appreciate the monthly updates and openness with the public regarding timeline and development plans/progress. However the main reason I was fine with paying over $100 per person for two people to help test a game in the early stages (which is not the norm for mmos) is because I was fine contributing my money and time testing a game that had goals that aligned with my own ideals for an end product. I thought the initial gameplay that was lacking in quests for level progression was due to the nature of being an alpha but am now suspecting that is the intention and plan for the future after seeing Steven’s quotes about Ashes being on the “grindier side.”

I would have liked to join last week’s few test sessions where characters were given max levels so the developers could test specific aspects of the game, but these session were hosted during normal work hours multiple times. They were over by the time work and dinner were done so I was unable to participate, unfortunately. I did like the idea of those very specific tests, though, which would allow the developers to test specific things they wanted to work on, provided a goal and framework for players to know how they could contribute to testing, while also providing a rewarding experience for testers to see the potential of the game (max level means the opportunity to explore all the different skills and builds a player could look forward to).

This has been the plan since 2017. It's been talked about to death in live stream, interviews, pod casts, Alpha 1 players have been commenting on it on the forums, people like myself have been talking about it here as well. Every time they talked about the class structure, it's been mentioned this is not just the Trinity but also old school support classes like the Summoner and the Bard. Steven could not have been more clear on this.

Taleof2Cities

Shinto wrote: »

I do wish that Steven’s vision for a more old school grindier approach for Ashes was more evidently advertised and transparent such as being included on the web page or on the alpha purchase page for example.

The Wiki is a great one-stop shop for all things Ashes, Shinto:

https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Level_cap

Rockyfour

These type of posts are a result of people playing games 12 hrs a day instead of progressing their life

Shinto

This has been the plan since 2017. It's been talked about to death in live stream, interviews, pod casts, Alpha 1 players have been commenting on it on the forums, people like myself have been talking about it here as well. Every time they talked about the class structure, it's been mentioned this is not just the Trinity but also old school support classes like the Summoner and the Bard. Steven could not have been more clear on this.

Since it has been “talked about to death in live stream, interviews, pod casts, Alpha 1 players have been commenting on it on the forums, people like [yourself] have been talking about it here as well,” then I don’t think it’s unreasonable for me to request that something that “has been the plan since 2017” should be included on the main page and alpha purchase page since it’s such an integral part of the game that most players who are new to or interested in Ashes would be interested in knowing. I also feel that the majority of people realistically don’t have time to retrospectively go through hours if not hundreds of hours worth of live streams, interviews, pod casts, and alpha forums, on top of the new info that is coming out. As someone who isn’t particularly new to Ashes but has been following the news over time here and there, the highlights I took from the newsletters, monthly video updates, and player review videos were regarding the innovative aspects of Ashes such as the nodes, community events in the world like caravans etc, and being a part of developing a city and participating in its politics.

Furthermore, I don’t have an issue with the classes, given that I’m playing a bard and was expecting to play a traditional class. My comment was primarily regarding grinding to level as opposed to questing for leveling.

Aszkalon

nanfoodle wrote: »

Posts like this don't add anything to the discussion. This is a real Alpha and feedback is needed.

I am aware my MMO-Friend. Maybe i am just to weak and/or to dumb and maaaaaybe not really up to the task.

I admit right away i am struggling "HARD" sometimes with the english Client. I am NOT saying i give up because of that. But i realise and admit it might make me a lesser efficient Tester. Which angers me a bit to be honest.

Giving up is not an Option.

The most (?) noteworthy Bug i found is that the "Camoflague" of the Hunter sometimes to actually MOST OF THE TIME - refuses to function in any optical kind of way.

It shows my Character as if i would not have activated that Ability at all.

I want to help. But i feel like i am a humble Peasant trying to help advanced Rocket Engineer's who launch Missiles into Space. I am not giving up of Course.

Damn. I had a Feeling Alpha Two would be hard and tough, but it is a lot harder still. Feedback is all we can do to provide help i guess. ( I mean i "KNEW" it was. But damn. )

SmileGurney

The state of gathering, especially metals is FUBAR. The way the metal resource nodes operate, their respawn timers and how existing spawned resources do NOT get rotated unless they are gathered seems like a massive oversighted from the gameplay perspective, nevermind people enjoyment of the actual gather process. Wake up Intrepid's senior game designers.

neobpm

The main reason people are quitting the game: after many years waiting to play the "definitive MMO experience" they are hours and hours killing the same stupid mobs making the "definite experience" in a ultra boring grinding fest.

At this moment the game is unplayable, I don't want waste my time with this, I hoped a real MMO experience doing quests, dungeons, exploring, PvPing, roleplaying, etc., but no, every time I enter the game I'm killing mobs in a spot to get lvl up and I bored the game.

Lucascp92

neobpm wrote: »

The main reason people are quitting the game: after many years waiting to play the "definitive MMO experience" they are hours and hours killing the same stupid mobs making the "definite experience" in a ultra boring grinding fest.

At this moment the game is unplayable, I don't want waste my time with this, I hoped a real MMO experience doing quests, dungeons, exploring, PvPing, roleplaying, etc., but no, every time I enter the game I'm killing mobs in a spot to get lvl up and I bored the game.

Come back in the beta then before your final decision

neobpm

Lucascp92 wrote: »

neobpm wrote: »

The main reason people are quitting the game: after many years waiting to play the "definitive MMO experience" they are hours and hours killing the same stupid mobs making the "definite experience" in a ultra boring grinding fest.

At this moment the game is unplayable, I don't want waste my time with this, I hoped a real MMO experience doing quests, dungeons, exploring, PvPing, roleplaying, etc., but no, every time I enter the game I'm killing mobs in a spot to get lvl up and I bored the game.

Come back in the beta then before your final decision

Yes but, when beta will come? Nobody knows, I'm thinking with the current game state, it will be in too many years, then your proposal is not valid.

Lucascp92

neobpm wrote: »

Lucascp92 wrote: »

neobpm wrote: »

The main reason people are quitting the game: after many years waiting to play the "definitive MMO experience" they are hours and hours killing the same stupid mobs making the "definite experience" in a ultra boring grinding fest.

At this moment the game is unplayable, I don't want waste my time with this, I hoped a real MMO experience doing quests, dungeons, exploring, PvPing, roleplaying, etc., but no, every time I enter the game I'm killing mobs in a spot to get lvl up and I bored the game.

Come back in the beta then before your final decision

Yes but, when beta will come? Nobody knows, I'm thinking with the current game state, it will be in too many years, then your proposal is not valid.

June 2026, Steve told me. Trust me brother.

thunderfury2024

neobpm wrote: »

The main reason people are quitting the game: after many years waiting to play the "definitive MMO experience" they are hours and hours killing the same stupid mobs making the "definite experience" in a ultra boring grinding fest.

At this moment the game is unplayable, I don't want waste my time with this, I hoped a real MMO experience doing quests, dungeons, exploring, PvPing, roleplaying, etc., but no, every time I enter the game I'm killing mobs in a spot to get lvl up and I bored the game.

💯

Lodrig

ThevoicestHeVoIcEs wrote: »

The state of gathering, especially metals is FUBAR. The way the metal resource nodes operate, their respawn timers and how existing spawned resources do NOT get rotated unless they are gathered seems like a massive oversighted from the gameplay perspective, nevermind people enjoyment of the actual gather process. Wake up Intrepid's senior game designers.

The gap seems to be more in the implementation then the design. Over and over were given placeholder systems which are only fit for PTR testing being pushed out to the wider Alpha. Intrepid has detailed plans and concepts but none of thouse details are making it into what were playing, and thouse details are vital.

In the worst instances this is allowing blatant exploits of war systems and PvP, exploits which were BLINDINGLY obvious to anyonw who know anything about MMO's.

With regard to harvesting it really seems like they have no dynamic getherable spawn system which adjust spawn rates based on server population/playtime. Something which should have been obvious to any modern developer who is wildly shifting the population density in testing.

NeverlossNinja

People just know that if the devs are set on a way of doing things, they won’t change it if there is something about the game that is annoying you. What we get, is what we are stuck with.
Like sbmm in apex legends.

Chicago

Shinto wrote: »

I do wish that Steven’s vision for a more old school grindier approach for Ashes was more evidently advertised and transparent such as being included on the web page or on the alpha purchase page for example. Had I known that was his intention for the game, I would not have paid to have myself and someone else enrolled for the alpha. I’m assuming that was intentional though to encourage more people to pay for the alpha and get more revenue.

I think there’s a lot of great ideas for the game. I also appreciate the monthly updates and openness with the public regarding timeline and development plans/progress. However the main reason I was fine with paying over $100 per person for two people to help test a game in the early stages (which is not the norm for mmos) is because I was fine contributing my money and time testing a game that had goals that aligned with my own ideals for an end product. I thought the initial gameplay that was lacking in quests for level progression was due to the nature of being an alpha but am now suspecting that is the intention and plan for the future after seeing Steven’s quotes about Ashes being on the “grindier side.”

I would have liked to join last week’s few test sessions where characters were given max levels so the developers could test specific aspects of the game, but these session were hosted during normal work hours multiple times. They were over by the time work and dinner were done so I was unable to participate, unfortunately. I did like the idea of those very specific tests, though, which would allow the developers to test specific things they wanted to work on, provided a goal and framework for players to know how they could contribute to testing, while also providing a rewarding experience for testers to see the potential of the game (max level means the opportunity to explore all the different skills and builds a player could look forward to).

To be fair there is alot of fine print and false advertising with ashes, it's quite frustrating

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