Mages with bows.

Hello everyone, I know all archetypes can use any weapons, but I don't like the idea that a mage can use a bow with the same ability as an ranger. It feels weird. I know there is still a long way to the game release but do you think in the final game we'll have the same situation as now where we'll see mages using bows? Ir really feels like out of place in a rol perspective.

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Songcaller

Volgaris wrote: »

It'd be nice to see attribute requirements, but we'd need selectable attributes for that to matter.

Can you elaborate here?

Podgnil

I wrote it in another thread, I'll repeat it here. Unfortunately, weapons don't feel like weapons at all, they're just another piece of gear with the biggest stat. Weapons don't have an attack type, attack speed, damage... And this leads to tanks running around with wands and mages with bows. That moment when they wanted to give freedom of choice, but in pursuit of stats, it leads to absurdity. Yes, it's possible that some bows can have a magical attack, but it should be part of a very specific build. And not like a bow with mag stats dropped at 290 and any mage drools.

Volgaris

Songcaller wrote: »

Volgaris wrote: »

It'd be nice to see attribute requirements, but we'd need selectable attributes for that to matter.

Can you elaborate here?

I guess think Diablo 1. Or any number of old school RPG.
To use a Claymore you'd need say 20 points in your strength attribute.

As it is now when you level you get an ability point. Yay.....lame really. So character customization to tailor to your play style or your chosen RP if you RP and ain't meta chasing has no depth. It's simple, each player will basically be encourage to chase the meta and you'll swap weapons based of your situation, or stats of those weapons. Not bad, just simple.

You can scale these things out on what matters most. Player skill, character gear, character level, skill tree, weapon tree
So far skill tree is flat so there's nothing to compare. A lvl 25 mage will have all abilities.
Player skill can matter, but honstly most pvp is ganking or mob training.
Character Gear. Probably matters the most. I've decked out a lvl 1 tank with blues and greens and holyballs it was OP at lvl 1.
Character Level. Matters for sure, but pvp at endgame all levels will be equal. so it's pretty flat too like the tree.

So what matters for the things you have control over?
Gear > Player Skill > Weapon Skill > (Skill Tree == Character Level)

IE. You are what you wear style of game.

Since you don't select Attributes at level up those are flat too. If you did get to select them then it's another thing you get to control about your character. You can tell a lot about the intended play style of a game based off this. It leans more towards a MOBA IMO than an MMORPG, character progression wise at least. It's shallow, mile wide, inch deep. It's not "bad" there's lots of other things in the game to make up for it. But disappointing to me.

side note: "Mages with Bows" would be a really cool stringed quartet band name.

OrcLuck

If I can use a book in melee I think I will allow mages to use bows. Fair trade.

Volgaris

OrcLuck wrote: »

If I can use a book in melee I think I will allow mages to use bows. Fair trade.

Lol I never tried that. Does that actually work? It'd be so cool if you smacked them with it.

Spif

All classes can use all weapons. But weapons are limited to auto-attacks and the skill tree passives. All of your class skill don't use a weapon really. So I'd say that weapons are more than stat sticks. The auto attacks and passives are pretty important.

Letting all classes use all weapons allows for variation on class fantasy. Tanks with sword/shield and magic book for the paladin feel. It also allows physical classes to have a ranged auto-attack AE via a physical spellbook that you just can't get with a bow. Bow and wand auto attacks are single target. All melee weapons are AE so far

I think it will also be important later on once we can pick secondaries. Mage/Ranger or Mage/Fighter will probably have some synergy with bow.

There is a downside to being a mage using a bow or a melee using a book. The weapons apply debuffs via passives that are tuned more to their "native" damage type. IE, wands and books can apply volatile, which increases magic damage taken by 15%. Bows apply snare, bleed and wounded I think.

Arya_Yeshe

a archer mage is an absolute must and should be as skilled as a ranger, the only difference should be how they operate and which skills/spells they have at hand, both should be equally powerful

nuff said

Sevariel

I strong disagree with OP. I was crazy in love with mage when I realized I could be an arcane archer. Shooting lightning streaked arrows was so satisfying and the kind of class fantasy I’ve always wanted. Crushed to realize I needed a magical weapon tree to play well, no melee magic options to balance out using a bow.. yet..

MissionCreep

Rangers have special ammunition which mages do not.

Gandalf used Glamdring, btw. Super selfish need over greed roll, what a jerk. He was already a wizard with a staff, why not give it to one of the dwarves?

kentbeck

I like the idea of being able to use all weapons.

However, it would be interesting to add a passive to the archetype to have some bonus to attack speed or casting speed for weapons that are categorical for that class. This way, there would be a burden in using an atypical weapon.

Songcaller

Someone request a cookie cutter? 🍪

GreatPhilisopher

excuse my poor English as its not even my 2nd language .

maybe a way to fix it is instead of having the weapons being just a bigger stat stick number of "physical/magical power" , let them have a main secondary attribute that is more personal to every weapon , of course the higher the weapon level /rarity u get more "phys/int power" but to a way lesser degree than what it is now so they can basically be the secondary stats for weapons in a way and different weapons focus on different branch of the stats in the main stats which are according to the wiki ( constitution, wisdom,mentality,strength,dexterity,intelligence)

so lets say any weapon can still be magical or physical(tho having weapons be more focused might be good too like spears cant be magical but can have magic penetration but a bow can be both...etc might help with diversity too) anyway say a bow can be magical or physical but the main attribute it add is a part of the different evasion stats , a wand can focus on magical casting speed/rating , a spear focuses on physical penetration or even magical one too.

maybe let the weapons have a minor secondary stats too and let the crafting be able to alter the minor or even both of them to a degree.

as long as any weapon can have both physical and magical power ratings doing that wont stop not just the mage but every class of having a bow basically be their main weapon 80% of the time like how it is now but it will reduce it significantly and let people do a lot more different builds with different weapons where they have to choose a certain type of weapons depending on the build they want to go for like a mage focusing on cast speed and penetration would have a wand and a spear , a tank that wants to be magic focused and evasion would have a magic shield/sword with like Magical Critical Avoidance Rating and magical avoidance rating and a physical power focus with magic resist or smthn.

in this way the mgc/phys power rating wont be as important but will still be the main way for a character to hit harder but be more focused in certain path depending on the types of weapons you choose.

maybe letting the players be able to have 1 physical and 1 magical weapons too not 2 of any type might help or not and as far as i can tell most of the weapons skill trees barely have any difference outside of a little bit of some main passive skills between physical and magical weapons other than that its mostly basically the same between the weapons of the same type and we also get too many skill points so there is no need to choose a path at all.

maybe if the weapon skill trees were more unique or have unique active skills that work better for different classes instead of how they are now it wouldnt be as bad.

does any of this make sense , i dont know tbh but might be better than whatever we have right now .

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