Best Of

Which archetype do you find the most fun to play? Why?
Rogue/Fighter.

Combat feels fluid in them. Rogue because it's so over tuned and bloated with mechanics it makes it fun. Fighter because overall it's a well designed kit and shreds in the hands of the right player

Which archetype do you find the least fun to play? Why?
Mage/Cleric

Mage is too simple. Has no depth or interesting mechanics. Just shatter. Which is from WoW. Should function like Rogue IMO have a high skill celling and be deadly in the hands of the right player

Same with Cleric. This is even worse. It's just a standard 30 year old almost healing and combat system. Dated boring and all you do is stare at raid frames. You guys can do better. It's 2025. Design a healer that is more engaging. Look at Wildstar healing for example. Other than that the kit itself is quite underwhelming.


Are there any combat systems or mechanics you feel need more development or refinement? Please explain.

Yes. The Hybrid combat system. This is not what we were promised. We were promised 75% of abilities could be skill shots or 75% could be tab.

Currently it seems the team and Steven are leaning into fully tab target. This is a huge mistake and alienates the backers who supported you under the pretense of Hybrid combat. We were also told no HARD CC would be possible with tab target combat spells. In general tab target combat is low skill expression. And causes a lot of problems with a low Time to Kill that intrepid wants. Free damage that 2 shots people is not fun. IMO High scaling abilities should ALL be aimed. And lower scaling 100% and less can be tab. You can see this issue with Archetypes doing MASSIVE unavoidable free damage. That one shots almost.

During group combat or grinding sessions, do you feel any core features or gameplay elements are missing or underdeveloped? If yes, please describe.

Yeah what's missing is the Sub Archetypes. And judging from comments from the team and Steven it seems that system has been scaled down as well. For an example. If you are Sub classing FIGHTER as a Ranger. Your kit should transform into something that has the ability of playing MELEE combat (unlocking new melee moves) with the ranger kit. AKA Survival hunter WoW. Another example... If you are playing Cleric and subclass ROGUE it should give you new or transformed CURRENT abilities allowing you to play close quarters with daggers while still offering healing EXAMPLE (healing touch: augments into a damage ability if used on an enemy. Deals bonus damage from BEHIND the target if sub classing Rogue). I have heard from some of the team that it will NOT work this way. Essentially only being passive flavor to a Archetype. THIS IS A HUGE MISTAKE (if true)

Also look on the Bard Forums for my Bard Revamp Idea. https://www.reddit.com/r/AshesofCreation/comments/1kftxbd/bard_revamp_idea_from_a_2000_time_played_bard/

Bard feels like a warm blanket

Cleric feels like a damp blanket.

Ranger feels like a fleece blanket.

Rogue feels like you don't need a blanket.

Mage feels like an electric blanket in the desert with no power.

Fighter feels like sleeping naked... in the woods.

Tank feels like the blanket is actually a 100 grit sandpaper. Maybe that is why the spell is called Grit .

Which archetype do you find the most fun to play? Why?
Fighter is my heart and soul. It hits most of the major itches from a class fantasy, it is 'relevant' but not 'overpowered' in any content, and is a relatively simple class to grasp, with a decent chunk of nuance to 'play well'
Which archetype do you find the least fun to play? Why?
Functionally: Ranger; it plays like a 'worse' control mage, and really is only relevant/mandatory for it's low-risk high reward AOE engage. Obviously it HAS merits to it, especially in PvP, but people play it because they HAVE to, not because it's fun. It has two functionally identical skills in Barrage and Volley, it is NOT auto-attack based like many players would assume, and it's not "skill" based (in the sense of careful aim) like your New World-esque players would expect. It has NO meaningful regen, its hunter mark's are so niche that they're ignored in most situations.

Are there any combat systems or mechanics you feel need more development or refinement? Please explain.
Targeting as a whole needs refined, ESPECIALLY in action combat. (I know I know, just play tab target). There are issues with quickly changing targets, targets randomly shifting from enemy to friendly (as a dps)
I don't KNOW what a good solution would be, but I cannot stress enough that current Action Mode is an active detriment to a combatant, and it shouldn't be.

Physics need to be addressed as well, Fighter has a prolific bug on blitz that catapults the player in a random direction (oftentimes straight up, which is a death sentence in the PTR)

FIX TANK CHAIN HECTOR!

During group combat or grinding sessions, do you feel any core features or gameplay elements are missing or underdeveloped? If yes, please describe.

You may not consider this core gameplay, but melee combatants need tools in their toolkit that scale up with enemies hit, specifically group PVP. Guild War/Node War combat is very "zerg-ball" oriented and PvP guilds will literally force their players off of melee (specifically fighters in 2.5) because stepping out of the ball at all just leads to them immediately dying. A lot of people have theorized that ability-triggered 'mitigation buffs' based on targets hit might be a good solution. For instance, a fighter's leap strike could be changed to add a "X% mitigation per enemy player hit for Y seconds" and would instantly change the game for that archetype, rewarding a skillful Leap Strike engage. Not to make it all about fighter, obviously, but similar considerations could be considered as needed. PTR tank is pretty good as-is, but that may change in a live-game gear scenario.

Gundel wrote: »

Which archetype do you find the most fun to play? Why?

Currently I play Ranger and Rogue and id argue that rogue feels like a better ranger in few areas because of its Kit being fully flushed out it feels like a DPS class with large strong damage abilities and higher skill ceiling.

Which archetype do you find the least fun to play? Why?
Ranger- Because the class kit is fundamentally broken, Long Cast times, mana issues and lack of identity and skill expression.

This pretty much sums it up well, I played a rogue in last test and made a range rogue and it was a substantially better feeling ranger than the current ranger kit.

The long cast time that slows/immobilizes effects on you makes the ranger feel much more akin to a spellcaster instead of a skirmishing ranger/archer which you usualy get in RPG's having like 1 stationary hard hitting skill like snipe is fine but when the whole kit kinda feel like it, then you have a spell casters kit.

Rangers imo should have higher single target dmg with longer range and mages should be more higher aoe dmg, ranger should be about picking off important targets from a relatively safe range and mages should be about punishing groups. Atm you have 2 range dps classes (mage/Ranger) and u made them both pretty much the same bit of aoe and a bit of single target so they dont realy feel any different from each other role wise.


Also dots kinda need to stack i think having them overides each other kinda make any kinda dot time weapon/build usless outside of 1v1 which the game not being balanced for anyway

While we are still in alpha and far from seeing these archetypes in their final form nor in class form, there is still quite a discrepancy between archetype design and goals. I’ll try not to say some are ‘more fun’ than others as that is subjective.

While not perfect, the bard and rogue appear to be the goals or ceiling in current archetype design. They are what other archetypes should strive to be at this stage of development at a minimum.

However the tank archetype suffers from a design standpoint. While already a seldom role in MMOs, it’s not being handled well from an identity stance in my opinion. While it can be fun, it lacks a lot compared to previous MMORPG titles even with the acknowledgment of being an alpha. I won’t voice and critique each skill or issue, but here are highlights from myself and the community.

- Fix tank grapple. Don’t meme it as a small issue. This has been an issue since pre A2. While it doesn’t need to be priority #1 , the archetype the most poorly revived perhaps doesn’t need a bug ignored this long.
- Skill Kit Stuns: Tank has 5 + hard trips sharing the same dr cd. Tremoring strike, tomahawk, reflect, vengeance, ground pound. Please consider mixing it up with an immobilize or snare in there possibly on tomahawk (yes taking tremoring bellow upgrade allows for a snare). Tanks in most games are the cc and support master, but in ashes tanks perhaps are barely top 3 in lockdown/cc. An immobilize even single target will go far.
- Identity: Tomahawk? Why. Also even without perfect TTK, the damage transfer abilities could use some work and better attention. Aegis is a poorly designed ability in my opinion compared to similar skills in previous titles. The tank should get a benefit from activating this skill to provide better incentive. Yes of course being unselfish and supporting the group is fun, but this will often unalive yourself in the situations where it’ll be useful. Grit and other mitigation helps this but it needs more. Increase incoming healing received, become cc immune, cleanse dots, or literally anything. Absorbing ALL damage around you can be very risky. I’ve used it to great effect in some scenarios, but it’s missing something.
- Protect skill is fine as is and mandatory for me, but could benefit from the same improvements. Mitigating more damage and having the default range increased. Maybe mitigating 15% of ally’s damage and 10% is transferred to you.
- Vengeance had a great improvement from what it was and flows great in auto attack combos, but the damage shield upgrade for it should be much more large and meaningful. Also there’s enough stuns. Consider making the 3rd hit snare and/or changing it back to AOE
- EDIT: Shake it off should be simplified and add a skill ceiling. Heal X% of damage taken in last X seconds.

Sorry it’s a lot and I won’t critique the rest as I feel it’s fine or not as much a priority in terms of tanking in comparison to the other skills. While one can make the tank great for duels or even PvP; the support, tanking, damage transfer, and identity are lacking.
I provide this novel with love but feedback as I love playing this archetype and know the foundation is there 💜
- NYCE

Are there any combat systems or mechanics you feel need more development or refinement? Please explain.

During group combat or grinding sessions, do you feel any core features or gameplay elements are missing or underdeveloped? If yes, please describe.

I play cleric most of the time and I think it's serviceable, especially in PvE. But even though I can see clear attempts to make the skills feel and function differently, cleric feels very basic and uninspired. In PvP it can even be frustrating.

As a former Guild Wars (1) player I was hoping there'd be a few more options that allow you to mitigate or even prevent incoming damage, rather than just having to spam all skills off cooldown, hoping you can outheal said damage.

I will just post three of my favorites as examples:




With skills like these healing becomes more than just a numbers game. It's less about mana management and gear, but more about reflexes and proper timing to prevent incoming damage spikes. In my opinion, it makes healer gameplay feel a lot more tactical and rewarding.

Basically, I'd love to have a protection skill tree along with a healing one.

Which archetype do you find the most fun to play? Why?

Currently I play Ranger and Rogue and id argue that rogue feels like a better ranger in few areas because of its Kit being fully flushed out it feels like a DPS class with large strong damage abilities and higher skill ceiling.

Which archetype do you find the least fun to play? Why?
Ranger- Because the class kit is fundamentally broken, Long Cast times, mana issues and lack of identity and skill expression.

Are there any combat systems or mechanics you feel need more development or refinement? Please explain.

I think for the ranger the mechanics of focus isnt a great change and was a band-aid fix for the issue of its dmg, Salvo and barrage i feel spells need higher tuning numbers, as previously stated Ranger feels more of a support class than a dmg class compared to the other cast of dps classes currently. Half our kit revolves around snare and roots while snare is also effected by chill and DR's each other. We also have limited impact on using Snares due to often having to combo concussive and thundering shot making it feel mandatory. Bear trap lacks real use cases 90% of the time as easily dodge able in pvp and only effect is a root.

Mechanic wise the hunt and mark system I think need an overhaul (again) it doesn't offer much to the party, The hunts/marks sharing cool down force us to only ever take one. Its usually defaulted to Tiger for crit, having our defenses tied to the mark also feels bad and gives us less agency.

Rangers Ammo Imbuements- Feels very outdated and we get the same abilities tied to our weap combos making these feel very lack luster. They offer limited combos Only really being Concussive with thundering shot for the silence. while we have to have proc it with an two abilities other classes have silence on demand on 1 buttton. I feel like this could easily be changed to proc based spell (think Bard Resonate weapon)

Regeneration- Still feels unseen and unfelt, it doesn't feel IMPACTFUL most players even when having it on still doesn't feel like the regeneration does anything. (soothing shadows on Rogue offers much more Regen)

Ranger Mobility- Feels lack luster when tanks can charge and keep up with disengage etc, Air strike feels great verticality but easily outshined due to grapple hook by rogue with many more useages and faster animation.

Our abilities giving us a built in slow when casting also feels very bad for a mobile archer.

Thorns- great to have still has very limited impact and doesnt feel Impactful having it in a pvp and pve situations most of the time- I like the ability just want to see implemented stronger.

During group combat or grinding sessions, do you feel any core features or gameplay elements are missing or underdeveloped? If yes, please describe.

Currently we are still missing our Scouting/Track targets

I think Rangers should lean more into procs and projectiles and damage, we are often an initiation class with our root (vine trap) We are often overly squishy with lack of damage and mobility compared to Bards/Rogues/Mages/ and often even fighters. We currently also lack CC outside of the Root space, and Silence space. Ranger Fantasy still feels like its missing from the design as it feels like a weaker support than bard in its current state.

Rogue feels AMAZING, also most excited for Summoner.

• Played and liked the most - Fighter
  I'm probably biased here since the traditional greatsword/heavy armor is something i very much enjoy. I like the various tools that fighter has that lets them gap close and deal consistent damage.

• Played and disliked - Tank
  I don't really feel like I have much impact as a tank, I am capable of soaking up some damage, as well as taking some aggro. But I can't really do anything well in that regard. I feel like this wouldn't be as bad if i was able to choose to either go full tank, full aggro, damage, or a little in between. In its current state it feels unintended.

• Combat feels very disconnected, its hard to explain but i'm feels like there are almost "stages" to the game. Sometimes i'm traversing somewhere. Then I finish that, I get to an area to gring and every engagement is the same in that I run up > do my combos > kill > repeat. Once i'm done or had enough, I go back to my traversing "stage". Nothing is really happening in between or during these "stages".
  
• There is very little reason to want to change my positioning, fall back, making space etc. An MMO where I thought this was very well done was the likes of Guild Wars 2. Combat was always about movement, just using your skills typically forced your character to move a short distance while also causing damage to the enemy('s). Overall it felt very smooth and combat encounters bled into the movement and traversal of the world.
  
  Additionally I think Ashes could really improve on the formula, a big issue that Guild wars 2 had was the vast majority of enemies would just run at a static speed towards you. Having a variety of npc speeds and even tatics for movement could really add a lot of dynamic behaviour to the game. even breaking it down into broad strokes like "beast characters move fast and will try arc around you" vs "giant's will slowly lumber towards you in a straight line". This also allows you to mix and match behaviours to give a breadth of potential encounter situations that can be put across the world.

• Group combat and grinding sessions are very much the same. But they feel even more robotic. They are a bit more interesting due to the friction of having to compete with other players for spots but overall it just feels completely static. There are some situations where depending on your class and the consistency of your party. You could reliably set up an macro to loop through your combo and just not move or even be at the computer. Which I don't feel is very good design or even intended.

• Additionally every class having the exact same animations and skills for weapons doesn't feel very good, not only from the immersion angle where a physically weak mage swings a the same speed and precision as a fighter, but also that a lot of weapon skills overlap a LOT with what each class would pick if they use that weapon.
• Personally I do like the idea of every class being able to use each weapon, even if they aren't good at it. But right now i feel like it isn't in a good state. I'm not sure what the solution is but I know that when I do pick up any weapon right now, I don't feel like it has any "identity". If that makes sense.