Best Of
Re: 📝 Dev Discussion - Archetype Vibe Check
- Which archetype do you find the most fun to play? Why?
- Which archetype do you find the least fun to play? Why?
I played all archetypes to level 25 at some point. I think they're all fun to play in their own ways, but I also think that there's a lot missing from every archetype as well.
- Are there any combat systems or mechanics you feel need more development or refinement? Please explain.
During group combat or grinding sessions, do you feel any core features or gameplay elements are missing or underdeveloped? If yes, please describe.
YES. Archetype depth. Every single archetype currently is a well-rounded archetype that can do everything. Depth into the trees will create meaningful choices. Do I want to be a frost mage, fire mage, DoT archetype, burst rogue, mobility rogue, stealth rogue, bomb-class fighter, sustain fighter, immobile juggernaut tank, mobile gap closing tank, support cleric, radiant cleric, utility bard, damage bard, healing bard, mana bard, mobile auto attacking ranger, snipe burst ranger, AoE ranger, utility ranger, etc.
There's a lot of ways to play these archetypes that may be unlocked with secondary archetypes but currently there's not a lot of depth that makes the players make choices. There is only "you have all the skills available once you hit level 25" and I don't think that's a good thing. More choices, more skills, more adaptability, more playstyles, more diversity in general will make balancing harder... good. When games are too balanced then they start feeling stale and metas form. We can look at Phase 2.5 PvP tourney for that. When everyone had the same DR then the fights lasted longer, sure, but once you take down one person the fight was completely over for most scenarios. When healing is too strong, mitigation is too high, and TTK takes forever, you cannot turn the tables in a fight.
- Which archetype do you find the least fun to play? Why?
I played all archetypes to level 25 at some point. I think they're all fun to play in their own ways, but I also think that there's a lot missing from every archetype as well.
Bard: One of, if not the strongest classes at the moment. Has really strong DPS in resonant stacking and using their melodies. Has one of the biggest AoE stuns with Mesmerizing Dance that create big advantages in PvP. Have heals and good clutch moments with Gambit for group play. Also have a very strong ability in Marionette for PvP and PvE pulls. Tuned on the higher end, could reduce resonant dump damage. Ranged class with lots of utility, mobility, and damage. Jack of all trades and master of some at the moment. Bard, like a lot of archetypes suffer from lack of archetype depth.
Cleric: Healing is too damn OP. Look at the numbers you give this class with the amount of buttons to press for healing and you will see why this class can soak up all the damage AoE, over-time, clutch moments, etc. Purify being no cooldown for wiping debuffs is massive. Turned a support class into a piano key class and that's fun. Please for the love of god tune the numbers down. Cleric, like a lot of archetypes suffer from lack of archetype depth.
Fighter: This archetype has the most fluid rotation out of them all. It's extremely fun and people love this class. It has zero durability and revolves around blood fusion to exist and when that cooldown is down it is no longer good. The damage coming from them is not enough to burst in the current meta which makes them extremely weak as well. While it may be one of the most fun classes with one of the best kits, it is lacking in utility, durability, sustain, and damage for what it is meant to be. Fighter, like a lot of archetypes suffer from lack of archetype depth.
Mage: Mage is probably the most OP damage class at the moment on PTR. With lack of magic resist in the gearing options they do a lot of damage to physical classes since light armor is not currently in the game giving bonuses to physical users. The lack of gear diversity is making Mage the best class in the game at the moment to play. They have the ability to make big plays, do tons of damage at range, and are relatively safe with all their damage and have a huge defensive with Shell making them tanky as well. This has to be the absolute best archetype at the moment. Mage, like a lot of archetypes suffer from lack of archetype depth.
Ranger: This is by far my favorite archetype in every MMO and has always gotten shafted due to power in range/mobility. Ranger currently is less mobile than immobile while supposedly it is supposed to be the second most mobile next to Rogue. So far, Bard is the most mobile class. Ranger is the brain dead drop vine field, snipe, lightning reload, snipe headshot get a pick class. Reign of death for wounds, and scattershot to spread big dick damage... but does less than mage and isn't really that much damage to be fair. You're not getting picks solo anymore with increased TTK and the cast time of snipe is not a fast kill and will probably get healed through. Having movement speed decreased while shooting as a ranger feels really bad and should have a passive that allows Rangers to auto without decreasing movement speed. Strider is good, but not that good. Disengage being your only real way to get out of anything and bear traps are so niche they're not that great. Focus as a class resource is good and is a good way to bump damage but it is still lacking in terms of magic archetypes. Ranger, like a lot of archetypes suffer from lack of archetype depth.
Rogue: My baby. My one true love that I walked away from Ranger for. True invisibility is amazing... when it works. It's by far the most overloaded kit in the game outside of bard. It ALSO has the worst damage in comparison. It doesn't fulfill the burst class. Poison stacking feels like a mechanic that's good for extended fights for PvE but in PvP it's an afterthought and also not really applicable. I also don't want Rogues to feel forced into Poisons--which it is. It's by far one of the coolest archetypes in Ashes of Creation but is severely underloaded in numbers due to it's overloaded kit and that feels bad. A lot of it's "overloaded kit" comes from the amount of CC it grants that makes people upset, but in reality, you're not hitting major CC for a long time in group PvP. It's hardly worthwhile in PvE. It's no mesmerizing dance and marionette class, that's for sure. It's relatively weak in comparison to other archetypes all around... does good in 1v1s though. Which, to be fair, does not exist in Ashes of Creation outside of dueling with all of the group play mechanics and gets gimped by the over-tuned corruption system for those that want to fight people in the open world. Rogue, like a lot of archetypes suffer from lack of archetype depth.
Tank: This has to be the strongest physical based archetype. Good mitigation, good damage, good support skills, good utility, and has some good mobility. This archetype is probably really good if not for the constant clicking of grit whenever it's off cooldown (which is not long). The grapple has to be the most frustrating part of playing tank. Having control in PvP and in PvE, you are the archetype that everyone wants in their party. However... Tank, like a lot of archetypes suffer from lack of archetype depth.
Cleric: Healing is too damn OP. Look at the numbers you give this class with the amount of buttons to press for healing and you will see why this class can soak up all the damage AoE, over-time, clutch moments, etc. Purify being no cooldown for wiping debuffs is massive. Turned a support class into a piano key class and that's fun. Please for the love of god tune the numbers down. Cleric, like a lot of archetypes suffer from lack of archetype depth.
Fighter: This archetype has the most fluid rotation out of them all. It's extremely fun and people love this class. It has zero durability and revolves around blood fusion to exist and when that cooldown is down it is no longer good. The damage coming from them is not enough to burst in the current meta which makes them extremely weak as well. While it may be one of the most fun classes with one of the best kits, it is lacking in utility, durability, sustain, and damage for what it is meant to be. Fighter, like a lot of archetypes suffer from lack of archetype depth.
Mage: Mage is probably the most OP damage class at the moment on PTR. With lack of magic resist in the gearing options they do a lot of damage to physical classes since light armor is not currently in the game giving bonuses to physical users. The lack of gear diversity is making Mage the best class in the game at the moment to play. They have the ability to make big plays, do tons of damage at range, and are relatively safe with all their damage and have a huge defensive with Shell making them tanky as well. This has to be the absolute best archetype at the moment. Mage, like a lot of archetypes suffer from lack of archetype depth.
Ranger: This is by far my favorite archetype in every MMO and has always gotten shafted due to power in range/mobility. Ranger currently is less mobile than immobile while supposedly it is supposed to be the second most mobile next to Rogue. So far, Bard is the most mobile class. Ranger is the brain dead drop vine field, snipe, lightning reload, snipe headshot get a pick class. Reign of death for wounds, and scattershot to spread big dick damage... but does less than mage and isn't really that much damage to be fair. You're not getting picks solo anymore with increased TTK and the cast time of snipe is not a fast kill and will probably get healed through. Having movement speed decreased while shooting as a ranger feels really bad and should have a passive that allows Rangers to auto without decreasing movement speed. Strider is good, but not that good. Disengage being your only real way to get out of anything and bear traps are so niche they're not that great. Focus as a class resource is good and is a good way to bump damage but it is still lacking in terms of magic archetypes. Ranger, like a lot of archetypes suffer from lack of archetype depth.
Rogue: My baby. My one true love that I walked away from Ranger for. True invisibility is amazing... when it works. It's by far the most overloaded kit in the game outside of bard. It ALSO has the worst damage in comparison. It doesn't fulfill the burst class. Poison stacking feels like a mechanic that's good for extended fights for PvE but in PvP it's an afterthought and also not really applicable. I also don't want Rogues to feel forced into Poisons--which it is. It's by far one of the coolest archetypes in Ashes of Creation but is severely underloaded in numbers due to it's overloaded kit and that feels bad. A lot of it's "overloaded kit" comes from the amount of CC it grants that makes people upset, but in reality, you're not hitting major CC for a long time in group PvP. It's hardly worthwhile in PvE. It's no mesmerizing dance and marionette class, that's for sure. It's relatively weak in comparison to other archetypes all around... does good in 1v1s though. Which, to be fair, does not exist in Ashes of Creation outside of dueling with all of the group play mechanics and gets gimped by the over-tuned corruption system for those that want to fight people in the open world. Rogue, like a lot of archetypes suffer from lack of archetype depth.
Tank: This has to be the strongest physical based archetype. Good mitigation, good damage, good support skills, good utility, and has some good mobility. This archetype is probably really good if not for the constant clicking of grit whenever it's off cooldown (which is not long). The grapple has to be the most frustrating part of playing tank. Having control in PvP and in PvE, you are the archetype that everyone wants in their party. However... Tank, like a lot of archetypes suffer from lack of archetype depth.
- Are there any combat systems or mechanics you feel need more development or refinement? Please explain.
During group combat or grinding sessions, do you feel any core features or gameplay elements are missing or underdeveloped? If yes, please describe.
YES. Archetype depth. Every single archetype currently is a well-rounded archetype that can do everything. Depth into the trees will create meaningful choices. Do I want to be a frost mage, fire mage, DoT archetype, burst rogue, mobility rogue, stealth rogue, bomb-class fighter, sustain fighter, immobile juggernaut tank, mobile gap closing tank, support cleric, radiant cleric, utility bard, damage bard, healing bard, mana bard, mobile auto attacking ranger, snipe burst ranger, AoE ranger, utility ranger, etc.
There's a lot of ways to play these archetypes that may be unlocked with secondary archetypes but currently there's not a lot of depth that makes the players make choices. There is only "you have all the skills available once you hit level 25" and I don't think that's a good thing. More choices, more skills, more adaptability, more playstyles, more diversity in general will make balancing harder... good. When games are too balanced then they start feeling stale and metas form. We can look at Phase 2.5 PvP tourney for that. When everyone had the same DR then the fights lasted longer, sure, but once you take down one person the fight was completely over for most scenarios. When healing is too strong, mitigation is too high, and TTK takes forever, you cannot turn the tables in a fight.
Lloyd
2
Re: 📝 Dev Discussion - Archetype Vibe Check
Which archetype do you find the most fun to play? Why?
I enjoy cleric immensely because I prefer to play healers. It has the core kit for healing that I really enjoy. I do believe the damage tools are a bit bare and lack a design that lends itself to a "war of attrition" playstyle though. Something like a mana burn, a slowly building damage that punishes someone for not killing the cleric quickly.
I also think cleric's mobility is awful presently. PVP isn't a cat and mouse game presently. Just a cat and unmoving cat toy game. I'd love to see some kit choices that allow clerics to lean into damage and unholy themes but have it be a compelling choice in the talent tree. Also, something that is more "miraculous" and "big" that feels like a god intervening on their behalf. Big bonus points if it can be augmented by their religion.
That might be a big way to help clerics out with flavor, is through religious augments to their abilities.
Which archetype do you find the least fun to play? Why?
I have not played much of other classes because I am not interested but I did enjoy them when I dabbled. I have seen fighter and tank suffer the most as far as player count as compared to earlier iterations of the game, so they likely need some love.
Are there any combat systems or mechanics you feel need more development or refinement? Please explain.
Discriminators for friendly v. unfriendly abilities would be great. Meaning tinge the abilities with red around the edge of it if it is a harmful ability. Friendly abilities can be left alone visually.
During group combat or grinding sessions, do you feel any core features or gameplay elements are missing or underdeveloped? If yes, please describe.
For higher levels I hope there's a few more interaction between abilities archetypes/class. I'd love for there to be some sort of team up abilities that take time to charge to create a significant ability (think like a mage and a summoner conjuring a golem or cleric and bard to create an impactful buff.) I'd love some longer cooldown abilities that are compelling when you use them that have a bigger impact that require another class or character to do it.
That and augments (not just subclass, but racial and religious as well.)
I enjoy cleric immensely because I prefer to play healers. It has the core kit for healing that I really enjoy. I do believe the damage tools are a bit bare and lack a design that lends itself to a "war of attrition" playstyle though. Something like a mana burn, a slowly building damage that punishes someone for not killing the cleric quickly.
I also think cleric's mobility is awful presently. PVP isn't a cat and mouse game presently. Just a cat and unmoving cat toy game. I'd love to see some kit choices that allow clerics to lean into damage and unholy themes but have it be a compelling choice in the talent tree. Also, something that is more "miraculous" and "big" that feels like a god intervening on their behalf. Big bonus points if it can be augmented by their religion.
That might be a big way to help clerics out with flavor, is through religious augments to their abilities.
Which archetype do you find the least fun to play? Why?
I have not played much of other classes because I am not interested but I did enjoy them when I dabbled. I have seen fighter and tank suffer the most as far as player count as compared to earlier iterations of the game, so they likely need some love.
Are there any combat systems or mechanics you feel need more development or refinement? Please explain.
Discriminators for friendly v. unfriendly abilities would be great. Meaning tinge the abilities with red around the edge of it if it is a harmful ability. Friendly abilities can be left alone visually.
During group combat or grinding sessions, do you feel any core features or gameplay elements are missing or underdeveloped? If yes, please describe.
For higher levels I hope there's a few more interaction between abilities archetypes/class. I'd love for there to be some sort of team up abilities that take time to charge to create a significant ability (think like a mage and a summoner conjuring a golem or cleric and bard to create an impactful buff.) I'd love some longer cooldown abilities that are compelling when you use them that have a bigger impact that require another class or character to do it.
That and augments (not just subclass, but racial and religious as well.)
Leukael
2
Re: Mepps Joins Intrepid Studios’ Community Management Team!
wishing you an awesome start and lots of success ahead
Re: Mepps Joins Intrepid Studios’ Community Management Team!
Hey Mepps! Just someone from one of your old communities signing up here to wish you all the best. You were an amazing Community Manager for us, always paying attention and ever-involved. I'm sure you'll carry it on, and they're lucky to have you....
undrline
1
Re: How Solo Players (Basically) Saved MMOs From Going Extinct
We have differing opinions of what "a real mmo" is. To me, if you can clear the game and majority of its content w/o uttering a single word in chat - that's a single player game.TheDarkSorcerer wrote: »Nah, I don’t agree. Games like GW2 and ESO prove you can be solo-friendly and still be a real MMO. GW2 is one of the most active MMOs in 2025, super chill for solo play but still full of group content and community.
While I understand what it is you are actually saying, I'm not a fan of this way of wording it.
Even back in 2004, if you were in a guild that was organized, you didn't need to use in game chat at all. You could complete quests, dungeons, raids, everything that is the core of an MMORPG, all without needing to use chat at all.
Few people would have, because chat drama is great. However, it wasn't necessary to fully participate in what an MMORPG is all about.
Noaani
1
Phase 3 New Player Experience on the PTR
The new player experience for the Halfling/Orc starting zone feels really mixed. Because the is the entry point for new players to the game it is critical to make this experience easy to follow as well as rewarding. I want to start with the good and then cover the gaps.
What is working
The player's first experience when they land is having a quest giver calling them over. This is great design, but so many elements are missing to guide the player through this first cave. Perhaps successive quests, or some game design that always points them the right way. Glowing bugs or mushrooms perhaps that are different colors in different parts of the caverns (yes I know there are differential enemies, but this is pretty consistent). It is pretty easy to gt going in a circle.
What is working
- The number of quests that are given is awesome
- The enemy challenge level seems just about right
- Love the little caches of goodies
- As a new player finding your way around is pretty challenging. There isn't enough in the way of directions
- No minimap that helps you navigate the cave
- At night time the cave is nearly impossible to navigate on top of being hard to navigate anyway either need racial darkvision or some sort of torch
- Just lighting in general sun shining in places during the day so bright that there is no way to see where you are going while walking on a ledge
- Swim through the bottom of the water and be unable to get back up to the water in areas
- The quests are marked ish, but there is no clear so what to them everything points you to bonfire
The player's first experience when they land is having a quest giver calling them over. This is great design, but so many elements are missing to guide the player through this first cave. Perhaps successive quests, or some game design that always points them the right way. Glowing bugs or mushrooms perhaps that are different colors in different parts of the caverns (yes I know there are differential enemies, but this is pretty consistent). It is pretty easy to gt going in a circle.
