What makes me aggro in every mmorpg?

ArchivedUser

The really one thingy I hate in every mmorpg and I hope it will not be in AoC is Onehit-Kill.
I'am since Dark Age of Camelot a friend of PvP (RvR) and there was allways these special guys who sneak and onehit kill someone without any chance to react too.
So I really hope or wish me that in AoC it will not be possible to kill someone with only one hit or skill. It ruins the gameplay of the others and these mostly log off then and say good bye game.

So what is your No-Go in an mmorpg (pve/pvp)?

ArchivedUser

@Spezies , so far, in terms of PvE, I'd have to say Hack-&-Slash Combat-Style

I say this because these types of Combat-Styles prevents the NPC from having a Fair advantage. And their A.I. is usually below average  -  sometimes the NPC Opponent won't even do anything as you attack them - they just ... " stare at you " ; just letting you kill them.

I'd prefer my PvE Opponents to give me some sort of Challenge - even at the Beginning of the Game, such as: 

NPC " easy opponent(s) " knowing some sort of defensive abilities to survive. Or trying to invoke some sort of spacing tactic seldomly, or not dieing so quickly, or inflicting a Poison-like Ability & trying to stall for a bit while evading some of my attacks - thus letting the Poison worsen. And maybe knowing some Healing ability ?

(but to an extent)

There's a few others - but that's the gist of it 

ArchivedUser

P2W
Excessive time gating
Lag
Repetitive grindy content
Limited appearance options
Game systems that allow toxic behavior (eg ninja loot, PK griefing,...) 
Nerfs for no valid reason
Studios that don't listen to feedback
Dumbed down mechanics
Poor user interface design
Bugs that never get fixed
Stagnant, boring end-game
Content droughts

To name a few

ArchivedUser

For me, while it isn't game ruining for me if they do do it, I would want levels to matter in the PVP zones around caravans and during sieges. I don't know what their plans are but I have seen games in the past either ignore, set a cap or dampen the level difference between players in a zone. I wouldn't mind the latter 2 as much but I like the idea that if a really strong player wants to defend something and a group of weaker players attack, they will get their asses kicked.

ArchivedUser

lexmax said:

P2W
...

To name a few

Ha you are so right

ArchivedUser

While one-hit-kills are definitely anti-fun, equally bad are abilities which render you completely useless/helpess, also. In DAOC, there was the Stun which froze you like a statue while folks beat you to death, and there was absolutely nothing you could do about it.

ArchivedUser

lexmax said:

P2W
Excessive time gating
Lag
Repetitive grindy content
Limited appearance options
Game systems that allow toxic behavior (eg ninja loot, PK griefing,...) 
Nerfs for no valid reason
Studios that don't listen to feedback
Dumbed down mechanics
Poor user interface design
Bugs that never get fixed
Stagnant, boring end-game
Content droughts

To name a few

Lmfao so true - that too. Its just cringy to think about 

ArchivedUser

Rabbit_Games said:

..., also. In DAOC, there was the Stun which froze you like a statue while folks beat you to death, and there was absolutely nothing you could do about it.

yes this stun/root orgy was really bad if you not had the right RealmAbility.

ArchivedUser

Rabbit_Games said:

..., also. In DAOC, there was the Stun which froze you like a statue while folks beat you to death, and there was absolutely nothing you could do about it.

yes this stun/root orgy was really bad if you not had the right RealmAbility.

ArchivedUser

The taunt spell.

Makes me aggro all the time. 

ArchivedUser

Being able to cast skills when no Line of Sight is available. Quite annoying

ArchivedUser

Oh and i forgot.
I really hope the developer will do a anti-huge-zerg mechanic like a debuff if to many ppl run in a horde. Something to reduce the effectiveness of zergs.

ArchivedUser

I like the Lemax method.. perhaps i'll draw mine out a bit.

Major aggros. 

 P2W & Gatcha whaling.  I know these aren't true MMOs.. but every multiplayer game these days seems to be some variation where you can roll the dice for a price, and the prize goes to the whale with the biggest wallet.  When i think of MMO whales, I always picture SIN from FFX... yes we're all playing the same game, but you start out as a gigantic beast of doom with ridiculous power and no purpose but to ruin it for everyone else, and i start out as a stupid punk kid whose mother dresses him funny, and I can barely take you on even with the help of everyone i know.  

 Corporate Greed.  See above.  Conquer Online, is a case in point.. this was a game that had a fairly steady playerbase, and they had a cash shop with limitations on monthly purchases.  It was very well balanced, so that those who had limited time could spend a little to keep pace with those who played hardcore and those who played hardcore worked together could still match any buyer without spending.   It was a good system and the economy of the game was a lot of fun.   But then, corporate greed set in, on came the Gatcha machine, and the game was overtaken by whales.  Overnight the economy was destroyed and became useless.

 Lag.  So many games ruined by lag.  Please don't be one of them!

 Min-Maxing.   One of my MMO pet peeves, because it turns up everywhere.  I know its hard to avoid but it really sucks the soul out of a game, when everyone is following the same set of "best build" instructions to min-max their stats or what-not.  I much prefer a game where individuality at the stat level has value as well.

 Nooo... Its not 'Wow' its 'Woah' totally different dude.  
Nobody wants another themepark WoW clone.. seriously.
Don't beleive me?  Ask this guy:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jTHsll9LFZ4
I really hope that with this game, every time the Devs are adding in something that is a 'staple' of MMOs, they pause and take a deep look at it and ask themselves 'Is this something special to bring our game to life, or is this just something we're doing, because it worked for WOW?'

 Economy/Crafting doesn't matter.   A lot of games are pretty good here, but then again, a lot of games aren't.  The economy should be a huge part of any truly player driven game.  Likewise, player crafting should mean something too.  People enjoy crafting, but I would struggle to name an MMO where the crafted items don't inevitably fall short of the drops, and very quickly too. 

 Chat/Market spammers/scammers.  This has been the bane of many games.   I'm particularly reminded of EVE Online, where every market space was overwhelmed with spambots on the one hand, and scams on the other.  Finding someone to actually trade with often meant spending 20 minutes blocking people on the chat first.

 New features instead of old fixes.  Pokemon Go became notorious for this pretty quickly, and a lot of MMOs do.  They'll have a particular mechanic that is completely broken, and the playerbase demands a fix, but instead of fixing the broken thing, they keep rolling out other features.  These features may not be intended as an attempt at distraction, but that is how they are typically perceived. Fix what is broken, then work on the next big thing.

 End game stagnation & repetition.  A lot of MMO players will claim that 'the real game begins when you hit max level'.  That may be true.  But in most cases, the real game ends shortly thereafter, unless you really enjoy repetition.  The game needs to have more to it than just leveling up. 

 Single player games with multiplayer content.  I'm looking at you FFXIV.  You're very pretty, and single player games are fun, but if i wanted to play one, I would.  An MMO should be a game where the synergy (or enmity) between players is a driving force.  Squaresoft excels at storytelling, but as a player in a Squaresoft game, you're just visiting, you're not really a part of it. 

Minor Agro

  Time gating.  I guess it isn't so bad if everyone is dealing with it at the same pace, but too much is certainly annoying.  I personally didn't mind the time gating in EVE online, but i know it certainly pissed off a lot of people. 

 Who wore it better?   What can be more embarrassing than showing up to raid the oscars, and you're dressed the same way as the healer?  Having the same face as the healer. That's what. 

 Unpolished product.  I really doubt we have to worry about this one here, based on the visuals so far.  A lot of MMOs launch with an unpolished look and feel, and it just leaves a bad taste in the mouth.

 Leveling out of (instanced) content.  I dunno how often this happens.   The example i'm thinking of is Terra, where the 'main' storyline incorporates various dungeons, but in its current form, it is so easy to level up in Terra, that you quickly pass the level at which you can access those dungeons using the pug-finder.

 Grind.  Its on the minor list, because grind, done right, doesn't feel like grind.  There should be some effort put in, to get to the next stage in MMO life, but not too much grind, not so much that it becomes madness.  

 Griefing.  Its on the minor list, because there is something truly satisfying about breaking your foot off in a griefer's arse... and without griefing, that wouldn't be possible.   

 Unreasonable time commitment.  The MMO community is divided between the casual and the hardcore, and that's fine.   With this comment i'm once again thinking of Conquer Online.  Conquer had a 'guild war' that ran from Friday at 6pm until Sunday at 5pm, or something like that.  It was kind of ridiculous, but in order to avoid losing, you pretty much had to sit in front of your screen for 48 hours straight every weekend and cancel the rest of your life.   Success in the game should require effort, not enslavement. 


I imagine i'll think of more, but that's it for the moment.

ArchivedUser

Stupid levels of leveling. Seemingly only to waste time

Huge level disparities that just cause massive gaps between pve and pvp players. Always reasons why people can't play together. Sorry you're too low you don't deal enough damage. Sorry you're too high, you'll make us gain no exp. Oh I can't fight this ganker because he is at level cap and that is 70 levels above me.

Huge stat disparities. In PvP you just can't deal damage to someone because he has 5 levels on you so his dodge rate is higher than your accuracy.

gearscore. I'm sorry, I don't care about your skill because you deal 1% less damage than us.

split second mechanics. Oh well we wiped because the healer has a 100ms ping and can't dodge the mechanics.

high level caps.... I really hate this one. Waste of time. Artificial time sink. Artificial difficulty. Makes everything you work hard for obsolete. Why waste your time getting that epic sword when you can get two more levels and find a green off of a nameless mob with better stats.

level based equipment. What is the point of this one? Just stat inflation?

stat inflation. Well we have to make raiders feel more powerful than the peons that just do normal content so we have to jack up their stats. Plus we have to make harder raids and we can't think of any useful mechanics so they'll just hit harder... so now we need to inflate the stats more. Oh an expansion came out. Time for the greens of the next level to be better. Now we have exponential stat inflation. Please stick with linear stat growth.

Useless crafters!!!!!!!!! Come on! If you are going to add a freaking game element don't make it just to waste our time. Don't be afraid of allowing crafters to create equipment better than dungeons. Just make it more difficult. Allow crafters to repair all equipment with diminishing returns. Make stuff break so we don't have a dried up demand. Allow us to craft for the nodes.

creating content exclusively for the cash shop. Sure add new models of mounts and pets but ffs allow us to get this in-game. We are paying a sub. Just have a special skin just from the cash shop.

I think this is enough anger for one day. lol

ArchivedUser

Fantasy based but reasonable. Aka make race/levels actually matter in comparison to gear.  My first mmo was eq and I loathed the idea of joining a uber guild.  I ran a tight knit evil guild and we helped develop players who then abandoned us for said uber guilds.....where was I going with this? Oh I remember.  I was a troll warrior and I sat watching/aiding my budding recruits slaying sand giants with the occasional  whack and letting them pound on me.  A dark elf shadow knight half my level rolled up and proceeded to out damage me with the raid gear she had tagged along on. I don't want race to be a purely cosmetic addon nor do I want some lame passives that I never bother to use to be the only difference between me and every other idiot.

ArchivedUser

lexmax said:

P2W
Excessive time gating
Lag
Repetitive grindy content
Limited appearance options
Game systems that allow toxic behavior (eg ninja loot, PK griefing,...) 
Nerfs for no valid reason
Studios that don't listen to feedback
Dumbed down mechanics
Poor user interface design
Bugs that never get fixed
Stagnant, boring end-game
Content droughts

To name a few

Sounds like 90 percent of the MMOs ive played

ArchivedUser

@wraven and @Loyheta, thanks for your amazing descriptions Why don't these other studios understand how frustrating these things are!? I guess if they did understand we'd be playing other games; so in a way, thank you other studios for helping to usher in Ashes of Creation

ArchivedUser

lexmax said:

@wraven and @Loyheta, thanks for your amazing descriptions Why don't these other studios understand how frustrating these things are!? I guess if they did understand we'd be playing other games; so in a way, thank you other studios for helping to usher in Ashes of Creation

Amen to that!

ArchivedUser

It has been mentioned already but Crafting not being meaningful is something that has annoyed me in every MMO I have played. What you can craft is usually so far below the level of items gained through dungeons/raids, that crafting really is a waste of time, and you are only taking an entire profession to craft one or two supplementary items to sell.

Make crafting Epic. Make crafters able to make some of the best gear in the game but make it hard to do, materials rare to find, multi-tiered crafting (multiple recipes utilised to create the final product).

If there is depth in crafting the longevity of the game, and the community, is extensive.

ArchivedUser

I say, make crafting required for ALL gear!  What sense does it make to kill a rabbit and it drops a lvl 18 moonluck filibuster magicmusk scale armor of the bootlicker.  Rabbits drop rabbit poop. Period. 

Now if a rabbit were to drop a rabbit pelt after being skinned and rabbit bones after being dipped in acid.. give those to a crafter and stand aside sir magic is about to happen

ArchivedUser

Sooo... I am on board with all the and things listed.  However, one more thing, and it is just my personal peeve, is excessive-hand-holding-tutorials.  I suppose that falls into "dumbed down mechanics" that @lexmax listed, but I feel it is in a whole category of its own.  As many have said in various other threads, most games are not creating any revolutionary new mechanics and systems to the MMORPG genre.  Are there some slight variations and changes?  Sure!  But not enough to warrant the tedious and long tutorials.  Simplified, short, tutorials to explain some major system mechanics, sure, but most of the rest is just unnecessary, in my opinion. 

ArchivedUser

lexmax said:

P2W
Excessive time gating
Lag
Repetitive grindy content
Limited appearance options
Game systems that allow toxic behavior (eg ninja loot, PK griefing,...) 
Nerfs for no valid reason
Studios that don't listen to feedback
Dumbed down mechanics
Poor user interface design
Bugs that never get fixed
Stagnant, boring end-game
Content droughts

To name a few

I mean... 'THIS' and I'd add anything that goes against or hinders RP in a big way. 

ArchivedUser

Vhanz said:

I mean... 'THIS' and I'd add anything that goes against or hinders RP in a big way. 

Oh yes!  I forgot to add that to my list as well.  Good one @Vhanz

ArchivedUser

Wraeven said:

I say, make crafting required for ALL gear!  What sense does it make to kill a rabbit and it drops a lvl 18 moonluck filibuster magicmusk scale armor of the bootlicker.  Rabbits drop rabbit poop. Period. 

Now if a rabbit were to drop a rabbit pelt after being skinned and rabbit bones after being dipped in acid.. give those to a crafter and stand aside sir magic is about to happen

Also using said rabbit in a food recipe before cleaning the bones. 
Crafting imo is the backbone of community and economic continuity in mmos. 
*crosses fingers* for a truly robust crafting system.

ArchivedUser

Agree with the OP, being killed before you can reach is terrible. Can be because of stun locks, burst openers, 20ppl focus fire in pvp without a way to counter like dodge rolling etc.

my number one thos has to be laggy, desync, hitching aka not smooth gameplay. I expect it to do what i want when i want or i get grumpy

ArchivedUser

Wraeven said:

  
 Corporate Greed.  See above.  Conquer Online, 

A fellow conquer player!! Played since beta till about 4 or 5 years ago! That game was sooooooo much fun. Im still looking for a game to make me feel how i did playing conquer. I dont think ill ever find it. Ever....
But yes the corporate greed later on in that game. Just mind boggling. Ppl think perfect world and archeage are p2w...lol 

Actually i really liked 95% of everything about conquer in its early days. Its my all time fav mmo. 

So to add to the list!
Getting a new set of gear every X number of levels i hate.
Im fine with high level caps, makes it more fun so EVERYONE isnt max level
But i like to work on  the same set of gear from the moment i step foot into the world, till the moment i step foot out of the world. 

ArchivedUser

0 secs - Your adversary approaches. You stand and watch.
1 secs - Your adversary is before of you. You stand and watch.
2 secs - Your adversary begins to raise his Great Axe. You stand and watch.
3 secs - Your adversary raises his axe even further. You stand and watch.
4 secs - Your adversary is still raising his axe right above his head and flashing red. You stand and watch.
5 secs - Your adversary drops his axe. You fall and die.
6 secs - You complain to Intrepid that someone one shot you while your enemy teabags your corpse.

LMAO! Sorry couldnt resist making this point. In principal people should not be able to one shot you. But if its obvious they are building a power skill designed to do massive damage....and you stand there. Its not much different to standing in that red circle thats roasting you alive at the end of the day Either way you should die of stupidity.

ArchivedUser

BaddiNaddi said:

For me, while it isn't game ruining for me if they do do it, I would want levels to matter in the PVP zones around caravans and during sieges. I don't know what their plans are but I have seen games in the past either ignore, set a cap or dampen the level difference between players in a zone. I wouldn't mind the latter 2 as much but I like the idea that if a really strong player wants to defend something and a group of weaker players attack, they will get their asses kicked.

Weaker player ? You want weaker players so you can feel bad ass when you kill them ? You must be so skilled

ArchivedUser

"Catchups" and progression resets. In WoW, you spend hours upon hours grinding for gear and artifact power and whatnot... and then come next season: "Catch-up time! Everyone gets to start over". All your effort is... erased.

I understand that having no barrier to entry makes the game accessible for new players and casuals, but please. No one wants to waste their time grinding  for a temporary reward.