Caravans

ArchivedUser

While I love the idea of being able to attack caravans in a pvp style, I have concerns as how bad this might get in AoC.   I can easily see mass guilds stopping every caravan from ever making it to any city.   I know you can pay for guards and such, but really, at the end of the day, players can overcome this if given any chance.   I was wondering how you might handle this.  

You might limit how much a player can actually lose from a caravan.  So, even if his caravan is completely destroyed, maybe he still get half his stuff in credit, like mid evil insurance.  

Maybe the more a certain route is hit, the more tough the NPCs guards get.  

You could have illusionary caravans as decoys. Maybe, once in a while,  you can have a "fake" or "trap" caravan, designed to kill raiders, with heavy guards, or even massively powerful creatures, ready to kill any attackers.  

Maybe players can pay a hefty cost to have their goods be magically guarded from theft.  Maybe invisible boxes or completely invisible caravans.  Maybe charge for a flight caravan, which could still get attacked, but much more difficult to raid.

Anyway, just spit balling....

ArchivedUser

If a big guild is cutting off a trade route then an  equally big guild or a group of guilds will just have to beat the shit out of them.

ArchivedUser

A trade route that would be worth it would be going to a fairly large city. So unless you envision people restricting trade to their own city, you would have a large group of people from that city invested in rooting out any large, organized effort to disrupt trade. Then again, that is the whole point of meaningful conflict.

I had a thread a while back where I was wondering whether there will be indicators of how "plump" a caravan is for looting. Or if we can send worthless items via caravan. I would love to be able to send a caravan of manure along a contested route, with a large guard contingent, to have people salivate over and attack, only to find it is a ruse and they literally have shit to show for it.

ArchivedUser

UnknownSystemError said:

A trade route that would be worth it would be going to a fairly large city. So unless you envision people restricting trade to their own city, you would have a large group of people from that city invested in rooting out any large, organized effort to disrupt trade. Then again, that is the whole point of meaningful conflict.

I had a thread a while back where I was wondering whether there will be indicators of how "plump" a caravan is for looting. Or if we can send worthless items via caravan. I would love to be able to send a caravan of manure along a contested route, with a large guard contingent, to have people salivate over and attack, only to find it is a ruse and they literally have shit to show for it.

That would actually be awesomely funny.  I know that me and my peeps are planning caravan raiding to the nth degree, so something like this, while mad in the moment, would certainly be a great story later, especially if the pvp is epic.

ArchivedUser

Crymoar said:

If a big guild is cutting off a trade route then an  equally big guild or a group of guilds will just have to beat the shit out of them.

Aa fucking men

ArchivedUser

Trade is going to be really important to cities and the inhabitants of those cities (probably big guilds) because of how resources are regionalized. Attacking a caravan will probably flag you red and ruin your day when those bounty hunters and angry guilds come hunting. IIRC they said you can hire on players to guard caravans as well. I imagine a lot of players will do this for quick cash.

UnknownSystemError said:

I had a thread a while back where I was wondering whether there will be indicators of how "plump" a caravan is for looting. Or if we can send worthless items via caravan. I would love to be able to send a caravan of manure along a contested route, with a large guard contingent, to have people salivate over and attack, only to find it is a ruse and they literally have shit to show for it.

I imagine caravans will have a weight limit that will work like our own inventories. Maybe they'll have different visuals for 30% 60% and 90% capacity. I would love to see that scenario. It would be great for them to attack, get flagged, see their literal load, and then get swarmed by people wanting to kill and rob them.

Flatline said:

Crymoar said:

If a big guild is cutting off a trade route then an  equally big guild or a group of guilds will just have to beat the shit out of them.

Aa fucking men

What is Aa doing?

ArchivedUser

I agree with previous posters that guilds themselves will want to protect caravans they wont want to attack and destroy everyone. They will be walking next to them protecting them.

ArchivedUser

I wonder if some of the modification you will be able to "craft" for caravans will be an increase in the toughness of the npc guards you can hire. I remember the reveal of one from the dungeon crawl video and Jeff commenting that "Someone must be worried about his stuff, look at all the guards he hired." So while we can do escort of our caravans, it also looks like we will be able to beef them up with npcs.

ArchivedUser

Loyheta said:

Trade is going to be really important to cities and the inhabitants of those cities (probably big guilds) because of how resources are regionalized. Attacking a caravan will probably flag you red and ruin your day when those bounty hunters and angry guilds come hunting. IIRC they said you can hire on players to guard caravans as well. I imagine a lot of players will do this for quick cash.

UnknownSystemError said:

I had a thread a while back where I was wondering whether there will be indicators of how "plump" a caravan is for looting. Or if we can send worthless items via caravan. I would love to be able to send a caravan of manure along a contested route, with a large guard contingent, to have people salivate over and attack, only to find it is a ruse and they literally have shit to show for it.

I imagine caravans will have a weight limit that will work like our own inventories. Maybe they'll have different visuals for 30% 60% and 90% capacity. I would love to see that scenario. It would be great for them to attack, get flagged, see their literal load, and then get swarmed by people wanting to kill and rob them.

Flatline said:

Crymoar said:

If a big guild is cutting off a trade route then an  equally big guild or a group of guilds will just have to beat the shit out of them.

Aa fucking men

What is Aa doing?

I do not believe Caravans will flag you red(corrupted). When approaching a Caravan you have a specific choice to attack or defend. Caravans are in a sense a walking bubble of PvP. Risk vs Reward of using them. 

ArchivedUser

Yep everyone will be purple.

ArchivedUser

UnknownSystemError said:

I wonder if some of the modification you will be able to "craft" for caravans will be an increase in the toughness of the npc guards you can hire. I remember the reveal of one from the dungeon crawl video and Jeff commenting that "Someone must be worried about his stuff, look at all the guards he hired." So while we can do escort of our caravans, it also looks like we will be able to beef them up with npcs.

I think it's safe to assume you're right in this case.  The most logical upgrades are capacity, protection (guards/health), and a SLIGHT speed increase.  

ArchivedUser

I think this is just something we will have to deal with. It will be hard to cut off all trade routes, but this just adds to the strategy of the game. Maybe the guilds are cutting off all trade routes because they will siege the city soon and they want to cripple the economy so the government cant afford defensive things like guards. It may be annoying to deal with when it happens to you, but it really adds a lot of depth to the game.

ArchivedUser

Fwuppers said:

I think this is just something we will have to deal with. It will be hard to cut off all trade routes, but this just adds to the strategy of the game. Maybe the guilds are cutting off all trade routes because they will siege the city soon and they want to cripple the economy so the government cant afford defensive things like guards. It may be annoying to deal with when it happens to you, but it really adds a lot of depth to the game.

One could also find out who is doing it and where they are from and either start hitting the caravans that belong to them or could hire someone to hit them for them

ArchivedUser

Ninja Shadow said:

Fwuppers said:

I think this is just something we will have to deal with. It will be hard to cut off all trade routes, but this just adds to the strategy of the game. Maybe the guilds are cutting off all trade routes because they will siege the city soon and they want to cripple the economy so the government cant afford defensive things like guards. It may be annoying to deal with when it happens to you, but it really adds a lot of depth to the game.

One could also find out who is doing it and where they are from and either start hitting the caravans that belong to them or could hire someone to hit them for them

Lots and lots of surprises and strategy, frustration and elation, ever changing challenges and cooperation in order to survive!

ArchivedUser

This is part of the reason we don't have fast travel. Unless the guild already knew about the caravan because of spys or are lucky enough to be in the area then they will not be able to mobilize in time to attack it. 

ArchivedUser

If one had enough friends/trusted people theoretically they could put together a transfer run without having to use the caravan system thus being able to take a back woods route

ArchivedUser

Even the biggest guilds cant be in all places at all times.
As said, there isnt any fast travel.

That aside, communication routes, supply lines, strategic positions and positions of power have always been targets of opportunity in any war. That is the main purpose of their very existence.

But they are the least of your worries. You believe your node neighbour is an automatic threat to compete with for resources, rather than an automatic ally to cooperative with for mutual gain. That may cost you dearly in the long run.

What if the PvE menace is more of a problem than the PvP squabbles. What if the system tracks not juts 1 nodes progression but multiple. Maybe even the fact that 5 metropolis are in existence instead of 1. The system could/should be releasing menaces that require the cooperation of 5 metropolis to defeat. How can you do that if those players are your enemy ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_we_stand,_divided_we_fall