To:Devs Re:Combat Quicktime

ArchivedUser

I totally appreciate that you guys are trying to make combat feel more immersive by adding the QuickTime slide bar event. But as someone who's been a Raider in MMOs for years now I can't help but feel like it's a bad idea. Ashes of creation has beautiful animation and characters and real potential for amazing battle sequences but I'm not going to get to enjoy any of that if I'm staring at a bar every time I'm in combat.

Now I'm not against the idea of a quick Time Event in combat necessarily but more specifically the slidebar. If the QuickTime notifier were visual based on actual combat movement or colors or sound effects then they wouldn't be nearly as distracting as a Slidebar, because the thing telling me to activate the quick time is already what I'm looking at. 

Personally I think the idea of having some sort of combat mechanic to increase your healing, damage, or tanking output based on personal skill level is a great idea so long as the skill cap isn't so high that it alienates the least skilled among us.

Good luck to you guys I can't wait to see how the combat system evolves going forward!
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ArchivedUser

Just as a note I believe I have seen and heard comment through multiple sources that the "quicktime bar" that many people have seen and experienced at PAX was simply a placeholder for a generalized mechanic. 

It was the most evident and transparent reflection of a mechanical idea that they could produce in the 90 day timetable.

That being said, I am not defending that specific mechanic/UI feature just mentioning that with a little digging there is a wealth of information about many of the ideas and questions you might have.

ArchivedUser

the combat looks bad from what Ive see and the who quick time mech just dumbs it down wheather there is a slider bar or not. quick time is lazy console mech.

ArchivedUser

@Araga is correct in saying that the slide bar is a placeholder for what will be a highly customizable feature.
The "slidebar" is there for your weapons keystroke only and won't be available to other skills. The aim is to have it as an alternative to an auto attack so that players are rewarded for actively striking at particlar points through out the animation. This in turn charges your "focus" for your ultimate ability. 

I wasn't at PAX so I can't comment on how it felt playing and thus I feel  I can't make a fair judgement on the mechanic. I've heard over all positive comments from PAX attendees however the general criticism has been UI appearance of a bar. The most criticism I've seen has come from viewers and not PAX players but once more people have a hands on experience with the game more feedback will help develop the system to something suitable for launch

ArchivedUser

Well given how basic combat is right now I can understand how people would think the QuickTime is not a big distraction. But I'm visualizing what it's going to be like with 30 people on my screen attacking a raid boss with fully fleshed-out ability hotbars and spell particles everywhere. As someone who usually mains range DPS, it's already hard enough monitoring cool down timers and fire on the floor and raid mechanics. I don't want to have to look at anything more than I absolutely need to to be the best I can be. And I don't even want to think about how hard it is to heal that many people and monitor health bars and debuffs and still trying to do a quick Time Event in the midst of all that. Maybe the final iteration will be fantastic and I hope it is but right now I don't see the vision.

ArchivedUser

Maerik85 said:

Well given how basic combat is right now I can understand how people would think the QuickTime is not a big distraction. But I'm visualizing what it's going to be like with 30 people on my screen attacking a raid boss with fully fleshed-out ability hotbars and spell particles everywhere. As someone who usually mains range DPS, it's already hard enough monitoring cool down timers and fire on the floor and raid mechanics. I don't want to have to look at anything more than I absolutely need to to be the best I can be. And I don't even want to think about how hard it is to heal that many people and monitor health bars and debuffs and still trying to do a quick Time Event in the midst of all that. Maybe the final iteration will be fantastic and I hope it is but right now I don't see the vision.

This type of mechanic, IMO, would be better implemented as a form of "charge up."

Rather than hitting the right spot on a progress bar at the right time in order to build additional resources, instead you would be able to charge up your skills by holding down the hotkey before releasing it. The more you charge up your skill, the more effective the skill becomes, and the more resources you build towards your ultimate.

This change would accomplish two things:

1) Because the player can release the key at any time, we aren't stuck looking at a slider, or staring at our character model, to see when to execute the ability. This allows the player to focus on the action and the environment, as opposed to staring at the UI (good games have UI that is there to be glanced at, not stared at.) Even if they change this slider mechanic into something visually represented on your character model, that still means you'll have to stare at your character model, waiting for that feedback, rather than looking at the action in front of you. That's far from ideal.

2) It gives the player a meaningful choice to make. Right now, the game simply dictates what the optimal way to play is. Press a hotkey, wait for your slider to be over the red bar, and press it again. This is the optimal way to play, in all cases, and it is 100% dictated by the game engine. If, instead, the choice were left up to the player how long to charge our attack, we could then form our own risk/reward assessment of the situation we're in. Do I charge my heal in order to maximize its effectiveness, or do I throw an instant quick heal that may be less mana-efficient or less powerful, but necessary to prevent my teammate from dying? Do I charge up my sword strike and risk the boss jumping away from me or otherwise evading, or do I go for the less-effective quick strike that offers a higher likelihood of connecting and dealing damage?


If I understand correctly, the primary goal of the slider mechanic is to give the player meaningful choices for what would otherwise be spammed basic attacks. A charge mechanic accomplishes this same goal, but without the drawbacks that were immediately apparent to anyone who's seen the PAX gameplay.

ArchivedUser

Charge up doesn't satisfy the purpose of the mechanic.
Ashes has separate charge up abilities, in addition to the combo QTE.

Better to have played the combat rather than merely watching a vid.
Don't judge a book by it's cover.