Swapping jobs...sub and main?

ArchivedUser

They've said something about the possibility of needing to quest in order to swap the secondary classes, so even if you have leveled up Mage and Summoner to max as secondary classes previously, I don't think you just get to swap between them whenever you wish.
But, I also don't think we have enough details yet to know for sure.
If we did, I'd share the quote.

ArchivedUser

Xombie said:

Riepah said:

Dygz said:

I don't think switching secondary classes will be so simple as remaining proficient in the secondary class you've abandoned.
But, we shall see.

What makes you think that? Did they say anything that would suggest that the secondary class has to be leveled in some way, separately from your primary class?

Please refer to the wiki. A lot of their stances on the class system and plans for the project have been stated nunerous times.

Could you perhaps provide me with a link? I indeed tried to look around for information before ever visiting the forum, but never came across anything that spoke about primary and secondary classes in more detail than that they will exist, and that the secondary classes will not add new skills but merely augment the primary classes' existing ones. Every source I checked mentions that the secondary class can be changed, but none offer any insight whatsoever as to how, or mentioned anything about them being leveled separately from your primary class.

Dygz said:

They've said something about the possibility of needing to quest in order to swap the secondary classes, so even if you have leveled up Mage and Summoner to max as secondary classes previously, I don't think you just get to swap between them whenever you wish.
But, I also don't think we have enough details yet to know for sure.
If we did, I'd share the quote.

I see. Thank you.

ArchivedUser

@Scardydog

• (updated) It is not possible to switch your primary class.(Class blog)
  
  
• Your secondary archetype can be changed, but not "on-the-fly". (Developer quote)

Hope this helps

ArchivedUser

@lexmax
 Steven did confirm no primary class switching in the class list blog. In the third paragraph, the last two sentences say, "It’s only the primary class that cannot be changed. And hey, that’s what alts are for!"
Here is the link: https://www.ashesofcreation.com/class-list/

ArchivedUser

Zastro said:

@lexmax
 Steven did confirm no primary class switching in the class list blog. In the third paragraph, the last two sentences say, "It’s only the primary class that cannot be changed. And hey, that’s what alts are for!"
Here is the link: https://www.ashesofcreation.com/class-list/

Thanks @Zastro! I missed that gem. I've updated the wiki to reflect this.

ArchivedUser

Xombie said:

Riepah said:

Dygz said:

I don't think switching secondary classes will be so simple as remaining proficient in the secondary class you've abandoned.
But, we shall see.

What makes you think that? Did they say anything that would suggest that the secondary class has to be leveled in some way, separately from your primary class?

Please refer to the wiki. A lot of their stances on the class system and plans for the project have been stated nunerous times.

Could you perhaps provide me with a link? I indeed tried to look around for information before ever visiting the forum, but never came across anything that spoke about primary and secondary classes in more detail than that they will exist, and that the secondary classes will not add new skills but merely augment the primary classes' existing ones. Every source I checked mentions that the secondary class can be changed, but none offer any insight whatsoever as to how.

ArchivedUser

That is because they haven't said how the secondary will be changed, other than that it won't be something that will not be important and cost you either time or currency. 

ArchivedUser

On the subject of building a reputation I don't think I've ever, in my admittedly small time playing MMOs, known someone by their character's name and not their account name. Despite this, I've still seen people become famous/infamous. Limiting players to just one character may make the reputation they gain more lore friendly, but they'll build up a reputation regardless. 

ArchivedUser

Where i could go for main swap,subswap or both. I do prefer subswap only. Gives a reason to use character slots. Lets me use more of my purchased cosmetics on other characters. Doesnt make anyones single character able to do everything

ArchivedUser

Riepah said:

Xombie said:

Riepah said:

Dygz said:

I don't think switching secondary classes will be so simple as remaining proficient in the secondary class you've abandoned.
But, we shall see.

What makes you think that? Did they say anything that would suggest that the secondary class has to be leveled in some way, separately from your primary class?

Please refer to the wiki. A lot of their stances on the class system and plans for the project have been stated nunerous times.

Could you perhaps provide me with a link? I indeed tried to look around for information before ever visiting the forum, but never came across anything that spoke about primary and secondary classes in more detail than that they will exist, and that the secondary classes will not add new skills but merely augment the primary classes' existing ones. Every source I checked mentions that the secondary class can be changed, but none offer any insight whatsoever as to how.

All necessary information has been posted above. I'm not much for hand holding, thankfully others are more than willing! Rejoice!

ArchivedUser

Im 99.9% sure main class swap is confirmed, not to be in AoC.

ArchivedUser

NoeSparks said:

Im 99.9% sure main class swap is confirmed, not to be in AoC.

You can push that to 100%. Confirmed after your linked interview.

lexmax said:

Zastro said:

@lexmax
 Steven did confirm no primary class switching in the class list blog. In the third paragraph, the last two sentences say, "It’s only the primary class that cannot be changed. And hey, that’s what alts are for!"
Here is the link: https://www.ashesofcreation.com/class-list/

Thanks @Zastro! I missed that gem. I've updated the wiki to reflect this.

ArchivedUser

Thanks all, I sure the wiki section I saw when I started the thread stated that there was still a possibility of main class swapping, which I admit I was excited for. In light of recent updated info, it does seem that this is not the case.

That being said, and as I stated before, sub job swapping is still an awesome way to allow people to provide flexibilty to their raid groups/change their mind if they make bad choices etc, even if it does involve a bit of effort.

Unfortunately there will always be a element of "you don't have XY job, you can't come to this raid" elitism and I'm a fan of MMO's not punishing their players for not choosing/guessing correctly at the time of character creation.

ArchivedUser

I'm a fan of not having one character be capable of doing everything. 

Shrugs

ArchivedUser

UnknownSystemError said:

NoeSparks said:

Im 99.9% sure main class swap is confirmed, not to be in AoC.

You can push that to 100%. Confirmed after your linked interview.

ye, was on my phone

quotes being stupid 

@Scardydog "Unfortunately there will always be a element of "you don't have XY job, you can't come to this raid" elitism and I'm a fan of MMO's not punishing their players for not choosing/guessing correctly at the time of character creation."

i actually enjoy this sort of thing in games. Having a rogue required to disarm a trap is always a cool mechanic. or in DDO(D&D Online) the first raid required a monk to "ele tank" (tank elementals because of their saves) i never see these types of mechanics enough as newer games come out and things normaly found in the older D&D type games are forgotten. 

ArchivedUser

Scardydog said:

Unfortunately there will always be a element of "you don't have XY job, you can't come to this raid" elitism and I'm a fan of MMO's not punishing their players for not choosing/guessing correctly at the time of character creation.

Then take heart. The 8 main archetypes are only "flavored" by their sub-classes. Group sizes for dungeons are 8. Raids up to 40. So the idea that just because you chose bard or some other "non-pure" combination, that you will not get groups is not going to be an issue. Every archetype will have a reason to be in a group, why would people purposefully gimp themselves by not bringing along a full range of abilities? Rather than getting upset at being told no, you should wait and reserve your opinion for once you get to actually see the system in action. Player reputation and ability will have a much larger role in Ashes with no random LFG or raid finder over other elitist practices that have taken place in other mmos that allow things like dps parsers and inspection features (at this time said not to be in game).

ArchivedUser

ArchivedUser

UnknownSystemError said:

Scardydog said:

Unfortunately there will always be a element of "you don't have XY job, you can't come to this raid" elitism and I'm a fan of MMO's not punishing their players for not choosing/guessing correctly at the time of character creation.

Then take heart. The 8 main archetypes are only "flavored" by their sub-classes. Group sizes for dungeons are 8. Raids up to 40. So the idea that just because you chose bard or some other "non-pure" combination, that you will not get groups is not going to be an issue. Every archetype will have a reason to be in a group, why would people purposefully gimp themselves by not bringing along a full range of abilities? Rather than getting upset at being told no, you should wait and reserve your opinion for once you get to actually see the system in action. Player reputation and ability will have a much larger role in Ashes with no random LFG or raid finder over other elitist practices that have taken place in other mmos that allow things like dps parsers and inspection features (at this time said not to be in game).

That's good to hear

And don't get me wrong, I am a firm believer in needing to have certain jobs for stuff, but it's the general meta that always puts me off. I've always hated the "you go level X job in this certain way then you can have a raid spot".

ArchivedUser

Unfortunately players will always find a way to 'maximize' their chances. Those players naturally flock together, and those players are the ones that turn raid-buddies away for not being super elite.

In Ashes, as of now, there is no raid que but instead a job/raid board where players can advertise the need for an 8th or what not. Also, there is no planned world fast travel, so grabbing the first player that comes through willing to help might be beneficial.

Most of us expect IS to give solid effort to balance dungeons to require a variety of classes. Some of us even suspect they will succeed.

As for my post way earlier, I mentioned characters that can do anything will cause the community to suffer. I stand by the term suffer, for I believe it will subject the community to something bad. Now if I said it would torture the community....

ArchivedUser

Yeah. The game is built around the concept all classes have a time and a place and a unique identity that is indispensable. All bring something unique to the table. Each provides strengths their team mates lack and fills the holes that constitute each others weaknesses. Sure you can double up a groups classes to add power in focused areas, but the price of more power in one area is less/no power in others.

The skill system will be a tree with knobs and sliders. You can delve down certain routes that may well lock you out of others. Even if they didnt lock you out, you only have so much time and so many points to allocate/unlock.

As with artisan, I see the combat system classes as thin and deep or fat and shallow. You wont get something for nothing. You will have to make sacrifices and the only way to play mutiple styles is to be weak in many. The only way to switch styles will be to sacrifice what you currently have. IMHO. So it wouldnt surprise me if you 'forget' levelling up skills and lose experience within them through non-use.

Forgetting specialist competencies, to enable alternate specialist competencies would also demand spending the time training in those new skills as well as retraining in skills you abandoned. You would probably also have to deselect branches to enable alternate ones with a different speciality.

In other words.....retraining an existing class would take just as long as creating an ALT. So going with a single build or 1 alt per class would be neither here nor there. But the difference is having Alts means you can switch playstyle at leisure. Having one character means you are stuck with that style until retrained in the new style.

I dont see why you would want to repeatedly re-level to specialise in something else instead of just switch. And besides attribute allocation may have a massive effect on class/style potency. Switching styles might require reallocating attribute points. Which is why attribute allocation should be inseparable from class type and class potency IMO. It enforces sacrifice. Not that your class name could not be dependant/defined by your attribute allocation distributuon in a free class system..

ArchivedUser

i, personally, am very interested in this system. I, personally, want to choose 1 main class, and then one subclass. I can't think about the advantages of switching the classes. I want to specialize my character and learn to play this one very good.


But I also understand the people, who think, that exploring other classes (main classes or sub classes) is a nice thing to have.


Ich hope, that we can have very much fun together with the many different systems in the game (classes, leveling, professions,...)