How DARK do you want the "Dark of Night" to be?

ArchivedUser

I remember the original EverQuest where darkness was really dark.  You couldn’t see anything.  One of the necessities in early game was getting a light source.  The easiest and most convenient way was to fight Will O’Wisps that can drop a magic crystal that gives a permanent light source.  But they were immune to conventional weapons so you’d have to get a magic one, and getting a magic weapon required some questing...

It was a pain (most things in that game were) but it gave a great sense of accomplishment when you succeeded.

ArchivedUser

We have a light spell.  We have torches.  I want it pitch dark in some areas.  (Some dungeons, natural caves, cursed areas, new moon nights, darkness spell, darkness traps, etc.)

I miss areas like that from EQ.

ArchivedUser

One of the only 'annoying' parts of true darkness at night would be open world navigation during the dark of night. But this can easily be solved by not having a standard light-cycle. The daytime could last most of the day, with large transitional periods of deepening/brightening twilight and a shorter true dark period. It'd add a lot to the feel of immersion without being a huge burden.

Just a short blip of true darkness would be great for the possibility of an ambush. For tension. Adding an element of danger. But if you wanna wait in a city for a couple minutes it will pass and you're safe to go back out and trek with visibility again.

As to how to explain the desired lighting cycle, it could easily be achieved with lunar lighting, especially if there are more than one moon. or the passive illumination of starlight could be high enough to maintain twilight except when cloud-cover periodically moves through and blocks it out. Etc.

ArchivedUser

@Ravnodaus
Alternatively you could have road areas be more well lit relative to off-road areas and depending on the node level there may even be lamps etc lighting the way. I actually kind of like having to be considerate of the time of day when traveling and an optimal dark vs safe well-lit route.

As previously mentioned, some change in view distance or resolution/color as a function of distance during night would also be great for the danger/tension of mobs or PC ambushes etc. It would also go a long way to diversify and add depth to strategies surrounding caravans, when you may want to send them out and how easy they are to find/how easily attackers can be seen.

ArchivedUser

Memories of Kithcor Forest (if I remember the name correctly) in EQ at night was heart pounding.  I can't say I loved it, but it did what it was designed to do.  I'm not a fan of blackness, but I do want the sky to darken where I am aware it's nighttime.  Love the idea of lunar light in cycles.

ArchivedUser

T-Elf said:

Memories of Kithcor Forest (if I remember the name correctly) in EQ at night was heart pounding.  I can't say I loved it, but it did what it was designed to do.  I'm not a fan of blackness, but I do want the sky to darken where I am aware it's nighttime.  Love the idea of lunar light in cycles.

Yeah Kithicor, which was pretty normal during the day but at night was full of undead all swarming at you.  I made so many terrified runs through that zone.

I think @nagash would just have a picnic there.

ArchivedUser

Zartas said:

Personally I would like to see the nights being actually dark, where players will have to use either items or spells to illuminate the path. Full moon and clear skies? you can see pretty decently. Cloudy weather at night? good luck without a torch. This paired with a dangerous world, created some really cool gameplay moments and choices. How much gear do I bring with me? do I risk to travel at night? 

I think you nailed it with this.

Personally, I love immersion, but not to the point where it gets annoying. It's a game after all, and while some ideas may sound awesome on paper, they are sometimes - not so fun after playing for two weeks.

So what's my stance in this? I too agree they should make use of the dynamic weather. Cloudy skies means darker, full moon with clear skies you can see pretty well. It's dark? Well if you didn't bring that torch you're screwed. However, as I can also see the other side of the coin here, I think some areas shouldn't be so dark that you constantly have to walk around with a Zippo. I say, open areas should be dark, but not to the point where you can't see what you are doing. Forests and caves however, make them really dark and scary! Then of course, winter nights are winter nights, better get that LED fidget spinner ready regardless where you are.

ArchivedUser

From reading up, it appears to most that short periods of time of very dark periods, would be acceptable for most players,but long term duration of black-black conditions have too many negatives.   in short, if there is Darkness, make it depending on the environment, or make it short periods of time.  Do not eliminate the darkest of night but make it dynamic!  


This seems after reading and discussion to be the most palatable form of implementing darkness!

ArchivedUser

Grimseethe said:

I don't want it to ever be so dark that you need a torch (except maybe in caves, id prefer a light spell)
In real life if never gets so dark you cant see anything, our eyes adapt.

Have you ever been in a forest at night during a new moon?  You can barely see your hand in front of your face.  Forget about moving.

I remember Everquest and just about falling out of my chair when I came around a tree and a bear was right there.  That was why I switched to Ranger.  I could use the 'Track' skill to know what was around...

ArchivedUser

How dark do i want my night? 
Hmmmmmm.

A bit darker than this one I would say xD. 
Dark enough to hide if you want to hide, but illuminated by a full moon.
The Skyrim nightsky is a pretty good compromise or the WoW early Duskwood (where you had to actually carry a torch)

ArchivedUser

I prefer it not affecting my gameplay with having to carry a torch or what not. I want to know it’s night but still be able to see the creatures lurking. 

ArchivedUser

Sintu said:

I prefer it not affecting my gameplay with having to carry a torch or what not. I want to know it’s night but still be able to see the creatures lurking. 

This is exactly how i want the night to be. Torches are bad, bad i say.


Just look at him. 

😨

ArchivedUser

Torches could be something interesting! Maybe we could get a per hit chance to set our target on fire. ;D

ArchivedUser

I mean why not make it pitch black? No other game or MMORPG has done it

ArchivedUser

BCGiant said:

I mean why not make it pitch black? No other game or MMORPG has done it

Great idea.  Save a ton of money because there is no art to develop, it won’t tax anyone’s video card, and it’ll make the game extremely challenging.  Pitch black all the time.  You might be on to something!

ArchivedUser

BCGiant said:

I mean why not make it pitch black? No other game or MMORPG has done it

Yes, EQ did.

ArchivedUser

Give us a slider...

ArchivedUser

Mindseye said:

I've played a few RPG's where the idea of nighttime was 2 to 3 times brighter than the full. moon.   This has me thinking, what should the darkness of night, instead of being the same... vary with the phases of the moon and heavens in Verra?   Will there be phases of the heavens even in Verra?
Full Moon  = Standard MMO overly bright but enough dark to give the concept of night
Phases of moon = Corresponding percentage of darkening compared to the full moon
New Moon = Think dark, way out in the country, only the stars to light you (and maybe an occasional aurora)  hardest phase to find things.


OR 

perma bright night, no moon phases: aka "lemme grind on my monster mats, screw nighttime"

Personally I want dark to be near blind. I would like illumination via torch or magic or other means to be required to have decent visibility. As Steven has really been pro-DND with this game. It seems logical that he would really listen to the If its night and you don't have illumination of some sort you cant see potential issues.

Night vision is of course a potential answer to the problem of dark nights.

ArchivedUser

I don't know that I care as long as we have access to the hovering "torch" as seen in early gameplay vids.
Highly problematic to require carrying a torch in one hand at night.

ArchivedUser

I'm a fan of immersion.  Light should reflect where you are in the world.  There should be a scale of ambient light. 

If you are in a room with no light source at night it should be pitch black. 

An open field under a starry sky would let you only see shadows.

A full moon in the same field would give be comforting by comparison; but you would lose the benefits under a canopy of a heavy forest.

I want torches to limit your vision to the radius of their light and make you "nightblind" if you rely on them.  Torch burns out you should have difficulty seeing until you readapt.  I also would let players adapt to darkness over time where their night vision improves during the course of an evening if they don't rely on light sources.

This would make racial abilities and spells bring magic into the world.  

There's a reason man shelters at night, stokes a campfire and fears the dark. If you can see without a light source; again it takes a bit of the realism away.

I loved the feeling of the Greater Feydark and Butcherblock Mtns back in the day. Your infravision meant something.  Did you stress over having a light source was it something to manage?  Sure.  Usually only up to a certain level.

Real night away from the lights of civilization is dark.  The game can balance it with borealis effects; magical fungai; bright moons as necessary.  However some areas should invoke fear of the dark.  It's primal.