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Flying In MMORPGs

Hey guys~! <3 I'm new to the MMORPG genre and would like to know everyone's take on flying. I haven't actually played an MMORPG but I feel like flying could be really awesome.

A command problem I've heard with flying is "It'll take away from scale, make all the world design artists work worthless"

I can agree with that, being able to fly over all the lovingly hand-crafted places and stuff would be a very big shame.
Although this is true I do believe that flying is a large part, I've seen the gliding mounts and I THINK in AoC that if you own a castle you get a flying dragon or something...? for a limited time..? Either way I wouldn't mind no flying, I just think it's a really cool thing to have in games. Being able to fly over the land and look at all the places you've been. I can also see a problem wherein everybodies up in the sky and the places below feel like a ghost land.

I'm not on one side or the other, I can understand reasons for both~! Just let me know your thoughts below <3<3<3


Thank you for sharing <3 ^-^
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Comments

  • AzryilAzryil Member, Leader of Men, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    Flying is a surefire way to kill an MMO, WoW being the most notable example. When everyone is able to fly the world feels empty. I've never personally been a huge fan of World PvP but random encounters with other players makes the world feel more alive.
    k2U15J3.png
  • Rem_Rem_ Member
    arzosah wrote: »
    Flying is a surefire way to kill an MMO, WoW being the most notable example. When everyone is able to fly the world feels empty. I've never personally been a huge fan of World PvP but random encounters with other players makes the world feel more alive.

    Hmmm... that sounds about right to me c: Although it would be so nice to just be able to fly all around and explore~!

    But I guess with (Hopefully) Varying speed mounts we'll be able to do just the same, just on land.

    I agree with you though, it'll feel desolate with everyone up in the air flying around <3 I just wish there was a way to fix that and have flying!
    Poko.png
  • AzryilAzryil Member, Leader of Men, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    I think fly could be interesting if it was heavily restricted, such as only being able to fly for a short period of time, with a long cooldown, or have to manage stamina that would force you to the ground periodically or risk dying.
    k2U15J3.png
  • AzryilAzryil Member, Leader of Men, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    and if fly were to exist being able to fight in flight would add the same risk to flying that you would have on teh ground.
    k2U15J3.png
  • Rem_Rem_ Member
    arzosah wrote: »
    and if fly were to exist being able to fight in flight would add the same risk to flying that you would have on teh ground.

    Mhm that could be cool~! For me it isn't as much about the risk, it's just that if new players come in and the whole entire map is desolate because people are only flying to certain areas to do stuff then thats a problem!
    Poko.png
  • FerrymanFerryman Member
    edited April 2019
    Flying mounts are cool, but also effective way to hurt the game itself. With flying you can just bypass all dangerous encounters both PvE and PvP pov. This would effect negatively also to the whole economy system when gathering and transporting goods can be done fast and without risk.

    So flying mounts works almost only in MMOs where is no player-driven economy, where open world PvP ain't a thing and where is plenty of old meaningless content in the world.

    So flying mounts would not work in AoC if implemented like in WoW example. Even WoW has acknowledge this problem and at least some new content is for ground mounts only.

    However, I can see an option how flying mounts could work. Those could glide like @Pokosaurous mentioned and that way act like ground mounts. There could be in future (expansion) separated content made especially for flying mounts or players would need flying mounts to get there. Own content similar like sea/naval.
    Do you need a ride to the Underworld?
  • Rem_Rem_ Member
    Ferryman wrote: »
    Flying mounts are cool, but also effective way to hurt the game itself. With flying you can just bypass all dangerous encounters both PvE and PvP pov. This would effect negatively also to the whole economy system when gathering and transporting goods can be done fast and without risk.

    So flying mounts works almost only in MMOs where is no player-driven economy, where open world PvP ain't a thing and where is plenty of old meaningless content in the world.

    So flying mounts would not work in AoC if implemented like in WoW example. Even WoW has axknowledge this problem and at least some new content is for ground mounts only.

    However, I can see an option how flying mounts could work. Those could glide like @Pokosaurous mentioned and that way act like ground mounts. There could be in future (expansion) separated content made especially for flying mounts or players would need flying mounts to get there. Own content similar like sea/naval.

    That's a very good idea~!

    Having an expansion or something that offers flying mounts, but doesn't force you to stay there. I'd love to see that, like an expansion where you can go off far and fly around there...BUT !

    I wouldn't like to see people staying there because the best gear or whatever is there, maybe some rare items.. crafting stuff or I'm not even sure... but I wouldn't like TONS of players being there instead of the main area, because new people joining in would feels its dead because everyone wouldn't be with them.

    At least that's how I feel~! I see people saying full flying mounts EVERYWHERE in an MMORPG kills it fast. I believe it! If they were ever going to add full flying I would love it to be like @Ferryman said and be in an expansion, but I would NOT NOT NOT! like people to be staying there for super long times, like maybe there aren't too many huge bosses or whatever there..! <3 thanks for commenting ^-^
    Poko.png
  • Ferryman wrote: »
    Flying mounts are cool, but also effective way to hurt the game itself. With flying you can just bypass all dangerous encounters both PvE and PvP pov. This would effect negatively also to the whole economy system when gathering and transporting goods can be done fast and without risk.

    So flying mounts works almost only in MMOs where is no player-driven economy, where open world PvP ain't a thing and where is plenty of old meaningless content in the world.

    So flying mounts would not work in AoC if implemented like in WoW example. Even WoW has axknowledge this problem and at least some new content is for ground mounts only.

    However, I can see an option how flying mounts could work. Those could glide like @Pokosaurous mentioned and that way act like ground mounts. There could be in future (expansion) separated content made especially for flying mounts or players would need flying mounts to get there. Own content similar like sea/naval.

    I wouldn't like to see people staying there

    Me either. I am not sure what there should be, but definitely there could be something. Gives devs a good chance to expand the world and give players new goals to achieve. World boss, raid, new recipes, new resources, zone with no corruption... just few examples. Player actions could modify the content like in node system and if the idea is not keep people there, then just implement the place without town possibility.
    Do you need a ride to the Underworld?
  • NagashNagash Member, Leader of Men, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    edited April 2019
    But what if I really believe that I can fly?
    nJ0vUSm.gif

    The dead do not squabble as this land’s rulers do. The dead have no desires, petty jealousies or ambitions. A world of the dead is a world at peace
  • grisugrisu Member
    Flying is great and I don't believe flying itself is bad for a game. It needs to be incorperated well tho.
    It's like getting a new tool in a legends of Zelda game, it might open new paths or provide shortcuts, but shouldn't invalidate what you already have.
    I can be a life fulfilling dream. - Zekece
    I can be a life devouring nightmare. - Grisu#1819
  • NagashNagash Member, Leader of Men, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    Grisu wrote: »
    Flying is great and I don't believe flying itself is bad for a game. It needs to be incorperated well tho.
    It's like getting a new tool in a legends of Zelda game, it might open new paths or provide shortcuts, but shouldn't invalidate what you already have.

    I think guild wars 2 did it quite well in the expansion
    nJ0vUSm.gif

    The dead do not squabble as this land’s rulers do. The dead have no desires, petty jealousies or ambitions. A world of the dead is a world at peace
  • I think flying is ok, but for ashes, it might make the world too small. ff14 makes you explore the map and do quests to fly there.

    i think teleporters will be better
  • Rem_Rem_ Member
    Ferryman wrote: »
    Ferryman wrote: »
    Flying mounts are cool, but also effective way to hurt the game itself. With flying you can just bypass all dangerous encounters both PvE and PvP pov. This would effect negatively also to the whole economy system when gathering and transporting goods can be done fast and without risk.

    So flying mounts works almost only in MMOs where is no player-driven economy, where open world PvP ain't a thing and where is plenty of old meaningless content in the world.

    So flying mounts would not work in AoC if implemented like in WoW example. Even WoW has axknowledge this problem and at least some new content is for ground mounts only.

    However, I can see an option how flying mounts could work. Those could glide like @Pokosaurous mentioned and that way act like ground mounts. There could be in future (expansion) separated content made especially for flying mounts or players would need flying mounts to get there. Own content similar like sea/naval.

    I wouldn't like to see people staying there

    Me either. I am not sure what there should be, but definitely there could be something. Gives devs a good chance to expand the world and give players new goals to achieve. World boss, raid, new recipes, new resources, zone with no corruption... just few examples. Player actions could modify the content like in node system and if the idea is not keep people there, then just implement the place without town possibility.

    Mhm! I'd love for there do be valid stuff for there to do there, but not so important that players never go back to the main playing area!

    Not having flying right away wouldn't ruin it, it's barely even a downside. I just think flying around could be really nice! <3 If they can find a way to add land, and make you be able to fly there, make people want to go there but not stay there forever then that would be amazing.
    Poko.png
  • Rem_Rem_ Member
    onionbun wrote: »
    I think flying is ok, but for ashes, it might make the world too small. ff14 makes you explore the map and do quests to fly there.

    i think teleporters will be better

    Yea~! I dunno maybe if they make the world bigger that could be cool, but I feel like teleporters may make people see even LESS of the world!
    Poko.png
  • Rem_Rem_ Member
    Grisu wrote: »
    Flying is great and I don't believe flying itself is bad for a game. It needs to be incorperated well tho.
    It's like getting a new tool in a legends of Zelda game, it might open new paths or provide shortcuts, but shouldn't invalidate what you already have.

    Mhm~!! n.n I wouldn't want flying to be the only way around, and even so it wouldn't take away from caravans if they're setup so you can only move loot with the caravans. <3

    I just hope sometime they'll have an expansion that implements it in a certain area but keeps players all throughout the map to keep it feeling alive. Instead of 100s of people just sitting in a certain town.
    Poko.png
  • Rem_Rem_ Member
    Nagash wrote: »
    But what if I really believe that I can fly?

    Then you can fly all you want uwu but.. I wouldn't suggest trying it..!
    Poko.png
  • Ferryman wrote: »
    Ferryman wrote: »
    Flying mounts are cool, but also effective way to hurt the game itself. With flying you can just bypass all dangerous encounters both PvE and PvP pov. This would effect negatively also to the whole economy system when gathering and transporting goods can be done fast and without risk.

    So flying mounts works almost only in MMOs where is no player-driven economy, where open world PvP ain't a thing and where is plenty of old meaningless content in the world.

    So flying mounts would not work in AoC if implemented like in WoW example. Even WoW has axknowledge this problem and at least some new content is for ground mounts only.

    However, I can see an option how flying mounts could work. Those could glide like @Pokosaurous mentioned and that way act like ground mounts. There could be in future (expansion) separated content made especially for flying mounts or players would need flying mounts to get there. Own content similar like sea/naval.

    I wouldn't like to see people staying there

    Me either. I am not sure what there should be, but definitely there could be something. Gives devs a good chance to expand the world and give players new goals to achieve. World boss, raid, new recipes, new resources, zone with no corruption... just few examples. Player actions could modify the content like in node system and if the idea is not keep people there, then just implement the place without town possibility.

    If they can find a way to add land, and make you be able to fly there

    And that land does not need to be just another continent or island, because we can get there with ships already. That flying content can be somewhere at the sky.. Maybe floating islands or top of the mountains where you can not get with ground mount.
    Do you need a ride to the Underworld?
  • ezenkrul87ezenkrul87 Member, Phoenix Initiative, Hero of the People, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    You can fly in Ashes if you're a Mayor/Castle Lord or get a temporary drop from a raid boss. Gives you something to aim for even if its short lived.
    Ezenkrul - Phoenix Initiative
  • mistymisty Member
    The only mmo I've played with flying is wow and the debate on its pros and cons is never ending. At the start of each new wow expansion now they have pathfinder, basically a series of achievements you have to complete before you can fly. Keeps you ground bound for many months of each new xpac and everyones opinion on it is different. I guess that is one way to make people get a taste of both worlds.

    My most awe inspiring views in wow happened when flying. It's faster, it's easier, there's no running through twisting paths and tedious mobs that don't make my experience better as I get to where I actually want to be.



  • KarthosKarthos Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    Science node will produce two brothers who invent flight in Verra. This will spawn a booming industry whose sole purpose is to make plane with tiny seats.
    Aq0KG2f.png
  • grisugrisu Member
    For those that haven't played a Legend of Zelda game, <pats @Pokosaurous head> here is an example.

    For example maybe in the future there is an area with extreme upwinds and you could fly there to reach islands that are held up in the sky with magic. It wouldn't change how you move around in other regions, but it's also an addition for new regions for example.
    I can be a life fulfilling dream. - Zekece
    I can be a life devouring nightmare. - Grisu#1819
  • Wandering MistWandering Mist Moderator, Member, Founder, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    arzosah wrote: »
    Flying is a surefire way to kill an MMO, WoW being the most notable example. When everyone is able to fly the world feels empty. I've never personally been a huge fan of World PvP but random encounters with other players makes the world feel more alive.

    Hmmm... that sounds about right to me c: Although it would be so nice to just be able to fly all around and explore~!

    But I guess with (Hopefully) Varying speed mounts we'll be able to do just the same, just on land.

    I agree with you though, it'll feel desolate with everyone up in the air flying around <3 I just wish there was a way to fix that and have flying!

    The only way to fix that in a game that is clearly designed around a lot of world PvP is to have mounted flying combat, which is incredibly hard to pull off correctly. I'd much rather IS focus on getting the ground combat right and not bother with flying at all.
    Misty wrote: »
    The only mmo I've played with flying is wow and the debate on its pros and cons is never ending. At the start of each new wow expansion now they have pathfinder, basically a series of achievements you have to complete before you can fly. Keeps you ground bound for many months of each new xpac and everyones opinion on it is different. I guess that is one way to make people get a taste of both worlds.

    My most awe inspiring views in wow happened when flying. It's faster, it's easier, there's no running through twisting paths and tedious mobs that don't make my experience better as I get to where I actually want to be.

    The WoW pathfinder is the compromise Blizzard came up with when they tried to get rid of flying in WoD. They wanted to get rid of flying but couldn't because the entire playerbase was so dependent on it, even though the problems that flying were designed to fix were fixed in other ways. Ever wondered why none of the WoW expansions contained land masses that were very long strips of land like Kalimdor or the Eastern Kingdoms? Flying was introduced in TBC because the flight point system in Vanilla was completely and utterly worthless. Buggy as hell and even when it did work it took so long to travel from one end of the continents to the other. So Blizzard introduced flying but they had already fixed those problems by changing the shape of Outland and fixing the flight point system.
    volunteer_moderator.gif
  • WololoWololo Member, Phoenix Initiative, Hero of the People, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    i dislike flying mounts and hope the few avaible in ashes will have little to no impact on pvp. gliding is acceptable when the game is designed for it. But if you see what happened in GW2 when they introduced gliding later on, places that were hard to reach suddently became normal ground. it totally broke immersion in the old maps
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  • Rem_Rem_ Member
    shkevi wrote: »
    i dislike flying mounts and hope the few avaible in ashes will have little to no impact on pvp. gliding is acceptable when the game is designed for it. But if you see what happened in GW2 when they introduced gliding later on, places that were hard to reach suddently became normal ground. it totally broke immersion in the old maps

    I haven't played MMORPGs so I don't really know the experience of flying around but it seems really nice.

    As I said before though I'm not on either side c: I can clearly see the negatives and positives ~!
    Poko.png
  • Rem_Rem_ Member
    Grisu wrote: »
    For those that haven't played a Legend of Zelda game, <pats @Pokosaurous head> here is an example.

    For example maybe in the future there is an area with extreme upwinds and you could fly there to reach islands that are held up in the sky with magic. It wouldn't change how you move around in other regions, but it's also an addition for new regions for example.

    *Squeaks out with joy as @Grisu headpats!* Thank chu~!!!!

    I haven't played zelda so >.> you're right.. buuuut I agree with you~! Lots of people seem to not want flying but I'm still neutral on it~

    I'd love for the game NOT to feel dead, like everyone's just flying around to places and not on the ground. I think flying over the beautiful landscapes could be an amazing thing though still~! n.n
    Poko.png
  • Rem_Rem_ Member
    Karthos wrote: »
    Science node will produce two brothers who invent flight in Verra. This will spawn a booming industry whose sole purpose is to make plane with tiny seats.

    ouo frickin greedy bros~!
    Poko.png
  • Rem_Rem_ Member
    Ferryman wrote: »
    Ferryman wrote: »
    Ferryman wrote: »
    Flying mounts are cool, but also effective way to hurt the game itself. With flying you can just bypass all dangerous encounters both PvE and PvP pov. This would effect negatively also to the whole economy system when gathering and transporting goods can be done fast and without risk.

    So flying mounts works almost only in MMOs where is no player-driven economy, where open world PvP ain't a thing and where is plenty of old meaningless content in the world.

    So flying mounts would not work in AoC if implemented like in WoW example. Even WoW has axknowledge this problem and at least some new content is for ground mounts only.

    However, I can see an option how flying mounts could work. Those could glide like @Pokosaurous mentioned and that way act like ground mounts. There could be in future (expansion) separated content made especially for flying mounts or players would need flying mounts to get there. Own content similar like sea/naval.

    I wouldn't like to see people staying there

    Me either. I am not sure what there should be, but definitely there could be something. Gives devs a good chance to expand the world and give players new goals to achieve. World boss, raid, new recipes, new resources, zone with no corruption... just few examples. Player actions could modify the content like in node system and if the idea is not keep people there, then just implement the place without town possibility.

    If they can find a way to add land, and make you be able to fly there

    And that land does not need to be just another continent or island, because we can get there with ships already. That flying content can be somewhere at the sky.. Maybe floating islands or top of the mountains where you can not get with ground mount.

    Mhm that sounds good to be~!

    I haven't played MMORPGs before, but looking at it from the OUTSIDE flying mounts seem very nice. Ashes actually is the only reason I even checked out MMO games. The only huge one that I know (WoW) was made basically when I was born~! lol n.n

    I can acknowledge the bad and good of flying, I REALLY would rather the game not feel dead. I already know if flying is added that everyone will wind up flying around in the air, and new players joining will feels that the games dead. Imagine starting out with the only people you seeing in the sky.. and having to be alone down below.

    As much as I'd LOVE to be able to fly around and enjoy the wondrous world, I'd rather the game be lively than have flying c: <3
    Poko.png
  • Rem_Rem_ Member
    @wanderingmist I can see that but I wasn't talking about there not being pvp. I wouldn't even mind that.

    I was meaning how DEAD the game would feel. with all the flying mounts that (Would) be added if they were in the game.

    everyone would just be flying to certain places around the map and never be using their land mounts unless forced too.
    At least that's how I would feel. I wouldn't enjoy that because as a NEW player coming in, if you're walking around the world and it feels completely empty and dead because everyone's flying around in the air to wherever they need to go, that's bad.

    I would just LOVE to be able to fly around and enjoy all the beautiful environments and stuff~ but I understand what it would do to the game too~

    Poko.png
  • Rem_Rem_ Member
    Ezenkrul87 wrote: »
    You can fly in Ashes if you're a Mayor/Castle Lord or get a temporary drop from a raid boss. Gives you something to aim for even if its short lived.

    Mmmhmmm~! I just can't imagine how hard being those will be, that's the thing~! n.n
    Poko.png
  • VirulentVirulent Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    Why don't we let the devs make the game that they said they are making and not try to change things or jump up and down suggesting large mechanics changes to the game till having at least read the wiki and whatnot to have an understanding of the games basic mechanics as they already are so that we have constructive threads of discussion not going off half cocked.
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