How do you feel about 'Natural Skill' progression?

ilisfet

This system could be tweaked for specialization with the introduction of skill decay. With so many skills to learn, and each taking a true while to master, having unused skills lose levels/exp makes it impossible if not extremely difficult to master everything. Depends on the numbers.

ShadowVen

ilisfet wrote: »

....
The one point to confront about this system, however, is that all players will ultimately become a master-of-all. Even if you make the road to get there take 30 years, the road still has an end. If the aim is to have players specialize, either for balance or group play, this system isn't for it.

@ilisfet =^_^=
I agree with most of what you said except this quote (above), so, I respectfully disagree.
Being as I stated before, if you attach the sub-passives to the general stats to alter passive cap, then depending on how you focus on your characters build, you wouldn't become master of all. For instance, An Archmage, might focus heavily on Int or wisdom (or whatever type of stat(s) IS decides to benefit magic users), Where Int May raise cap for staves,scepters,wands, or elemental magic, etc..., higher than another general stat.

Wandering Mist

noaani wrote: »

Wandering Mist wrote: »

it should be about player skill, not character skill.

This is essentially the tab target vs action combat thing again.

Tab target is all about building your characters stats, your characters abilities. Character progression is the single most important thing.

Action combat is about the players ability. Progression is anywhere ranging from actually pointless to somewhat less useful than it is in tab target combat.

The above said, tab target is as much about the player as action combat is, it's just different things that the player needs to do.

The skilled gamer in a tab target game knows full well that those numbers are anything but arbitrary - because the skilled tab target player fully understands the system those numbers are used in (which means they are no longer arbitrary by definition).

No offence, but if you are playing a tab target game and a number seems arbitrary to you, then you are not a good tab target gamer.

So in your opinion when it comes to tab targeting there is no difference in who actually uses the character. If that's the case how is it that I can get more dps out of my WoW character than someone else, despite using the exact same spec and the same gear?

Dygz

I don't think noaani said that there is no difference in who uses the character.
The opposite was said...

Noaani

Wandering Mist wrote: »

noaani wrote: »

Wandering Mist wrote: »

it should be about player skill, not character skill.

This is essentially the tab target vs action combat thing again.

Tab target is all about building your characters stats, your characters abilities. Character progression is the single most important thing.

Action combat is about the players ability. Progression is anywhere ranging from actually pointless to somewhat less useful than it is in tab target combat.

The above said, tab target is as much about the player as action combat is, it's just different things that the player needs to do.

The skilled gamer in a tab target game knows full well that those numbers are anything but arbitrary - because the skilled tab target player fully understands the system those numbers are used in (which means they are no longer arbitrary by definition).

No offence, but if you are playing a tab target game and a number seems arbitrary to you, then you are not a good tab target gamer.

So in your opinion when it comes to tab targeting there is no difference in who actually uses the character. If that's the case how is it that I can get more dps out of my WoW character than someone else, despite using the exact same spec and the same gear?

The difference in tab target combat is about the brain of the player using it, as opposed to twitch based reactions.

Caeryl

noaani wrote: »

Wandering Mist wrote: »

noaani wrote: »

Wandering Mist wrote: »

it should be about player skill, not character skill.

This is essentially the tab target vs action combat thing again.

Tab target is all about building your characters stats, your characters abilities. Character progression is the single most important thing.

Action combat is about the players ability. Progression is anywhere ranging from actually pointless to somewhat less useful than it is in tab target combat.

The above said, tab target is as much about the player as action combat is, it's just different things that the player needs to do.

The skilled gamer in a tab target game knows full well that those numbers are anything but arbitrary - because the skilled tab target player fully understands the system those numbers are used in (which means they are no longer arbitrary by definition).

No offence, but if you are playing a tab target game and a number seems arbitrary to you, then you are not a good tab target gamer.

So in your opinion when it comes to tab targeting there is no difference in who actually uses the character. If that's the case how is it that I can get more dps out of my WoW character than someone else, despite using the exact same spec and the same gear?

The difference in tab target combat is about the brain of the player using it, as opposed to *their brain, and aim, and ability to quickly adapt, and overall mastery of their character.

With that fixed. Natural progression is more of a tab focused system, since it’s all about stats rather than actual practice of skills.

It still has merit for an action combat system as a minor stat boost provided you engage with the systems your trying to gain mastery over.

Noaani

Caeryl wrote: »

noaani wrote: »

Wandering Mist wrote: »

noaani wrote: »

Wandering Mist wrote: »

it should be about player skill, not character skill.

This is essentially the tab target vs action combat thing again.

Tab target is all about building your characters stats, your characters abilities. Character progression is the single most important thing.

Action combat is about the players ability. Progression is anywhere ranging from actually pointless to somewhat less useful than it is in tab target combat.

The above said, tab target is as much about the player as action combat is, it's just different things that the player needs to do.

The skilled gamer in a tab target game knows full well that those numbers are anything but arbitrary - because the skilled tab target player fully understands the system those numbers are used in (which means they are no longer arbitrary by definition).

No offence, but if you are playing a tab target game and a number seems arbitrary to you, then you are not a good tab target gamer.

So in your opinion when it comes to tab targeting there is no difference in who actually uses the character. If that's the case how is it that I can get more dps out of my WoW character than someone else, despite using the exact same spec and the same gear?

The difference in tab target combat is about the brain of the player using it, as opposed to *their brain, and aim, and ability to quickly adapt, and overall mastery of their character.

With that fixed. Natural progression is more of a tab focused system, since it’s all about stats rather than actual practice of skills.

It still has merit for an action combat system as a minor stat boost provided you engage with the systems your trying to gain mastery over.

The amount of thought you need to put in to an action build as opposed to a tab target build makes it dishonest (at best) if you just say they both make use of the players brain.

There is a small amount of thought put in to it, sure. But there is a small amount of adaptability, reflex and often even aiming in a tab target game.

If you are going to claim that action combat takes brains, I will claim with the same level of validity that tab target takes the above.