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pre-order packages

NexmagusNexmagus Member
in General Discussion
My wife and I are liking what we see and are considering a pre-order package. My question, if we buy one at the top level could we then get a lower one but with the same level of alpha and beta access?
The cosmetic items really do not mean much to us, we are just after the early access.

Comments

  • SongcallerSongcaller Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    You would need a pack each of the Alpha 2 Packages but won't have to buy other packages, can pick and mix cosmetics after that.

    Or you could wait to see if Alpha 1 Packages reappear and get 2 of those packages. Again cosmetics would be pick and mix unless the new Alpha 1 packages have other offers attached. Wait until fall to see what happens.
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  • BirdieBirdie Moderator, Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    The pre-order packages are fixed. I assume you want a pack with alpha 2 access without all the cosmetics because you are not interested in them so you're looking for a pack without the cosmetics, just with the Alpha 2 + beta 1 and 2 access for a lower price.
    I'm afraid that there is no such pre-order package right now since all the packages include everything the previous (cheaper) packages offer + extra cosmetics /name reservations / beta keys.
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  • NexmagusNexmagus Member
    That, or also if we bought one at full price could we get another at a reduced price just with early access. The point is so we could play together at a slight discount
  • NoaaniNoaani Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha Two
    Nexmagus wrote: »
    My wife and I are liking what we see and are considering a pre-order package. My question, if we buy one at the top level could we then get a lower one but with the same level of alpha and beta access?
    The cosmetic items really do not mean much to us, we are just after the early access.

    Be aware that the alpha access isn't really "early access".

    It is an actual alpha, where things will be broken, things will not be implemented, and the server will wipe often. Beta will see a persistent server, but there are still likely to be systems that are not implemented or are known to be in a broken state. Also, the beta servers will be wiped before the game goes live.

    Actual early access (being able to log in to the live servers several days early), was a kickstarter exclusive, and won't be made available again.
  • AardvarkAardvark Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    edited July 2020
    noaani wrote: »
    Nexmagus wrote: »

    Actual early access (being able to log in to the live servers several days early), was a kickstarter exclusive, and won't be made available again.

    Wait what they sold true early access to a pvp focused game that noone else can get? If I had known that there is no way in hell I would bought a package as noone in their right mind wants to start a huge level grind on a pvp server several days behind. That is complete and total BS
  • NoaaniNoaani Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha Two
    Aardvark wrote: »
    Wait what they sold true early access to a pvp focused game that noone else can get? If I had known that there is no way in hell I would bought a package as noone in their right mind wants to start a huge level grind on a pvp server several days behind. That is complete and total BS
    This isn't a PvP focused game though.

    I think you need to take a look at the leveling process in Ashes, and where the content for that will come from.

    The game will launch with content up to about level 10, and nothing else - it may even be lower than that.

    In order to get content any higher than that, nodes need to be leveled. Node leveling won't be turned on until the full release.

    The gate to any player leveling up quickly is not going to be how fast they can level their character, it is going to be how fast they can level nodes in their area. Since this is an activity that will take 1,500 players to hit metropolis level (more like 2,000+ if you want to be first on your server), you have to treat all the players around you as your allies, not your enemies.

    Sure, you can kill them, but they are helping you level up, so why would you?

    Also, if this really bothers you, just start on a server that didn't have head start access.
  • AardvarkAardvark Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    noaani wrote: »
    Aardvark wrote: »
    Wait what they sold true early access to a pvp focused game that noone else can get? If I had known that there is no way in hell I would bought a package as noone in their right mind wants to start a huge level grind on a pvp server several days behind. That is complete and total BS
    This isn't a PvP focused game though.

    I think you need to take a look at the leveling process in Ashes, and where the content for that will come from.

    The game will launch with content up to about level 10, and nothing else - it may even be lower than that.

    In order to get content any higher than that, nodes need to be leveled. Node leveling won't be turned on until the full release.

    The gate to any player leveling up quickly is not going to be how fast they can level their character, it is going to be how fast they can level nodes in their area. Since this is an activity that will take 1,500 players to hit metropolis level (more like 2,000+ if you want to be first on your server), you have to treat all the players around you as your allies, not your enemies.

    Sure, you can kill them, but they are helping you level up, so why would you?

    Also, if this really bothers you, just start on a server that didn't have head start access.
    In at least half the mmo I have ever played I have been one of the 1st 10 or so to level cap on my server. There is no way I am starting 2 days late.
    And starting on a server with no one from beta isn’t really a choice either as that is one of the main reasons to play beta besides learn how to play if to find skilled guild mates you get along with and pick your sever
  • 3Snap3Snap Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    Aardvark wrote: »
    noaani wrote: »
    Aardvark wrote: »
    Wait what they sold true early access to a pvp focused game that noone else can get? If I had known that there is no way in hell I would bought a package as noone in their right mind wants to start a huge level grind on a pvp server several days behind. That is complete and total BS
    This isn't a PvP focused game though.

    I think you need to take a look at the leveling process in Ashes, and where the content for that will come from.

    The game will launch with content up to about level 10, and nothing else - it may even be lower than that.

    In order to get content any higher than that, nodes need to be leveled. Node leveling won't be turned on until the full release.

    The gate to any player leveling up quickly is not going to be how fast they can level their character, it is going to be how fast they can level nodes in their area. Since this is an activity that will take 1,500 players to hit metropolis level (more like 2,000+ if you want to be first on your server), you have to treat all the players around you as your allies, not your enemies.

    Sure, you can kill them, but they are helping you level up, so why would you?

    Also, if this really bothers you, just start on a server that didn't have head start access.
    In at least half the mmo I have ever played I have been one of the 1st 10 or so to level cap on my server. There is no way I am starting 2 days late.
    And starting on a server with no one from beta isn’t really a choice either as that is one of the main reasons to play beta besides learn how to play if to find skilled guild mates you get along with and pick your sever

    I actually kind of agree with you. They should bring back the head start access to all packages. This game keeps saying no pay to win. How the hell can a headstart in game limited to early backers only not be considered pay to win.

    With a headstart mayor's could be selected, it takes the ability to contribute to nodes away for a large player base that could have changed the races look of the city, could change the nodes location. But also could allow plots of land buy ups (freeholds).

    This should definitely be brought back for current and all future packs as a early headstart is 100% pay to win.
  • NexmagusNexmagus Member
    I am aware that is is really Alpha and Beta, I just called it early access. I have worked for a game developer in the past and quite familiar with the process.
  • NoaaniNoaani Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha Two
    Aardvark wrote: »
    noaani wrote: »
    Aardvark wrote: »
    Wait what they sold true early access to a pvp focused game that noone else can get? If I had known that there is no way in hell I would bought a package as noone in their right mind wants to start a huge level grind on a pvp server several days behind. That is complete and total BS
    This isn't a PvP focused game though.

    I think you need to take a look at the leveling process in Ashes, and where the content for that will come from.

    The game will launch with content up to about level 10, and nothing else - it may even be lower than that.

    In order to get content any higher than that, nodes need to be leveled. Node leveling won't be turned on until the full release.

    The gate to any player leveling up quickly is not going to be how fast they can level their character, it is going to be how fast they can level nodes in their area. Since this is an activity that will take 1,500 players to hit metropolis level (more like 2,000+ if you want to be first on your server), you have to treat all the players around you as your allies, not your enemies.

    Sure, you can kill them, but they are helping you level up, so why would you?

    Also, if this really bothers you, just start on a server that didn't have head start access.
    In at least half the mmo I have ever played I have been one of the 1st 10 or so to level cap on my server. There is no way I am starting 2 days late.
    And starting on a server with no one from beta isn’t really a choice either as that is one of the main reasons to play beta besides learn how to play if to find skilled guild mates you get along with and pick your sever
    As I said, the barrier in Ashes to leveling isn't going to be you, it is going to be nodes in your area.

    You will cap out your character leveling opportunities several times before hitting max level - even if you start a few days behind. While it isn't going to be a hard leveling cap, if you are lvel 30 and the highest level content around you is level 20, you aren't going to level very fast until the node does.

    If you are not in the cluster with the fastest leveling node on your server, you won't even be in the top 500 to the level cap.

    Also, since early access was kickstarter only, as opposed to the summer sale Ashes had and the cosmetic pack access to beta that they are selling, there are going to be as many people in the beta that don't have head start access as there are people that do.

    I don't have access to it, as an example, as I came to the game a month too late.

    It is also worth pointing out that the beta isn't going to be much of a help in terms of figuring out the fastest way to level up, as it is a guarantee that you won't see the same content on live as you see in beta. Steven has specifically said he doesn't want people to be able to use beta to get advanced knowledge of the game in order to level faster when the game released - to the point where they were even considering creating a map specific to beta testing only (I don't think this is still the case though).

  • 3Snap3Snap Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    noaani wrote: »
    Aardvark wrote: »
    noaani wrote: »
    Aardvark wrote: »
    Wait what they sold true early access to a pvp focused game that noone else can get? If I had known that there is no way in hell I would bought a package as noone in their right mind wants to start a huge level grind on a pvp server several days behind. That is complete and total BS
    This isn't a PvP focused game though.

    I think you need to take a look at the leveling process in Ashes, and where the content for that will come from.

    The game will launch with content up to about level 10, and nothing else - it may even be lower than that.

    In order to get content any higher than that, nodes need to be leveled. Node leveling won't be turned on until the full release.

    The gate to any player leveling up quickly is not going to be how fast they can level their character, it is going to be how fast they can level nodes in their area. Since this is an activity that will take 1,500 players to hit metropolis level (more like 2,000+ if you want to be first on your server), you have to treat all the players around you as your allies, not your enemies.

    Sure, you can kill them, but they are helping you level up, so why would you?

    Also, if this really bothers you, just start on a server that didn't have head start access.
    In at least half the mmo I have ever played I have been one of the 1st 10 or so to level cap on my server. There is no way I am starting 2 days late.
    And starting on a server with no one from beta isn’t really a choice either as that is one of the main reasons to play beta besides learn how to play if to find skilled guild mates you get along with and pick your sever
    As I said, the barrier in Ashes to leveling isn't going to be you, it is going to be nodes in your area.

    You will cap out your character leveling opportunities several times before hitting max level - even if you start a few days behind. While it isn't going to be a hard leveling cap, if you are lvel 30 and the highest level content around you is level 20, you aren't going to level very fast until the node does.

    If you are not in the cluster with the fastest leveling node on your server, you won't even be in the top 500 to the level cap.

    Also, since early access was kickstarter only, as opposed to the summer sale Ashes had and the cosmetic pack access to beta that they are selling, there are going to be as many people in the beta that don't have head start access as there are people that do.

    I don't have access to it, as an example, as I came to the game a month too late.

    It is also worth pointing out that the beta isn't going to be much of a help in terms of figuring out the fastest way to level up, as it is a guarantee that you won't see the same content on live as you see in beta. Steven has specifically said he doesn't want people to be able to use beta to get advanced knowledge of the game in order to level faster when the game released - to the point where they were even considering creating a map specific to beta testing only (I don't think this is still the case though).

    They could still resell headstart. All they have to do is sell a 3 or 4 day headstart, it would be a new benefit. Its all fair that lifetime and cosmetics ect aren't able to be obtained anymore. But early access no matter what is said is 100% pay to win. Your're getting access early to a game that no one else is able to obtain any longer.

    They need to bring back the ability for everyone else to have the opputunity to obtain.
  • NoaaniNoaani Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha Two
    3Snap wrote: »
    They could still resell headstart.
    Nope, they said it was an exclusive to kickstarter (though I can't remember where it was stated as such).

    A game developer going back on it's word before it's first product even releases is not a good look.

    Fortunately, instead of that, what they have done is set the game up so that the first day or two that people have as head start (depending on package level), they can't do much more than walk around the world and look at things.

    There really isn't much progression to be had, and what progression there is, players will likely be able to make up within the first hour or two of going live.

    By the end of the first day of the game being fully live, you will not be able to tell who had head start access and who didn't.
  • 3Snap3Snap Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    edited July 2020
    noaani wrote: »
    3Snap wrote: »
    They could still resell headstart.
    Nope, they said it was an exclusive to kickstarter (though I can't remember where it was stated as such).

    A game developer going back on it's word before it's first product even releases is not a good look.

    Fortunately, instead of that, what they have done is set the game up so that the first day or two that people have as head start (depending on package level), they can't do much more than walk around the world and look at things.

    There really isn't much progression to be had, and what progression there is, players will likely be able to make up within the first hour or two of going live.

    By the end of the first day of the game being fully live, you will not be able to tell who had head start access and who didn't.

    Just had a look at the offical kickstarter packages.
    Pledge US$ 150 or more
    Founder
    Invite to Closed Alpha - Phase 2 (Persistent Alpha)
    1 Additional Month of game time (4 Total)
    Kickstarter Exclusive - Spectral Mare mount
    Kickstarter Exclusive - Pseudo Dragon Pet
    Kickstarter Exclusive - Freehold appearance bundle Tier 2
    Kickstarter Exclusive - Character Founder's Costume
    Access to Live launch head-start - 1 day early!
    Unique "Founder" forum badge
    Unique in-game character title "Founder"

    Pledge US$ 500 or more
    Braver of Worlds
    Invite to Closed Alpha - Phase 1 (Earliest Access to Ashes!)
    Kickstarter Exclusive - Lifetime subscription to Ashes of Creation!!
    Access to Live launch head-start - 2 days early!
    Kickstarter Exclusive - Dawnbreaker Epic mount
    Kickstarter Exclusive - Character Royalty Costume
    Guild Name Reservation - 1 Name reserved
    Monster Tokens x 5 - Elite Tier
    Unique "Braver of Worlds" forum badge
    Unique in-game character title "Braver of Worlds"

    Plus all previous rewards!!

    They listed kickstarter exclusives on the same lines. Note Lifetime sub. However headstart is not listed as exclusive to kickstarter? Could still be possible to offer it to newcommers.
  • NoaaniNoaani Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha Two
    3Snap wrote: »

    They listed kickstarter exclusives on the same lines. Note Lifetime sub. However headstart is not listed as exclusive to kickstarter? Could still be possible to offer it to newcommers.
    This is why I said I can't remember where they said it.

    It was a comment they made after the kickstarter, possibly around the time of the summer sale they had (which is when I backed the game).

    While I can't find the comment, I can say that Intrepid have said that the head start packsage (both the one day and the two day) were kickstarter exclusive.
  • HazardNumberSevenHazardNumberSeven Member, Alpha Two
    I get that it sucks to miss out on stuff, but going back on such promises is really damaging to the image of the developers and the trust their playerbase has in them. It is also dishonest and immoral.

    If you sell someone an exclusive hat that you have now and will never have again, the exclusivity of the item is one of your selling points. It drives the price up and it attracts interest. People are buying what you sold them, an exclusive hat...

    If you come back later selling those same hats, you can bet people who bought the previous batch will be pissed, demanding refunds/start lawsuits/an angry mob, and the people who didn't buy them will take note and think to themselves "Oh. Okay. That hat guy is dishonest and scamming people." Hat guy LIED. Lying is bad, m'kay.
  • NoaaniNoaani Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha Two
    edited July 2020
    hazardnumberseven wrote: »
    I get that it sucks to miss out on stuff, but going back on such promises is really damaging to the image of the developers and the trust their playerbase has in them. It is also dishonest and immoral.

    If you sell someone an exclusive hat that you have now and will never have again, the exclusivity of the item is one of your selling points. It drives the price up and it attracts interest. People are buying what you sold them, an exclusive hat...

    If you come back later selling those same hats, you can bet people who bought the previous batch will be pissed, demanding refunds/start lawsuits/an angry mob, and the people who didn't buy them will take note and think to themselves "Oh. Okay. That hat guy is dishonest and scamming people." Hat guy LIED. Lying is bad, m'kay.

    Yeah, this is all true.

    But on top of that, if you are a game developer that has said you will only sell lifetime subscripts and early access at one specific point in time, and then go on to sell them again, how are your players supposed to believe you when you say that your cash shop is cosmetic only?

    There are a lot of people that are willing to pay a lot for early access and lifetime subscriptions - myself included. The fact that Intrepid are not willing to take our money over keeping their word should be something we are all happy about.

    Despite wanting both early access and a lifestime subscription, I am actually glad both are out of my reach - purely because it means Intrepid have a higher moral code than any other MMO developer out there.
  • HazardNumberSevenHazardNumberSeven Member, Alpha Two
    noaani wrote: »
    hazardnumberseven wrote: »
    I get that it sucks to miss out on stuff, but going back on such promises is really damaging to the image of the developers and the trust their playerbase has in them. It is also dishonest and immoral.

    If you sell someone an exclusive hat that you have now and will never have again, the exclusivity of the item is one of your selling points. It drives the price up and it attracts interest. People are buying what you sold them, an exclusive hat...

    If you come back later selling those same hats, you can bet people who bought the previous batch will be pissed, demanding refunds/start lawsuits/an angry mob, and the people who didn't buy them will take note and think to themselves "Oh. Okay. That hat guy is dishonest and scamming people." Hat guy LIED. Lying is bad, m'kay.

    Yeah, this is all true.

    But on top of that, if you are a game developer that has said you will only sell lifetime subscripts and early access at one specific point in time, and then go on to sell them again, how are your players supposed to believe you when you say that your cash shop is cosmetic only?

    There are a lot of people that are willing to pay a lot for early access and lifetime subscriptions - myself included. The fact that Intrepid are not willing to take our money over keeping their word should be something we are all happy about.

    Despite wanting both early access and a lifestime subscription, I am actually glad both are out of my reach - purely because it means Intrepid have a higher moral code than any other MMO developer out there.

    Exactly. It really helps me trust them, seeing them stick to their words and promises like that.
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