How the node system could negatively influence the questing experience [Leveling progression]

Fihera

First of all: I Love the node system !

But when it comes to questing, i have one core issue
So i like to discuss on whether i've missed something, anybody is able to prove me wrong or if there are people sharing my concerns.

During the recent AMA and other Interviews we've learned a lot. (thanks for involving the community ! )

Here is what i've understood:
- around 103 Nodes at launch
- nodes have 7 stages
- 4 node types
- maximum of 5 metropolis
- nodes grow by the activities people do in the certain areas
- Endly, the higher the level of the node, the more content is available (housing, major's etc.)

More info via the official site (https://ashesofcreation.com/news/2019-03-16-know-your-nodes-the-basics ), but thats not relevant for my point

What i miss during all this, and since there are levels for the players and mobs, is if nodes have also got a level spectre to them (e.g. 1-10, 20-25 etc.)
The only thing i know is that in one interview it was mentioned that the higher the node, the harder the mobs around it.

So here comes my issue:

Theory: Node system has NO LEVEL SPECTRE

How do people know in which node area to level next? So we need some sort of an idea, which node stage supports which level area.
Since the max level ist 50, counting out stage 7 nodes for potential endgame content only, there would then be 6 node stages delivering content up to lvl 50.
That could be a solid solution, knowing by the node stages, where you have to travel.

BUT

We actually have no idea how long it takes to bring up a node to the next stage.
Example: Imagine you quest your way through a node first stage 0, then stage 1 and finally stage 2, and now you are around lvl 25, hanging around a stage 2 node, looking for more content.
In my theory you would then have to get to a node that is at least stage 3 to get quest around your level.
But since all the nodes start as stage 0 when the game launches (correct me if wrong!) there won't be a level 3 node avaible, only a bunch of 0,1 and 2's .

So what do you do then? Leveling up a entire new node until lvl 3? Bashing out low lvl Mobs till it's done? (remember you are lvl 25)
For all the Smart people now saying: "Well , i go back where i started, why not stay at one certain node"
Smart move, but if you do that, what would LOW LEVEL Players do then? Especially around the starting areas with no other nodes around?

MY ISSUE IN A NUTSHELL: If nodes are somewhat level capped to certain levels, we would then ruin the starting areas by pushing nodes around it to the max, forcing new Players to walk through the lands (remember no fast travel) all the way along potential high lvl zones, looking for low stage nodes to then finally be able start the game.

Solution:

Scale the quests and mobs in a node area to players level, so everyone can get progress, regardless the level.
The problem with that is though, that would mean all the dungeons, bosses etc would also be scaled. So we could potentially see a bunch of lvl 1 guys rushing a world boss ( overreacting and absolutely theoretically !!!! ) and kill him.
Think then about Loot etc.
You guys know what i mean...


There are certainly many other points that could be mentioned in relation to my theory, but i'll cut it here for now.

Please do not hesitate to tell me if i'm wrong or missed a core information on that, but i couldn't find it.
Also feel free to discuss on the progression system when it comes to leveling

Regards and stay hyped

Fihera

Raoul9753

As far as I understood it evolving the nodes will open new areas around it, while still keeping the old ones, so new players will be able to level next to evolved nodes no problem, as long as they keep out of the higher level areas.

Caeryl

I feel like you should visit the wiki, that one article is not remotely comprehensive info on the node system. We do actually have approximate time requirements for node stages known.

One major thing that runs contrary to your concerns here, Ashes is not being designed with leveled zones in mind. Players aren’t supposed to play Follow the Numbers in their leveling experience.

When it’s stated there will be harder content around higher level nodes, that doesn’t mean the outer walls of a metro are under constant assault by lvl50 mobs; it just means that node will create difficult content in its Zone of Interest and offer more quests for higher levels.

It’s very likely the starter areas will end up one of the world’s metros, and that’s part of the design too. High traffic, high activity areas will flourish and offer more amenities to a player than a lower level node.

George_Black

Right, look, change the wording of "questing" to xping, because questing brings either images of themepark POI quest hubs, following the lore and reaching max lv in a few days at the final arc, or real quests with actual progression rewards, that I am pretty sure the devs won't mess up by not preparing Nodes properly.

To the main issue. Scaling mechanics are just the worst. It takes away any sense of achievement. It rly rly rly won't work in this game, because firstly you would end up putting together experienced players and newbies. Why is this bad? Well newbies will get rekt in any pvp scenario and secondly... no forget secondly, I'll bring it up in a moment.

The thing with nodes is that nodes are not villages or towns, like in the other games. You don't start from alpha village with lv1 wolves and foxes to kill, then you head to beta village with lv8 orcs and skeletons to kill, and then to gama village with the next lv15 bunch of mobs.

Pay attention to this part. Around nodes there will be some hunting zones, like caves, or ancient ruins or forests. The deeper you go to these places, the more challenging the mobs will be. So alpha, beta, gama node will have lv1, lv 8, lv15, lv20 and so on mobs.
The further away you get from the node (I presume) the more difficult mobs you will find out, so you'd want to set up a good team if not a full group to xp safely without dying and having to go all the way back to the node.
I mentioned 'secondly' before. If you have scaling, these groups will be formed by experienced and newbies and there will be a lot of annoyance and toxicity, due to scaling, and the mess it creates since it doesn't prepare players for more complex situations.

Finally, as Nodes lv up, certain events will trigger, meaning that the caves, ancient ruins, forests will develop as mean, meaning new, harder mobs will appear in the new, deeper parts of those zones near the nodes.

I hope this gives u better idea of what the world is going to be like and you put your fears aside.

grisu

You are coming at it from the wrong angle, you are assuming that nodes produce the content on itself, but that's not really the case. The world exists before the node and the node grows within that ecosystem.

Starting area of all races have a node from the start, if the node levels to stage 4 does that mean you can't start there any more? No, it just has more diverse content from the get go for you. Maybe some low-level mob groups are pushed away, relocated or replaced with higher ones but it's not like you have to travel to the next node first to start leveling. So some quests might disappear, but others open up for it.

Also something to point out which seems to be crucial in this assumption of yours (tying in of what i said above) is that higher level nodes are responsible for a bigger area than lower level ones. They don't just produce content right around it but in further away areas too.
!!"">>Simplified<<""!! a level 1 node is responsible for quests in a 1km² area around it while a level 4 node is responsible curating content in a 4km² area. They gobble up more and more area around it.

So to put it in a way you laid it out a node of level 1 that is close to a starting area might have a spectre of 1-10 and when it goes up to level 2 the spectre reaches 1-20 while a level 5 that's in the middle of the continent far away from a starting area might be 20-50-??.

Point is lower level doesn't get abandoned and I'm sure they will think of something to indicate the relative difficulty for you when taking on quests.

phdmonster

If you ask me we shouldn't know the levels of a node to monster level formula and neither should we have information on which node is which stage unless we are locally in that node.
Finding out a node where you can continue leveling up should be part of the game and adventure, not decided by a zone level map like in WoW.

In addition, there is always a choice. You can stay in the current Node, help level it up if you are past its difficulty or you can skip town and try to find another node that is higher level.