If we have regional pricing without server locks, what is to stop me from paying the much cheaper price by VPNing to that area and playing? Why would I pay US prices when I can get a much much cheaper price by just paying the price for a region nearby yet playing with people paying full? That would be a great way to kill a wonderful new studio.
You probably didn't read this and don't care, but I hope you can bear with me:
Regional pricing assumes you live in the country you're getting that harmonized price, so in order to do it, IS will need to make sure people can't exploit it (3rd party companies easily solve this issue. It's not too difficult and it already works today for many platforms).
There are systems in place today that don't use only your IP address to determine if you are in that region and if you can pay that region's pricing. You usually need a credit card or a bank account from a country covered by that region. This can be a problem surely, but it's not that difficult to make it harder to abuse it. Nobody wants regional pricing to be abused, no one advocates for that. Also, if you're somehow caught doing that, that should be a bannable offense.
I can see you don't want people from shitty countries to pay a cheaper price than you do but be able to play on the same server as you, but could you please let Intrepid at least give it a shot?
Once the game launches, let there be regional pricing with no region locks as a trial. If things go badly, if people are abusing it and Intrepid is detecting it, if most of the botters/RMT/people breaking the rules are from other regions, etc then simply say the trial is over and tie regional pricing back to regional servers. At least those fiends (like myself) were given the chance, even though "we" blew it.
If you think what I'm asking for isn't fair that's fine and I might agree with you, it can be seen as something unfair to ask for. I'm simply asking for some empathy and trying to give examples of other games that allow this.
If we have regional pricing without server locks, what is to stop me from paying the much cheaper price by VPNing to that area and playing? Why would I pay US prices when I can get a much much cheaper price by just paying the price for a region nearby yet playing with people paying full? That would be a great way to kill a wonderful new studio.
You probably didn't read this and don't care, but I hope you can bear with me:
Regional pricing assumes you live in the country you're getting that harmonized price, so in order to do it, IS will need to make sure people can't exploit it (3rd party companies easily solve this issue. It's not too difficult and it already works today for many platforms).
There are systems in place today that don't use only your IP address to determine if you are in that region and if you can pay that region's pricing. You usually need a credit card or a bank account from a country covered by that region. This can be a problem surely, but it's not that difficult to make it harder to abuse it. Nobody wants regional pricing to be abused, no one advocates for that. Also, if you're somehow caught doing that, that should be a bannable offense.
I can see you don't want people from shitty countries to pay a cheaper price than you do but be able to play on the same server as you, but could you please let Intrepid at least give it a shot?
Once the game launches, let there be regional pricing with no region locks as a trial. If things go badly, if people are abusing it and Intrepid is detecting it, if most of the botters/RMT/people breaking the rules are from other regions, etc then simply say the trial is over and tie regional pricing back to regional servers. At least those fiends (like myself) were given the chance, even though "we" blew it.
If you think what I'm asking for isn't fair that's fine and I might agree with you, it can be seen as something unfair to ask for. I'm simply asking for some empathy and trying to give examples of other games that allow this.
They can't do this.
The players that are paying less and playing on a server that is not of that region would have two options (whether the players make it or Intrepid make it for them).
The first is that they would have to all move to a server of that region. The second is that they would have to pay in the region they are playing in.
In the first situation, you are breaking up communities. In the second, Intrepid are opening themselves up to legal challenge (since there would still be regions paying that same price).
Basically, there is absolutely no way that a trial for this could go well for Intrepid. The state they go live in is the state they have to stay in, unless they completely revamp the economic model for the entire game.
Offering the game at a lower rate in some regions seems to me to be excessively generous. There are only a very small number of MMO's that do this, and every single one of them is backed by a company much larger than Intrepid.
As a second point, part of the reason it will be possible for Intrepid to offer this is because they will be paying local server rates for these servers, rather than US server rates.
Paying a cheaper price and then using US server resources may actually end up costing Intrepid money, rather than make them a profit.
If you are saying you are from a region, and thus are paying less to play the game, it is only fair that you play the game on a server that is paid for in the same economy in which you are paying for the game.
Personally, if I were from one of those regions, I would take what has been offered and be thankful for it.
The players that are paying less and playing on a server that is not of that region would have two options (whether the players make it or Intrepid make it for them).
The first is that they would have to all move to a server of that region. The second is that they would have to pay in the region they are playing in.
In the first situation, you are breaking up communities. In the second, Intrepid are opening themselves up to legal challenge (since there would still be regions paying that same price).
Basically, there is absolutely no way that a trial for this could go well for Intrepid. The state they go live in is the state they have to stay in, unless they completely revamp the economic model for the entire game.
I gotta disagree; I don't think it's as bad as you make it look like. If it's on their Terms of Service that they might increase the subscription fee if needed (which's essentially what would happen), they ought to be able to do it. And I never proposed server transfers if Intrepid went back to their original plan, that character wouldn't be moved anywhere. People who chose to do it would know beforehand (by accepting the ToS) the risks of making a character in a different region's server.
What if a region has no regional servers and/or that region's servers have to be shutdown due to low numbers. Will they then offer regional pricing with no region locks or will they simply ignore the (few) potential players who live in those places?
It might not go well for Intrepid as much as it might make no difference whatsoever, specially if the majority of players who pay for regional pricing want to play in their regional servers in the first place (low ping, language barrier, etc).
Offering the game at a lower rate in some regions seems to me to be excessively generous. There are only a very small number of MMO's that do this, and every single one of them is backed by a company much larger than Intrepid.
As a second point, part of the reason it will be possible for Intrepid to offer this is because they will be paying local server rates for these servers, rather than US server rates.
Paying a cheaper price and then using US server resources may actually end up costing Intrepid money, rather than make them a profit.
This may be true, but again I don't think enough people will do it in order to make Intrepid lose money because of it.
If you are saying you are from a region, and thus are paying less to play the game, it is only fair that you play the game on a server that is paid for in the same economy in which you are paying for the game.
Personally, if I were from one of those regions, I would take what has been offered and be thankful for it.
I always said their current choice is fair and (hopefully) I haven't been ungrateful for it, on the contrary, I'm happy I might at least be able to afford it to play on my region's servers. I also agree that what I'm asking for can be seen as unfair, but I'm honestly surprised by some reactions, as I've never heard any complaints regarding this on the other games I've played that allow this.
I don't want Intrepid to lose money or to ruin others' experiences, I only want to be given the chance to play with the same people I play WoW, OSRS, Dota, etc and be able to afford it.
TL;DR: I don't think what I'm asking for is as big a deal as some may think. For instance, if Steven didn't address this topic on the AMA and there were no regional prices tied to regional servers on launch, I highly doubt people would complain (as long as the system can't be abused/exploited).
I always said their current choice is fair and (hopefully) I haven't been ungrateful for it
It does come across as if you are ungrateful.
Intrepid have said they will set up regional servers, with regional payment structures, in order to allow people in parts of the world with slightly lesser economies to play this game.
Intrepid are still paying their staff in US$. In fact, they are still paying most of hteir bills in US$. Even if they are paying for local server capacity in the local currency, the bulk of their expenses will be in US$.
If you are paying in local currency, and are paying an amount that is less than what the exchange rate would suggest you would pay in US$, then Intrepid are having to make that shortfall up.
If you then pay that lesser amount, require Intrepid to pay their staff in US$, and also take up resources that need to be paid in US$, then yes, Intrepid will actually lose money on the deal with you.
As it stands, you have a choice. That is more than most games give you - more than any game has given players when that game is the studios first product and is not yet even released.
Most companies would simply tell you to fuck off.
Intrepid didn't.
A thank you is in order, as far as I am concerned - not asking for even more.
This may be true, but again I don't think enough people will do it in order to make Intrepid lose money because of it.
If people can easily play the game while saving a few dollars a month with no penalty, people will.
That's really disappointing then, because I'm not. I'm trying to be as respectful and humble as I possibly can. Maybe I don't know how to properly do it in another language, for that I apologize.
If people can easily play the game while saving a few dollars a month with no penalty, people will.
Which people are you talking about? Are you talking about people who live in NA and abuse/exploit regional pricing? That would have to be prevented like other companies do and be a bannable offense if caught.
If you're talking about people who, in this example, live in SA and choose to play in NA, I think you're mistaken. Most people would not play in NA because of higher ping and language barrier. This is my opinion and not a fact, but I'm basing it off of my experience in online games and people I know from my region, so please take it with a grain of salt.
If you then pay that lesser amount, require Intrepid to pay their staff in US$, and also take up resources that need to be paid in US$, then yes, Intrepid will actually lose money on the deal with you.
I understand what it means for people who pay less to play on "more expensive" servers and that most of the company's costs are in USD. Intrepid would indeed lose money if loads of people paid $5 to play a $15 game. I'm not trying to deny that nor am I trying to say this financial loss is a good thing. I'm simply asking for an opportunity, and if this opportunity indeed hurts the company, if it hurts the game or if it hurts anything else, then by all means remove it altogether and tie regional prices back to regional servers.
I don't want to ruin the game or hurt Intrepid, I'm respectfully and cordially asking to be able to play Ashes with the same people I play other games, while being able to afford it.
Blizzard offer game subscription at regional price (and you can use any server) and work fine.
Offering a single price in a single currency prevents some users from trying to abuse the system, but they lose a large number of customers.
Players from other regions frustrated, loss of revenue from those players, less advertising on the network, greater competition, servers with less population.
On the other hand.
Happy local players, avoid billing problems, avoid latency problems, concentrate their resources in a smaller area.
The proposal to create one of the best gaming communities can be based on the premise of:
- Sacrifice the participation of a group to ensure the satisfaction of the rest.
or
- Increase the access possibilities of a group reducing the satisfaction of the rest.
If we take into account the monetization model chosen by Steven we can see that clearly and according to his sayings he chose to monetize part of the game's content through microtransactions (reduction of the satisfaction of those who appreciate that all content is acquired by playing, including cosmetics) to favor access to the game by consumers who may see the payment of the base game as an impediment.
This same criterion could be applied to the subscription and server access model.
Offering regional prices without limiting access to the servers not only guarantees equal opportunities to play but also promotes the interaction of users from different regions and the possibility of being able to play with distant friends or family.
Comments
You probably didn't read this and don't care, but I hope you can bear with me:
There are systems in place today that don't use only your IP address to determine if you are in that region and if you can pay that region's pricing. You usually need a credit card or a bank account from a country covered by that region. This can be a problem surely, but it's not that difficult to make it harder to abuse it. Nobody wants regional pricing to be abused, no one advocates for that. Also, if you're somehow caught doing that, that should be a bannable offense.
I can see you don't want people from shitty countries to pay a cheaper price than you do but be able to play on the same server as you, but could you please let Intrepid at least give it a shot?
Once the game launches, let there be regional pricing with no region locks as a trial. If things go badly, if people are abusing it and Intrepid is detecting it, if most of the botters/RMT/people breaking the rules are from other regions, etc then simply say the trial is over and tie regional pricing back to regional servers. At least those fiends (like myself) were given the chance, even though "we" blew it.
If you think what I'm asking for isn't fair that's fine and I might agree with you, it can be seen as something unfair to ask for. I'm simply asking for some empathy and trying to give examples of other games that allow this.
They can't do this.
The players that are paying less and playing on a server that is not of that region would have two options (whether the players make it or Intrepid make it for them).
The first is that they would have to all move to a server of that region. The second is that they would have to pay in the region they are playing in.
In the first situation, you are breaking up communities. In the second, Intrepid are opening themselves up to legal challenge (since there would still be regions paying that same price).
Basically, there is absolutely no way that a trial for this could go well for Intrepid. The state they go live in is the state they have to stay in, unless they completely revamp the economic model for the entire game.
Offering the game at a lower rate in some regions seems to me to be excessively generous. There are only a very small number of MMO's that do this, and every single one of them is backed by a company much larger than Intrepid.
As a second point, part of the reason it will be possible for Intrepid to offer this is because they will be paying local server rates for these servers, rather than US server rates.
Paying a cheaper price and then using US server resources may actually end up costing Intrepid money, rather than make them a profit.
If you are saying you are from a region, and thus are paying less to play the game, it is only fair that you play the game on a server that is paid for in the same economy in which you are paying for the game.
Personally, if I were from one of those regions, I would take what has been offered and be thankful for it.
I gotta disagree; I don't think it's as bad as you make it look like. If it's on their Terms of Service that they might increase the subscription fee if needed (which's essentially what would happen), they ought to be able to do it. And I never proposed server transfers if Intrepid went back to their original plan, that character wouldn't be moved anywhere. People who chose to do it would know beforehand (by accepting the ToS) the risks of making a character in a different region's server.
What if a region has no regional servers and/or that region's servers have to be shutdown due to low numbers. Will they then offer regional pricing with no region locks or will they simply ignore the (few) potential players who live in those places?
It might not go well for Intrepid as much as it might make no difference whatsoever, specially if the majority of players who pay for regional pricing want to play in their regional servers in the first place (low ping, language barrier, etc).
This may be true, but again I don't think enough people will do it in order to make Intrepid lose money because of it.
I always said their current choice is fair and (hopefully) I haven't been ungrateful for it, on the contrary, I'm happy I might at least be able to afford it to play on my region's servers. I also agree that what I'm asking for can be seen as unfair, but I'm honestly surprised by some reactions, as I've never heard any complaints regarding this on the other games I've played that allow this.
I don't want Intrepid to lose money or to ruin others' experiences, I only want to be given the chance to play with the same people I play WoW, OSRS, Dota, etc and be able to afford it.
TL;DR: I don't think what I'm asking for is as big a deal as some may think. For instance, if Steven didn't address this topic on the AMA and there were no regional prices tied to regional servers on launch, I highly doubt people would complain (as long as the system can't be abused/exploited).
Sorry for any English mistakes.
Intrepid have said they will set up regional servers, with regional payment structures, in order to allow people in parts of the world with slightly lesser economies to play this game.
Intrepid are still paying their staff in US$. In fact, they are still paying most of hteir bills in US$. Even if they are paying for local server capacity in the local currency, the bulk of their expenses will be in US$.
If you are paying in local currency, and are paying an amount that is less than what the exchange rate would suggest you would pay in US$, then Intrepid are having to make that shortfall up.
If you then pay that lesser amount, require Intrepid to pay their staff in US$, and also take up resources that need to be paid in US$, then yes, Intrepid will actually lose money on the deal with you.
As it stands, you have a choice. That is more than most games give you - more than any game has given players when that game is the studios first product and is not yet even released.
Most companies would simply tell you to fuck off.
Intrepid didn't.
A thank you is in order, as far as I am concerned - not asking for even more. If people can easily play the game while saving a few dollars a month with no penalty, people will.
That's really disappointing then, because I'm not. I'm trying to be as respectful and humble as I possibly can. Maybe I don't know how to properly do it in another language, for that I apologize.
Which people are you talking about? Are you talking about people who live in NA and abuse/exploit regional pricing? That would have to be prevented like other companies do and be a bannable offense if caught.
If you're talking about people who, in this example, live in SA and choose to play in NA, I think you're mistaken. Most people would not play in NA because of higher ping and language barrier. This is my opinion and not a fact, but I'm basing it off of my experience in online games and people I know from my region, so please take it with a grain of salt.
I understand what it means for people who pay less to play on "more expensive" servers and that most of the company's costs are in USD. Intrepid would indeed lose money if loads of people paid $5 to play a $15 game. I'm not trying to deny that nor am I trying to say this financial loss is a good thing. I'm simply asking for an opportunity, and if this opportunity indeed hurts the company, if it hurts the game or if it hurts anything else, then by all means remove it altogether and tie regional prices back to regional servers.
I don't want to ruin the game or hurt Intrepid, I'm respectfully and cordially asking to be able to play Ashes with the same people I play other games, while being able to afford it.
Offering a single price in a single currency prevents some users from trying to abuse the system, but they lose a large number of customers.
Players from other regions frustrated, loss of revenue from those players, less advertising on the network, greater competition, servers with less population.
On the other hand.
Happy local players, avoid billing problems, avoid latency problems, concentrate their resources in a smaller area.
The proposal to create one of the best gaming communities can be based on the premise of:
- Sacrifice the participation of a group to ensure the satisfaction of the rest.
or
- Increase the access possibilities of a group reducing the satisfaction of the rest.
If we take into account the monetization model chosen by Steven we can see that clearly and according to his sayings he chose to monetize part of the game's content through microtransactions (reduction of the satisfaction of those who appreciate that all content is acquired by playing, including cosmetics) to favor access to the game by consumers who may see the payment of the base game as an impediment.
This same criterion could be applied to the subscription and server access model.
Offering regional prices without limiting access to the servers not only guarantees equal opportunities to play but also promotes the interaction of users from different regions and the possibility of being able to play with distant friends or family.