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Idea

HylobatesHylobates Member
in General Discussion
Hello, we talked on the discord about the Tank archetype. It's a little detail but it kinda bugs me that an archetype is more of a role than a class/title, which doesn't help the game immersion.
Someone then suggested a "Defender" instead of the Tank, which to me works much better.
Was hoping that Idea reaches the devs =)

In the end I'm so hyped about AOC that this little detail won't ruin the experience for me.

Comments

  • ZeekMysticZeekMystic Member
    Yeah it is a little jarring that all the other archetypes and classes have these epic fantasy names and then you have Tank. It’s something that’s bugged me since learning of the game, it’s also the archetype I’m gonna main so would love to see it changed lol
  • dawntrackerdawntracker Member, Alpha Two
    Hylobates wrote: »
    Hello, we talked on the discord about the Tank archetype. It's a little detail but it kinda bugs me that an archetype is more of a role than a class/title, which doesn't help the game immersion.
    Someone then suggested a "Defender" instead of the Tank, which to me works much better.
    Was hoping that Idea reaches the devs =)

    In the end I'm so hyped about AOC that this little detail won't ruin the experience for me.

    I fully agree with this. I dont really mind if they keep it tank, but it just seems a bit out of place. Would like to see a different name for it.

    In the end, just like you, a detail like that wouldn't ruin it for me, but it's a detail that I personally would like to see changed.
  • FrassleFrassle Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    I totally agree and it matters to nerds like us! It's a cleric, not a healer. I'm also not huge on fighter, but seems like a change from the always used warrior. But aren't we all fighters? There are also specific class names once combined with a secondary archetype, which does circumvent this a little.
  • bigepeenbigepeen Member
    If you think the primary archetype names are generic, then call people by their full primary/secondary class name! I think whoever named the latter did a great job. Perhaps the primary archetype names are meant to be bland to eliminate confusion with people thinking it's a full class name.
  • winner909098winner909098 Member, Alpha Two
    bigepeen wrote: »
    If you think the primary archetype names are generic, then call people by their full primary/secondary class name! I think whoever named the latter did a great job. Perhaps the primary archetype names are meant to be bland to eliminate confusion with people thinking it's a full class name.

    Good point!
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    https://knightsofember.com/forums/members/winner909098.54
  • Hurf DerfmanHurf Derfman Member
    I honestly don't care what it's called. At the end of the day I'll be a Paladin. 😉
  • AtamaAtama Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    I’ll second the request for Defender, or maybe change it to Guardian and make a Guardian/Guardian be a Champion. Champion and Defender are much better names than the absolutely anachronistic name “Tank”. Or perhaps Armsman, or Juggernaut, or any other relevant name that isn’t currently used in the class system for Ashes. If I tried I could probably come up with a dozen names better than “Tank”.

    Remember that term references the armored war vehicle that was developed for World War I. The term would be meaningless in-game for a fantasy world no more technologically advanced than late medieval/early renaissance. While some of the names could use some improvement (do we need both Guardian and Shadow Guardian, and what the hell is a Spellmancer supposed to be, some kind of Witchlock or Wizcaster?) there is still no name as egregiously bad as Tank.
     
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  • Valento92Valento92 Member
    Defender is a great name, I like it.
    "Magic is not a tool, little one. It is a river that unites us in its current."

    I heard a bird ♫
  • KneczhevoKneczhevo Member
    Ya, this has been a hashed out topic, that has lost momentum. Until, Steven says otherwise, it's tank /sigh. Everyone is waiting for this week's q&a.

    But, please keep pushing.

    I'm pushing for a lexicon, hopefully Intrepid will listen.

  • KarthosKarthos Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    Is it 2017 again?
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  • KhronusKhronus Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    I'm down to be called a Guardian. Tank is such a silly class name.

    The meaning of tank - noun
    1.a large receptacle or storage chamber, especially for liquid or gas.
    2.a heavy armored fighting vehicle carrying guns and moving on a continuous articulated metal track.

    The meaning of Guardian - Noun

    1.a defender, protector, or keeper.


    Like this should be a no brainer here.
  • Medrash1Medrash1 Member
    Hylobates wrote: »
    Hello, we talked on the discord about the Tank archetype. It's a little detail but it kinda bugs me that an archetype is more of a role than a class/title, which doesn't help the game immersion.
    Someone then suggested a "Defender" instead of the Tank, which to me works much better.
    Was hoping that Idea reaches the devs =)

    In the end I'm so hyped about AOC that this little detail won't ruin the experience for me.

    I already spoken about this in one of my posts. The tank as you said is a rule and not a class ... like calling the cleric the "healer" .
    it's not just immersion and a name , it is the whole class design that is messy.
    Usually the warrior or knight or paladin ... i think that Paladin is pretty good and sound good too. Or guardian , defender.

    In mmorpg usually the warrior can be both, tank and dps... here it's not the case becouse we have only 1 class with one directional rule . For this reason primarily the class system has some issues.
  • Hurf DerfmanHurf Derfman Member
    KHRONUS wrote: »
    I'm down to be called a Guardian. Tank is such a silly class name.

    The meaning of tank - noun
    1.a large receptacle or storage chamber, especially for liquid or gas.
    2.a heavy armored fighting vehicle carrying guns and moving on a continuous articulated metal track.

    The meaning of Guardian - Noun

    1.a defender, protector, or keeper.


    Like this should be a no brainer here.

    Tank/tank= Guardian
    Tank/summoner= Keeper

    The word protector could technically also describe a healer so...
    Here is a better word for ya to mull over:

    Vanguard
    1: the forefront of an action or movement
    2: the troops moving at the head of an army
  • AtamaAtama Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    Hurf Derfman wrote: »
    KHRONUS wrote: »
    I'm down to be called a Guardian. Tank is such a silly class name.

    The meaning of tank - noun
    1.a large receptacle or storage chamber, especially for liquid or gas.
    2.a heavy armored fighting vehicle carrying guns and moving on a continuous articulated metal track.

    The meaning of Guardian - Noun

    1.a defender, protector, or keeper.


    Like this should be a no brainer here.

    Tank/tank= Guardian
    Tank/summoner= Keeper

    The word protector could technically also describe a healer so...
    Here is a better word for ya to mull over:

    Vanguard
    1: the forefront of an action or movement
    2: the troops moving at the head of an army
    Sure, better than Tank.
     
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  • KhronusKhronus Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    @Hurf Derfman I think any word would be more fitting. If we call the tanking class a "guardian" then the subclass mirror should also be called guardian. True to the form since you chose your subtype as your primary.

    Cleric/cleric should be called cleric and every other subclass option should change it's referred to name. If this makes the name sound lame in comparison to others, then the original name is the issue. rogue/rogue being called a rogue is indeed lame. There just could be more thought put into the actual class names and not all the energy going into combination names imo.
  • Hurf DerfmanHurf Derfman Member
    @KHRONUS a Vanguard/Vanguard could be called a Vanguardian. 😏
  • HylobatesHylobates Member
    Yeah, I saw different posts about this subject. I can imagine they realise the names for archetypes/classes need some rework but since they have so much other work to do, they will leave going over the names for later. In the end it's not actually a game changing detail.
    Still hope they take a look eventually
  • DamoklesDamokles Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    LETS ALL JUST AGREE THAT MOST NAMES WOULD BE BETTER THEN TANK.
  • PlagueMonkPlagueMonk Member
    I thought this was already settled, ah well. (don't forget about Dreadnought while you're changing things ;) )
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  • FuryBladeborneFuryBladeborne Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    edited August 2020
    The reasoning behind the Archetype names is, IS designed the class system as starting with an Archetype (which describes a game play strategy) and then combines that Archetype with another Archetype to create what is normally called a class.

    When players come to Ashes, they look at the Archetype names and expect to see classes. Their expectation is confirmed by the fact that all of the archetype names aside from Tank are names that are commonly used for class names in other games. That is why Tank feels out of place. Players expect to see class names and Tank doesn't fit the normal category.

    All that being said, I am in favor of changing Tank to Defender (or another fitting name that sounds like a class) as well for the sake of homogeneity that will result in making the archetypes less confusing as more players come; and, to reduce these threads. :/
  • KhronusKhronus Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    @hurf Bruh. Genius.
  • KhronusKhronus Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    @FuryBladeborne If this is the case, then we can never have another tank class added to the game. Also, we would need to change the cleric name to "healer" as this is literally how dumb it currently is to be called "tank".
  • FuryBladeborneFuryBladeborne Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    You don't understand. All 8 classes listed under the Tank archetype are versions of Tank classes.

    Also, I agree that Tank does not match Cleric. I explained that all the Archetype names sound like class names except Tank and that is why I ended with I agree that Tank should be changed to defender or another similar name.
  • AtamaAtama Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    KHRONUS wrote: »
    @FuryBladeborne If this is the case, then we can never have another tank class added to the game. Also, we would need to change the cleric name to "healer" as this is literally how dumb it currently is to be called "tank".
    I disagree with you here. "Healer" would make sense as the name of a person who heals in a fantasy setting. "Tank" doesn't, because it doesn't have any meaning in that world. At least "healer" isn't an anachronism.

    A closer analogy would be saying that it would be like changing "Cleric" to "Ambulance".
     
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  • bigepeenbigepeen Member
    Atama wrote: »
    KHRONUS wrote: »
    @FuryBladeborne If this is the case, then we can never have another tank class added to the game. Also, we would need to change the cleric name to "healer" as this is literally how dumb it currently is to be called "tank".
    I disagree with you here. "Healer" would make sense as the name of a person who heals in a fantasy setting. "Tank" doesn't, because it doesn't have any meaning in that world. At least "healer" isn't an anachronism.

    A closer analogy would be saying that it would be like changing "Cleric" to "Ambulance".

    I dunno, it's pretty obvious to me that tank means a character who will be tanking a lot of damage.
  • FuryBladeborneFuryBladeborne Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    Cleric and 6 of the other archetype names are commonly used as class names in MMO's. Tank is not. That why Tank does not fit. Alternatively, you could change Cleric to Healer and make the other 6 Archetypes into more generic names that are equal to Tank. It just seems easier to change Tank to Defender or some other name that sounds like a normal class name and describes Tank.
  • AtamaAtama Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    bigepeen wrote: »
    Atama wrote: »
    KHRONUS wrote: »
    @FuryBladeborne If this is the case, then we can never have another tank class added to the game. Also, we would need to change the cleric name to "healer" as this is literally how dumb it currently is to be called "tank".
    I disagree with you here. "Healer" would make sense as the name of a person who heals in a fantasy setting. "Tank" doesn't, because it doesn't have any meaning in that world. At least "healer" isn't an anachronism.

    A closer analogy would be saying that it would be like changing "Cleric" to "Ambulance".

    I dunno, it's pretty obvious to me that tank means a character who will be tanking a lot of damage.
    That’s because you are living in the 21st century, over a century after tanks were created. Again, the term “tank” would have no meaning in a world like Verra except perhaps as a large container for liquids.

    Unless you are secretly a fantasy being in a medieval world? In which case I wonder how you got access to the internet. An upgraded Palantir?
     
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