death penalty and toxicity

Irohnic

Hey guys I know the death penalties have been discussed a bunch, so I'm not trying to start another thread saying they should be higher or lower, I was just wondering if you guys worry at all that the death penalties will cause a lot of toxicity in group environments (especially with randos as opposed to guildies). I've seen people get so toxic in classic wow if they die and lose their world buffs, I really hope that sort of thing doesn't become commonplace in AoC. I might be down for death penalties to be shared among the whole group, so that roles that tend to die a lot don't take more of the burden on all the small deaths where the whole group doesn't wipe but one or 2 die. Regardless, how do y'all plan on handling those sorts of issues? Just blacklist toxic players from your groups?

Bricktop

Yeah just kick anybody who can't handle being wiped without placing blame or flying off the handle. Gotta expect to wipe sometimes. No time for that silly nonsense. Find a guild that is constructive on deaths not toxic, that way you won't deal with toxic randoms.

Warth

I might be down for death penalties to be shared among the whole group, so that roles that tend to die a lot don't take more of the burden on all the small deaths where the whole group doesn't wipe but one or 2 die.

This would just make toxicity worse lmao. You think the toxic players will just sit down and take it when you die but they have to carry the consequences of your screw up? Hell no. They will preemptively kick everybody they deem a noob to protect themselves. Personally, I'd do the same. Why should someones else gets punished if a player can't stay out of the red.

There is an easy solution to group toxicity: Don't play with toxic players. There is no dungeon finder, its your choice to group or not group with them

Kneczhevo

Without factions and not being able to segregate chats (faction, racial, etc), I foresee a lot of toxicity. Most people say; there will be GMs, I think they are being really optimistic. I am not so. /Shrug

Noaani

Kneczhevo wrote: »

Without factions and not being able to segregate chats (faction, racial, etc)

There are not going to be any global chat channels.

The closest to this will be node citizen channels.

Warth

Just block people. That's usually 2 clicks.

I'd also support a single (mostly) unmoderated channel you have to opt-in. Call it the corrupted channel

This would channel toxicity into those channel while 95% of playerbase experiences less, as all people who want to insult each other would go into the unmoderated channel to do so.

Voidwalkers

Warth wrote: »

I'd also support a single (mostly) unmoderated channel you have to opt-in. Call it the corrupted channel

This would channel toxicity into those channel while 95% of playerbase experiences less, as all people who want to insult each other would go into the unmoderated channel to do so.

Nahhhhh that won't work. The whole point of being toxic is "I get to spew insults in your worthless face whenever and for whatever reason I want. Your feeling and what you say doesn't matter, it's I who matters". People who have the decency to confine their insults to a specific channel u~sually aren't that toxic.

Anyway, I guess blocking & blacklisting & kicking toxic people (in short, don't play with them) are the only measures that can be taken against them. Given the nature of Ashes (encourages player interactions, localized grouping, and with no group finder), sooner or later the reputation of the toxic players would spread, and~ they can either learn their lesson and change their ways, or go play by themselves.

Mojottv

You guys need to keep in mind, that this will hopefully be open world pvp game. So means, you could pk anyone you don't like. So toxic **** will have tough luck farming if half the server doesn't like them.

LordManmode

I'm simple this way. If someone is nasty/toxic I strongly "abuse" the ignore/blacklist feature and ignore them permanently.

Tragnar

All types of people get toxic fairly quickly when you waste their progress, time and money while they have no way of fighting against it (this is the case of wbuff dispellers in classic wow)

Also do death penalties affect your character power? That would be extremely hurtful for any part of the game

Balrog21

@Tragnar yes, with enough corruption you are basically not literally leveled down to a level 49 toon, but Everything is effected, power, augments, etc until the corruption has gone away. You will be fighting as a level 49 though.
I really dont mind this because I have better things to do than the 'I just love waiting behind a tree and ganking people as they go by." Type player.

Tragnar

wait so corruption works on any death? I thought that corruption system kicks in only if you kill someone that wasnt flagged for pvp

Tyrantor

Kneczhevo wrote: »

Without factions and not being able to segregate chats (faction, racial, etc), I foresee a lot of toxicity. Most people say; there will be GMs, I think they are being really optimistic. I am not so. /Shrug

I actually think it'll be the exact opposite, in the games I've played with the player freedom of AoC I've seen way less toxic behavior from the players because they could be killed for acting stupid, if they make a name for themselves as hapless annoying dopes many people will just kill them, exclude them from groups, guilds etc. They can play the game on solo mode with a lot of enemies.

Irohnic

Warth wrote: »

I might be down for death penalties to be shared among the whole group, so that roles that tend to die a lot don't take more of the burden on all the small deaths where the whole group doesn't wipe but one or 2 die.

This would just make toxicity worse lmao. You think the toxic players will just sit down and take it when you die but they have to carry the consequences of your screw up? Hell no. They will preemptively kick everybody they deem a noob to protect themselves. Personally, I'd do the same. Why should someones else gets punished if a player can't stay out of the red.

There is an easy solution to group toxicity: Don't play with toxic players. There is no dungeon finder, its your choice to group or not group with them

That's a really good point. In my experiences people being toxic over dying tend to be the ones dying who are then toxic towards healers generally, but if death penalties were shared among a group it could mean more widespread toxicity.

Irohnic

Mojottv wrote: »

You guys need to keep in mind, that this will hopefully be open world pvp game. So means, you could pk anyone you don't like. So toxic **** will have tough luck farming if half the server doesn't like them.

ya this! I should have been more specific in the OP, but this is kind of what I was looking for. Does anyone plan on going out of their way to PK/grief toxic players or is the best solution just to ignore them to not play into their games. PK'ing people after they were total jerks in your group sounds so satisfying

Balrog21

@Tragnar yes, you are correct, but if you keep on ganking people that are not flagged the penalties just keep adding up till you are basically useless.

Tragnar

@Balrog21 So if I gank people that are not flagged I get corruption penalties and my victims are having death penalties until they are useless?

insomnia

Tragnar wrote: »

@Balrog21 So if I gank people that are not flagged I get corruption penalties and my victims are having death penalties until they are useless?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uv42pZlCKOs

sidhaze

No this is the perfect system for killing unjustified. Have played many games with it in place (old school Tibia) and worked WELL. Anyone that is fully corrupted is getting hunted down.. I'm coming for you !!

Stryta

Ability to report for toxicity resulting in a temporary character flag?

easy

ur in for a surprise buddy

Tacualeon

As long as you need others to achieve somethings and have a face in the community, social preassure does it's job.
If you are a prick to everybody eventually you will be alone, I think.

Maezriel

As others have mentioned there are three natural barriers to being able to openly grief someone:

1. It takes considerable time to get to max level and powerful
2. There's no sharding. You'll know who is in your realm and who is consistently a dick...those people will become social pariahs.
3. There's huge amounts of distance in the world so those that are always in your area will be recognized and travel to a new node is an easy way to avoid them.