Do you care about lore?

Erdun

I just want to see the general opinion here. Gameplay is important but lore and history is important for me.

What do you think?

Samson

I never really got into lore too much in other games because it always seemed too overwhelming. But since AoC is a new project and not too much lore has been released at this point... I have really been enjoying reading up on the lore via the wiki and other sources.

Vhaeyne

I care about establishing a strong setting. I do not care about NPCs or their affairs. I care about the backstory up to the point the game goes live. From that point on, I only care about stories created through player interaction.

See EVE online or 2b2t for examples.

It is the same thing with using a Dungeons and Dragons campaign setting. There is a ton of backstory in forgotten realms, but once we sit down for our first game play session our world becomes its own. I am hoping to see that on a per server basis for AoC.

Tyranthraxus

Yours truly finds it supremely important, for 2 reasons:

= It enriches the setting of the world in which our characters will inhabit, and that we as players will experience, over the course of potentially years of our lives.

= Lore creates a commonality between the players of a game. For years to come - both in-game and out - those of us who will have played the game will be able to share internal references with eachother that people who never played can only raise an eyebrow, towards. There are *SO* many conversations I've had in other games about Star Wars: Galaxies that only other former-SWG players could possibly relate to and genuinely understand.

It somehow provides a certain level of comfort in the rest of life, to run into someone who shared the same experiences and understands the same references, that you do.

Sum12hate

Personally I care about lore A LOT can't wait to delve into all the back stories and mythos in this game especially so since most of the lore will be player discovered instead of just a text wall that takes hours to digest, even more so than that for the possibility of players being able to effect and be part of it by end game (hopefully if I read and understand the wiki correctly) would be pretty cool to have your character immortalized in your server for certain achievements

Khronus

When wow came out, the only lore I knew was from what transpired in warcraft 1,2 and 3. I was BLOWN away to be able to live through what I thought would always just be a top down perspective. Running through Orgrimmar and everything else was amazing. I know AOC doesn't have prior lore to delve into but the opportunities are literally endless and I can't wait to experience what they deliver.

Noaani

Vhaeyne wrote: »

I care about establishing a strong setting. I do not care about NPCs or their affairs. I care about the backstory up to the point the game goes live. From that point on, I only care about stories created through player interaction.

See EVE online or 2b2t for examples.

It is the same thing with using a Dungeons and Dragons campaign setting. There is a ton of backstory in forgotten realms, but once we sit down for our first game play session our world becomes its own. I am hoping to see that on a per server basis for AoC.

While I do want to see this, I also want to see some of the regular storytelling that goes hand in hand with most MOM's.

If the game is left to "just" player driven stories - and thus players as the only bad guys - then every threat you look at you are able to think "that threat is only one or two item upgrades above me, that is nothing".

To me, the real excitment, challenge and interest in MMO's comes from beings that us players are simply never able to go toe to toe with. Without such beings, the games world seems pointless (as was the feeling I had with EVE when I played it for a while, many, many years ago). This doesn't just mean the encounters - in order for an encounter to actually feel imposing, there needs to be some lore behind it to tell you why you should be wary of it.

Maezriel

Noaani wrote: »

Vhaeyne wrote: »

I care about establishing a strong setting. I do not care about NPCs or their affairs. I care about the backstory up to the point the game goes live. From that point on, I only care about stories created through player interaction.

See EVE online or 2b2t for examples.

It is the same thing with using a Dungeons and Dragons campaign setting. There is a ton of backstory in forgotten realms, but once we sit down for our first game play session our world becomes its own. I am hoping to see that on a per server basis for AoC.

While I do want to see this, I also want to see some of the regular storytelling that goes hand in hand with most MOM's.

If the game is left to "just" player driven stories - and thus players as the only bad guys - then every threat you look at you are able to think "that threat is only one or two item upgrades above me, that is nothing".

To me, the real excitment, challenge and interest in MMO's comes from beings that us players are simply never able to go toe to toe with. Without such beings, the games world seems pointless (as was the feeling I had with EVE when I played it for a while, many, many years ago). This doesn't just mean the encounters - in order for an encounter to actually feel imposing, there needs to be some lore behind it to tell you why you should be wary of it.

But the threat isn't necessarily going to be only one guy a few item levels away...it's going to be comprised of an entire Node and/or several Guild Alliances.

The player politics is what I'm most interested in as everyone will have vastly different reasons to fight each other.

Vhaeyne

Noaani wrote: »

While I do want to see this, I also want to see some of the regular storytelling that goes hand in hand with most MOM's.

If the game is left to "just" player driven stories - and thus players as the only bad guys - then every threat you look at you are able to think "that threat is only one or two item upgrades above me, that is nothing".

To me, the real excitment, challenge and interest in MMO's comes from beings that us players are simply never able to go toe to toe with. Without such beings, the games world seems pointless (as was the feeling I had with EVE when I played it for a while, many, many years ago). This doesn't just mean the encounters - in order for an encounter to actually feel imposing, there needs to be some lore behind it to tell you why you should be wary of it.

Personal taste is at play here I guess.

When there is a clan war going on or a castle siege. To me nothing beats the feeling of knowing you made a difference in a server wide event. It makes me want to go in hard. It makes me want to grind harder to have the tools to make a difference for my side in the next event. Being apart of a living breathing fantasy world. That is the dream.

Lore happens organically too. Guild drama leads to betrayal. Next thing you know you got some refugees from a collapsed guild in your guild telling you their woes from the last guild. They join your guild, and you have people seeking actual real revenge fighting with you.

Imagine your node loses a major defeat. You are now a vagabond. What do you do? Find a better node on the other side of the world? Try and pick up the pieces, and take it back? Join your new overlords? That shit is real. Some fancy 3d model boss with a back story can't give that to you.

Yes, A mix of the two ain't awful. I just actively care about real people and their stories more.

daveywavey

I think lore in a fantasy game is essential. Without that lore, the game is empty and meaningless.

The_Gaming_Butler

Having played WoW for 16 years, I can wholeheartedly agree that Lore is very important to me as well. Playing out an epic story leads to grand adventures in the fantasy world.

I sincerely hope there is a novel released in advance of the game going live. I'd love the opportunity to become emotionally attached to the world through its history, lore, story, and characters.

Noaani

Maezriel wrote: »

Noaani wrote: »

Vhaeyne wrote: »

I care about establishing a strong setting. I do not care about NPCs or their affairs. I care about the backstory up to the point the game goes live. From that point on, I only care about stories created through player interaction.

See EVE online or 2b2t for examples.

It is the same thing with using a Dungeons and Dragons campaign setting. There is a ton of backstory in forgotten realms, but once we sit down for our first game play session our world becomes its own. I am hoping to see that on a per server basis for AoC.

While I do want to see this, I also want to see some of the regular storytelling that goes hand in hand with most MOM's.

If the game is left to "just" player driven stories - and thus players as the only bad guys - then every threat you look at you are able to think "that threat is only one or two item upgrades above me, that is nothing".

To me, the real excitment, challenge and interest in MMO's comes from beings that us players are simply never able to go toe to toe with. Without such beings, the games world seems pointless (as was the feeling I had with EVE when I played it for a while, many, many years ago). This doesn't just mean the encounters - in order for an encounter to actually feel imposing, there needs to be some lore behind it to tell you why you should be wary of it.

But the threat isn't necessarily going to be only one guy a few item levels away...it's going to be comprised of an entire Node and/or several Guild Alliances.

The player politics is what I'm most interested in as everyone will have vastly different reasons to fight each other.

Yeah for sure, politics and such will be an enjoyable aspect of Ashes.

Thing is, that guy, the one with all the friends, he isn't all that scary or imposing as a foe, as he is nothing without his friends, and all it takes to get rid of those friends is some politicking.

If the biggest challenges in Ashes can all be overcome in this manner (which all player rivals can be), then my excitement for the game will drop to zero very quickly.

To me, this kind of rivalry adds to the game, it does not make the game.

LXIX

I think lore is essential to world building and you will need a good background and story about where everything takes place. Although i don't really care about lore in general i still think it's one of the most important parts to get right so that you at least have an indication as to what the world is about.

Jamation

If lore is done well I live for it. If it's generic I don't mind spamming that space bar until I'm done with it. I'm the kind of person that will always read the main storyline the first time I play a game and when I make an alt or second playthrough I'll read all the side quest text. This way I get to see the world from a variety of views a variety of times. Hell, I've already re-watched the lore about the ancients and such so many times because I think it'll actually be interesting in this game.

But yeah. Feed me that lore. Gimme that good stuff.

maouw

In games especially, I only like lore if it's a puzzle I need to put together - if it has implications for me, or if it adds flavour to the setting (not just a chronological list of events).

@Cathartidae made a great post about "backwards facing" and "forwards facing" narrative here.

krozair

I think a deep background lore is important, even more so with a game that has the premise of the people coming back after a long time after a great cataclysm be it from another world or out from the underground. But I don't really want to have the world push the player around, other MMOs tried this, and all of them lost me. I am playing an MMO not because I want to be the chosen one, I want to be one of the many who build the history and legends of tomorrow. So yeah, I think the lore before the game starts should be deep and detailed and it is very important that it is so to give purpose to the thinks that will happen. But after this? I want the lore to be what the players do and not what the game does.

AntVictus

Story sets the mood for the situation, for races, important characters, etc. SO yeah I find lore to be important.

Nerror

Yep lore is super important.

I generally really like the lore for AoC so far too. The planes, the souls acting as conduits, the ancients and the gods, etc. I think it's a good lore "skeleton", and hopefully we'll get a ton more meat on it before and during the game. It can basically make the difference between a game world that feels shallow and not immersive, and an amazing experience that really draws you in.

So far my favourite lore IP is the Warhammer universe. Mostly the fantasy part, but honestly it's all good. They've had around 40 years and many, many authors fleshing out that universe, so obviously AoC isn't going to compete with that.

However, I hope they start hiring one or more authors to write a fantasy novel or series taking place on Verra. Pre-apocalypse makes the most sense of course, but a novel or series about what life was like for those who hid underground on Verra after the Apocalypse would be amazing too. The birth pains of the Tulnar race and all the drama I am sure happened underground.

FuryBladeborne

I occasionally like to relax and explore a fantasy world. To take the time to look around and think about what is happening. Lore is a key component of making that exploration enjoyable. Lore also gives the world depth and explains why things are happening the way that they are.

Marcet

Yeah, I love deep lore in games and books. I think that a good base and explanation for the universe is necessary. Im happy with what im seeing at the moment.

Nelirya

I usually don't pay too much attention, especially in newer MMO's, but, this is mostly because the story in these games typically feels rushed and forced.
I actually plan on exploring and immersing myself in Ashes' lore as it seems that Intrepid wants to make it matter, rather than implementing it as an afterthought.

Chime

I am all about the lore, I need to be able to immerse myself into the world.

Lore Dynamic

YUS. More-Lore!

/fist-bump

Haemosu

I care not about the lore.
However there was one game I played, my favorite experience, PvP/PvE, was TSW (The Secret World) where you could not ignore the lore and it became engaging despite.
That game was enveloped in the lore.
The bar is high for me.

akabear

I am not so interested in lore as I generally associate lore with theme park MMORPGs and solo RPG games.

Perhaps only spark limited interest in a more established game that I had played over many years as a single-player game that carried its lore into its multiplayer theme-park, such as the Elder Scroll Series. But their lore in-game within ESO was a drudgery to wade through, and frequently tabbed through the mountains of story to move on in quests and story interactions.

So, if I really wanted to get into lore I would play an offline RPG.

For this, may read a little but mostly interested in what the players generate.

Warth

Lore/Story is usually rather poorly written in MMOs. That's why i don't usually care for it.
If the game has half decent story writing without an abundance of plot holes, then I'd probably care for it, unfortunately most mmo settings don't lend itself for a good story.

CasForelda

Personally i tend to ignore Lore in games. Mainly due to the sheer lack of it provided when you try to dig into it.

It takes a lot to properly create a world, and most game companies cannot devote the resources required to flesh out all the nooks and crannies.

Asgerr

I love lore in games, and any kind of media for that matter.

Mind you, having lore, doesn't necessarily mean having a wall of text spewed at you at every turn.

There are a couple philosophies I believe:

- Tell people the basics upfront and let them fill in the gaps with non canon imagination
- Tell nothing and let them patch things together for lots of speculations and theories (e.g Soulsborne series)
- Give a basic opening and then have players slowly discover more and more that might change the final perception of the initial lore given (FFXIV does this well)
- Bombard the player with lore at every turn, even from NPCs that would have no clue about the matter realistically (looking at you Kingdoms of Amalur)

Seeing how collaborative and open world the storytelling of AoC seems to be leaning towards, I would expect the following:

- Brief opening cutscene setting the plot
- Bits of lore here and there from Story Quests and side quests - just to flesh out things
- Dungeons and world raids and bosses giving way to discovering new chunks of lore (from a mural in a dungeon or a previously inaccessible area opening via Node development) etc.

VmanGman

Yes definitely. If a game's lore is not interesting and engaging then I have a harder time to really get into the game.

I really don't think that AoC will suffer from this for two reasons:
1. Steven seems to have really developed this world over the years (starting with the Pathfinder campaign)
2. AoC has the benefit of allowing for player content to determine the lore of the world. Player made stories will be a great addition to the game's lore.

Caeryl

Consistent, established lore is a must-have for me, as is its implementation, lore shouldn’t be optional to know. There absolutely should be quests that depend on having certain lore information to progress.

Nothing is more disappointing than good lord that has no relevance to gameplay.