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Combat - Time to Break the Glass

GloryGlory Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
edited October 17 in Alpha One Spot Testing Archive
Animations are coming together but the combat still isn't where it needs to be and still isn't impactful. I want to see Ashes come out and be great but I think Intrepid is spinning their wheels on the combat at this point.

In my opinion, we should go with the fallback at this point and really refine a Tab Target combat system. WoW and Final Fantasy are the two "top mmorpgs" and both use Tab Target to great success. Ashes is already pushing the envelope with the Node System and other design features, such as the deep dive with the class system.

So let's keep the combat simple, effective, and comfortable. So that way we can refine that as best as possible and focus on the class and other features.

I'm fairly sure Steven said from the beginning that if the hybrid didn't work they would fall back on the Tab Target. Now is that time.

Comments

  • Ravager1998Ravager1998 Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    Whilst I don't necessarily agree that it's the time to make that decision, I do think combat needs to be their top priority as soon as enough backend problems are resolved to the point where it is stable.

    Combat is one of the core things that mmos live and die over, definitely a foundation that needs to be sorted before alpha 2 begins at the very least. Having to revamp the combat halfway through Alpha 2 because it's not hitting the sweet spots at even a basic level is not a situation you want to be in.

    I think a lot of this is due to the floaty feeling with the combat, as well as the fact that it does not feel fluid (probably due to lack of spell queueing). Combo systems like in final fantasy are not necessary as long as the combat flows nicely and it doesn't seem like you are afk between abilities or basic attacks.

    To an extent I also believe archetype design / identity needs to be looked at, due to the augment 64 class system they are going for, each archetype needs to be VERY unique. At the moment almost all archetypes have a jack of all trades feel to them, especially cleric. That being said I think this is something that will change heavily as we get higher levels, more skills as well as more iterations and changes to existing abilities.
  • Ir1shguyIr1shguy Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    edited July 2021
    There is an alpha 1 testing goals section to this wiki page https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Alpha-1 it outlines what is being tested within alpha 1 and somewhere on that page it also mentions somethings that will be added after alpha 1. Only mention of combat I saw was that the hybrid system was being tested. I hope they dont do anything like wow and ff both felt way too slow to me, the core tab target works fine in aoc it just needs tweaks and yeah I wouldnt miss the action combat if they removed it.
  • bloodandthunderbloodandthunder Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    I for one enjoy the hybrid system, I don't understand what people are taking about.

    I despise "auto-attacks" in tab targets where I just stand and press buttons while the auto-white damage floats on my screen.

    I like this approach of, if you want to do damage you have to actively press a button.

    I do think that for melee character it's a bit rough, and they really need to treat all weapons the same, You should be able to use them on the fly without being forced into a locked forward movement.

    Before you go full tab target, just try removing that from melee weapons and see how people feel about it.

    I like that you can cast on the move, albeit you move slowly, it's a refreshing take for casters. Although it did seem a bit jarring not having a casting bar because I didn't know if i was actually casting anything or not after pressing a button with all the chaos happening around me in raid fights or sieges.
  • MagnumwoodMagnumwood Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    I would be happy to see a full tab target combat system adopted and have it be fine tuned starting early. That being said, you can't really address combat if the focus isn't client side yet, and that seems to be getting sorted at after they've achieved rock solid server performance. If combat isn't solved at that point, I think it's fair to call for a ripcord.
  • TalentsTalents Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha Two
    edited July 2021
    We've literally only just started testing the MMORPG in a way that wasn't purely network testing. So no, I disagree that it's time to just give up on the hybrid system.
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  • LaydraLaydra Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    I don't think saying wow and final fantasy are number one therefore we should have tab target really holds any weight. The reason that is the case is not their stellar combat system, it's because they have been around for a while and there is no other decent options out. We haven't really even seen hybrid yet and I don't think intrepid should give up and use an outdated combat system that has been around for 20 years.
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