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Fishing is not only Angling and not a single MMO cares.
bakty
Member
I know there were fishing-related topics before, sorry for another one. BUT... most of them are related to rod and reel fishing - Angling.
Yesterday at work I was fixing a fishing net thinking about AoC and only then it struck me that not a single MMO uses the full potential of this profession. So here are some ideas that came to my mind :
1. You usually don't care about the quantity. Weight is what matters!
Not sure how hard to implement is it, but the main unit of fish should be weight (So a backpack slot would have to accept 0,01 weight and not 1 object). Pounds/Kilograms is what you care about when trading fish, that's where excitement mainly comes from. It also enables nice progression with skill increase : [weight= (baseweight+ - variance)*fishinglevel]. It applies to any form of fishing.
2. Day and night - It's a good start, from what I see on the wiki. Different creatures are active at different times but with that effectiveness of methods changes, e.g cages are used for nighttime, and with a rod, you usually chill during the day. Not exclusive but significant. <- Trying to not get into much detail for no reason.
3. Actual fisherman progression: Usually you start with the rod -> You get better rod/ get into methods that allow you to catch more at once, so small nets, cages -> You learn using those, so you stop breaking and tangling them up so much, you learn a bit about fish behavior which allows you to make better decisions -> You do most of the stuff right. It's still sometimes RNG but you know how to target what you want -> You are a master at what you do which allows you to target true monsters among water creatures which is very risky and expensive but you also know how to get a good haul to make a profit.
When it comes to equipment Rod->rod and reel->cages->use of boat->nets->drag nets.
4. Not sure in which professions fisheries are, but it could be a cool interaction between farming, fishing, and animal husbandry.
There are different directions you can take a fishery to. As a farmer, you'd kind of just want to stock your fishery with some fish and grow them as fast as possible for profit/use. Someone who would focus on husbandry could perhaps focus on breeding fish from the fisheries and change the weight/quantity ratio by producing stocking material for other fisheries. As a fisherman, you could maybe use a well-managed fishery to gain experience faster. There could be also a decorative aspect of this where farmers could keep some rare color varieties that fishermen caught and animal husbandry could breed them into a different color.
5. Minigames
When it comes to a rod, 3 stage timing minigame could be great (setting hook, fight, pulling out) where if you get it right, you get a different/better loot table, and if you miss it's just a regular loot, and you pull out the fish either way.
Maybe something like NoPixel GTA lockpicking
https://sharkiller.ddns.net/nopixel_minigame/lockpicks/
When it comes to nets and cages there could be a repairing minigame, which would be like making a basic sewing pattern (that's what it is IRL) you could do it to restore nets durability slightly, for some fishing exp. If you didn't want to bother with minigame, just buy a new one and sell it to someone who could use that exp.
Yesterday at work I was fixing a fishing net thinking about AoC and only then it struck me that not a single MMO uses the full potential of this profession. So here are some ideas that came to my mind :
1. You usually don't care about the quantity. Weight is what matters!
Not sure how hard to implement is it, but the main unit of fish should be weight (So a backpack slot would have to accept 0,01 weight and not 1 object). Pounds/Kilograms is what you care about when trading fish, that's where excitement mainly comes from. It also enables nice progression with skill increase : [weight= (baseweight+ - variance)*fishinglevel]. It applies to any form of fishing.
2. Day and night - It's a good start, from what I see on the wiki. Different creatures are active at different times but with that effectiveness of methods changes, e.g cages are used for nighttime, and with a rod, you usually chill during the day. Not exclusive but significant. <- Trying to not get into much detail for no reason.
3. Actual fisherman progression: Usually you start with the rod -> You get better rod/ get into methods that allow you to catch more at once, so small nets, cages -> You learn using those, so you stop breaking and tangling them up so much, you learn a bit about fish behavior which allows you to make better decisions -> You do most of the stuff right. It's still sometimes RNG but you know how to target what you want -> You are a master at what you do which allows you to target true monsters among water creatures which is very risky and expensive but you also know how to get a good haul to make a profit.
When it comes to equipment Rod->rod and reel->cages->use of boat->nets->drag nets.
4. Not sure in which professions fisheries are, but it could be a cool interaction between farming, fishing, and animal husbandry.
There are different directions you can take a fishery to. As a farmer, you'd kind of just want to stock your fishery with some fish and grow them as fast as possible for profit/use. Someone who would focus on husbandry could perhaps focus on breeding fish from the fisheries and change the weight/quantity ratio by producing stocking material for other fisheries. As a fisherman, you could maybe use a well-managed fishery to gain experience faster. There could be also a decorative aspect of this where farmers could keep some rare color varieties that fishermen caught and animal husbandry could breed them into a different color.
5. Minigames
When it comes to a rod, 3 stage timing minigame could be great (setting hook, fight, pulling out) where if you get it right, you get a different/better loot table, and if you miss it's just a regular loot, and you pull out the fish either way.
Maybe something like NoPixel GTA lockpicking
https://sharkiller.ddns.net/nopixel_minigame/lockpicks/
When it comes to nets and cages there could be a repairing minigame, which would be like making a basic sewing pattern (that's what it is IRL) you could do it to restore nets durability slightly, for some fishing exp. If you didn't want to bother with minigame, just buy a new one and sell it to someone who could use that exp.
9
Comments
Also, lumbering a tree is not just bashing it with an axe, etc etc.
BTW, while i understand people wanting some "minigame" around fishing and mechanics around it, i think it has to not be too many complex mechanics. else not a lot people will go on it...
They should be
Overall, I think you are asking for too much depth for a single gathering profession, but I think if you turn down your ideas a few notches, they are good for an MMO.
If more games copied the good ideas from RuneScape, we'd have many more good MMOs.
This works well, you also have the option of just regular fishing . I don't mind the "regular" fishing/casting and whatever mechanic the game has but there needs to be a reason to do it if I'm going to stand there for an hour +. The fish have to be worth it. The food and alchemy recipes that require said fish have to really be worth it IMO.
Although I like fish traps in other games, I don't like it here. You can't have only 1 gathering profession have some passive way of gathering that doesn't even require the player to be there and idling. It would throw off the balance of fish in the market and mess up crafting requirements. We need to consider fishing within the context of the game, it is one of many gathering professions, it can't be completely unique in every way from the rest of the game.
Right? I don't even play anymore and I can still appreciate the great things they do in that game. Quests are top notch, the way you unlock content in the game is rewarding... so many good systems.
People who invest points into Fishing will be better at it than those who don't.
Chopping down a tree is only the first part of harvesting lumber.
Pounding on an anvil is not the only task related to forming a weapon or creating armor.
Even combat in its current state, and likely it’s end state, does not reflect the complete activity of melee combat. Setting magic aside because that is pure fantasy.
So animation of a character fishing with a fishing pole represents fishing. Even if the character were to use a net or trap, the animation reflects the concept that the character is fishing.
The vast majority of MMO RPG players recognize this fact and are fine with it. If this were a simulation, then that might be different.
Most also do not want a simulation. Simulation of the healing process, something irl taking weeks to months, is not a good player experience. Having maimed characters is also not fun, unless you want to play a pirate.
There is a huge opportunity for Intrepid to make their systems unique and engaging and I am hoping they see this and have plans.
Even if poles weren't a thing and you could go place traps in the river, you come back later and see what got stuck inside.
I don't want a fishing simulator but something that would force the fisherman to sit on the water and spend some time doing the work would be great. This opens up ganking opportunities : ), fishing in groups and more than just a simple click on a shiny spot near water.
Looking at monster hunter world - cultivating systems, tailraiders system, research system, weapon and armor crafting, arena system, main quests, optional quests, event quests, seasonal events, cooking system, your own hideout, an area to teach and test you the weapons, a palico pet that accompanies you in fights that levels up and can be customized via gear and gadgets, a fishing system, bug trapping system and ALL of this feels polished and fun. Most of things things are all connected in one way or another. You can toss your bug net into the water to catch fish quickly but the rest run away. You catch bugs, do optional quests and fish to get certain food for cooking buffs. There is so much to this game that feels right and very little that doesn't (non skippable cutscenes and poor voice acting sucks).
My point is, the opportunity for greatness is right there in front of Intrepid. We can watch and hope or we can constructively suggest.
You can suggest all you want...
We don't know how cumbersome Mining and Tree Chopping will be. But it appears that Fishing is planned to be an Artisan profession. If that's the case, the devs are not going to make Fishing more susceptible to ganking than Mining or Tree Chopping.
We will have to know more about how the other Artisan professions actually work before determining if I'm wrong or how wrong I am.
Example, cutting down a tree and gathering logs is your basic gathering skill. The next part is processing logs into lumber, which represents a totally different skill. Then comes crafting items from lumber.
Fishing may have its own variety. Perhaps pole fishing is basic. Trap, net, and deep sea fishing or possibly whaling could be advanced gathering. Fish processing could be everything from fish prep that say a fish monger might require to the processing of whale oil or other usable materials.
The thought of whaling being a group gathering content combined with naval activity sounds pretty cool.
Don’t know if that’s in the plans, but I can see an entire economy set around whaling and deep sea fishing, which historically was a big deal before the advent of the petroleum era.
I think a game like AMONG US has enough examples to do small quick mini-games to be added to all professions.
https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Fishing
They have all sorts of "mays" and "will nots" here and its somewhat enough to give us a picture of how fishing will be interacted with. Just to leave no wiggle room for you, the pure fact that parts of fishing will be out on the ocean makes it more susceptible to attacks by other players than any other gathering profession.
What, you think that the fact parts of fishing happen in the ocean *doesnt* make it more susceptible to PvP?
Please dont share whatever you're smoking, as it is clearly having a negative cognitive effect on you.
If not a lot of people go for it, fish gets more rare, increasing the price of fish, making more people want to start fishing to get money.