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What i hope after playing New World

So I have been playing New World as a way to cover up the time until Ashes releases. After 60+h I can list a few things I hope ashes is wary about to not copy as I think they are bad designs

- Crafting is good. Everyone can do everything is not. I know ashes has a system that is interdependent and I hope they can make gatherer and processing skills rewarding enough to not be monotone.
- Having ways to make starter gold than just trading. The beginning is just "throw-away items" that no one will buy so as a crafting profession I don't see you doing any money early on
- Having other reasons to destroy cities: NW has factions that create the desire to take over another faction's territory be it due to animosity or benefits of said land. I love the large-scale battle that ashes will bring but if everyone aims for peace, then I can see a problem in having a reason to do war in the first place.
- Implement the caravan system strongly. I loved the system in Silkroad Online. It sadly wasn't the core feature but has so much potential for unique Guilds, reputation, and conflict if the focus is strongly on that either via land or sea. Thieves vs Traders & Protectors is an amazing concept
- Lore pieces: what I LOVE about NW is the bits and pieces you get about the island and its inhabitants when you walk around via letters and papers. It makes exploring a real adventure. You go to a cave and find a random letter about some people trapped there which is connected to a bigger story about them that you find bits and pieces earlier of is just amazing.

The more I play New World the more I think about ashes and what it tries to achieve and the more hyped I get. NW is doing quite a few things right but lacks on so many corners that ashes tries to avoid which shows how much thought Steven put into this project. He is not rushing this to make a profit. He is not scared of competitors releasing sooner and NW is a good example of why. While doing a lot of things right, I don't see their end-game being focused on people staying. It's too one-dimensional. Even the monsters you face are copy past and hardly have variety. Ashes is right in taking its time. It should definitely take some ideas from NW (the scripts with lore lying around for example) but shouldn't rush anything now. Ashes is by far the most promising MMORPG atm and I can't see any other MMORPG existing or releasing that could hold its own against the idea of ashes.

I start to ramble. Can I fast forward time to get to the release date? :(

Comments

  • - Crafting is good. Everyone can do everything is not. I know ashes has a system that is interdependent and I hope they can make gatherer and processing skills rewarding enough to not be monotone.
    Agreed. Without some severe balancing and a mechanic to get rid of crafted gear unwillingly the markets are beyond saturated with items. The entire game is built up to be static progression which allows a character to eventually have and do everything. This does not breed a good economy and healthy crafting community.
    - Having ways to make starter gold than just trading. The beginning is just "throw-away items" that no one will buy so as a crafting profession I don't see you doing any money early on

    Well, there are a few items such as iron ore/bars, green wood, fish oil, fish fillets, and weak mana potions are quite lucrative even now on my server. Check them out if you are having issues makin coin.
    - Having other reasons to destroy cities: NW has factions that create the desire to take over another faction's territory be it due to animosity or benefits of said land. I love the large-scale battle that ashes will bring but if everyone aims for peace, then I can see a problem in having a reason to do war in the first place.

    The way they decided that a single guild/company has total control over a faction's territory is a joke. They gain almost all of the benefits from being in charge and it only takes a few days of ownership for them to be swimming in taxed income that they then use to bolster their own guild rather than the territory or faction itself. This should be a case study on what not to do with nodes and governing.
    - Implement the caravan system strongly. I loved the system in Silkroad Online. It sadly wasn't the core feature but has so much potential for unique Guilds, reputation, and conflict if the focus is strongly on that either via land or sea. Thieves vs Traders & Protectors is an amazing concept

    No disagreement here. Caravan system will be an amazing addition to Ashes of Creation and I cannot wait to engage in it.
    - Lore pieces: what I LOVE about NW is the bits and pieces you get about the island and its inhabitants when you walk around via letters and papers. It makes exploring a real adventure. You go to a cave and find a random letter about some people trapped there which is connected to a bigger story about them that you find bits and pieces earlier of is just amazing.

    I honestly can't get myself to care too much about the lore. The way players engage with each other and this world is so disconnected. From the naming to the way they added a feature purely for streamer fans to throw money at a streamer at any time and one-sidedly.

    5000x1000px_Sathrago_Commission_RavenJuu.jpg
    Commissioned at https://fiverr.com/ravenjuu
  • McShaveMcShave Member
    edited October 2021
    Peace will never be an option. We know that to unlock "new content" (raids/ dungeons), nodes will have to be destroyed, but to what extent new content will unlock and how many or what level of nodes must be destroyed, we will have to see in testing. Also, if you want to improve your node (home), then you will have to destroy a node that is blocking your advancement. Intrepid has said that you won't be able to siege a parent node, but we will have to see that in testing as well.

    As far as I understand, the lore of Ashes will be heavily involved through some sort of story quest. Intrepid has said that they want the game to be partial theme park, which means having a strong story questline that guides the player to endgame (but its also part sandbox, which means there are many ways to get to endgame and endgame might look different for different players/ servers).

    Overall, I think Ashes will have a distinct advantage over New World in that it will be extremely more thought out than New World. It has a central identity/ direction and ideas are tried and tested by the community before it is made final.
  • xDeexDee Member
    edited October 2021
    Sathrago wrote: »
    The way they decided that a single guild/company has total control over a faction's territory is a joke. They gain almost all of the benefits from being in charge and it only takes a few days of ownership for them to be swimming in taxed income that they then use to bolster their own guild rather than the territory or faction itself. This should be a case study on what not to do with nodes and governing.

    Bro.. Look at eve online. I has the best working system. Look at New World, faction system fails, and will fail.

    It will be simple. Corporations will form alliances... and alliances will hold the nodes.

    New World suxxx in sooo many ways..... starting with factions, to flagged PvP, all the way to its actual content.



  • Sathrago wrote: »
    The way they decided that a single guild/company has total control over a faction's territory is a joke. They gain almost all of the benefits from being in charge and it only takes a few days of ownership for them to be swimming in taxed income that they then use to bolster their own guild rather than the territory or faction itself. This should be a case study on what not to do with nodes and governing.

    There should certainly be *some* benefit to holding territory such as AoC's to-be castles, but aye - that benefit should play out over more time than the systems in NW.

    However, I do feel that guilds should have the freedom to be selfish with any such additional Gold/resources. It provides incentive to battle them for control.



  • Sathrago wrote: »
    The way they decided that a single guild/company has total control over a faction's territory is a joke. They gain almost all of the benefits from being in charge and it only takes a few days of ownership for them to be swimming in taxed income that they then use to bolster their own guild rather than the territory or faction itself. This should be a case study on what not to do with nodes and governing.

    There should certainly be *some* benefit to holding territory such as AoC's to-be castles, but aye - that benefit should play out over more time than the systems in NW.

    However, I do feel that guilds should have the freedom to be selfish with any such additional Gold/resources. It provides incentive to battle them for control.




    There needs to be a give and take. If you squander the taxes for your own coffers there should be a direct effect on how good your defenses are. This gives more reason to pick a mayor that will work in the best interest of the node, or you risk having your defense money be thrown into that persons guild coffers, move all their resources to another node using friends/alts, and laugh as the node collapses with tier 1 defenses.
    5000x1000px_Sathrago_Commission_RavenJuu.jpg
    Commissioned at https://fiverr.com/ravenjuu
  • DygzDygz Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    There are several ways to unlock new content.
    New raids and dungeons unlock witht the progression of Nodes and the creation of Node services.
    New content also comes from Social Org and Religious progression.
    But, sure, destroying Node services, and entire Nodes, will unlock different content when those Nodes/services are rebuilt - especially if there are different races in charge of the new Stages and different Node services are chosen.
  • Style wrote: »
    So I have been playing New World as a way to cover up the time until Ashes releases. After 60+h I can list a few things I hope ashes is wary about to not copy as I think they are bad designs

    - Crafting is good. Everyone can do everything is not. I know ashes has a system that is interdependent and I hope they can make gatherer and processing skills rewarding enough to not be monotone.
    - Having ways to make starter gold than just trading. The beginning is just "throw-away items" that no one will buy so as a crafting profession I don't see you doing any money early on
    - Having other reasons to destroy cities: NW has factions that create the desire to take over another faction's territory be it due to animosity or benefits of said land. I love the large-scale battle that ashes will bring but if everyone aims for peace, then I can see a problem in having a reason to do war in the first place.
    - Implement the caravan system strongly. I loved the system in Silkroad Online. It sadly wasn't the core feature but has so much potential for unique Guilds, reputation, and conflict if the focus is strongly on that either via land or sea. Thieves vs Traders & Protectors is an amazing concept
    - Lore pieces: what I LOVE about NW is the bits and pieces you get about the island and its inhabitants when you walk around via letters and papers. It makes exploring a real adventure. You go to a cave and find a random letter about some people trapped there which is connected to a bigger story about them that you find bits and pieces earlier of is just amazing.

    The more I play New World the more I think about ashes and what it tries to achieve and the more hyped I get. NW is doing quite a few things right but lacks on so many corners that ashes tries to avoid which shows how much thought Steven put into this project. He is not rushing this to make a profit. He is not scared of competitors releasing sooner and NW is a good example of why. While doing a lot of things right, I don't see their end-game being focused on people staying. It's too one-dimensional. Even the monsters you face are copy past and hardly have variety. Ashes is right in taking its time. It should definitely take some ideas from NW (the scripts with lore lying around for example) but shouldn't rush anything now. Ashes is by far the most promising MMORPG atm and I can't see any other MMORPG existing or releasing that could hold its own against the idea of ashes.

    I start to ramble. Can I fast forward time to get to the release date? :(

    I feel like they should make it so everyone could do everything at lower levels, I don't believe that you should be prevented from skinning an animal because you don't specialise in it but instead lower the items you get from it severely, so if I only need to kill and butcher an animal for a bit of meat too cook something to get my hp back I wouldn't need to switch specs or run to a city that might be far away.
  • NerrorNerror Member, Alpha One, Adventurer

    I feel like they should make it so everyone could do everything at lower levels, I don't believe that you should be prevented from skinning an animal because you don't specialise in it but instead lower the items you get from it severely, so if I only need to kill and butcher an animal for a bit of meat too cook something to get my hp back I wouldn't need to switch specs or run to a city that might be far away.

    I think that is the plan currently. You can do it all at a lower level, but you can only master one.

  • AmmaAmma Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    After over 200 hours in 18 days of NW (too much per day :-D) i have some thoughts about it. What could be learned from the good things or the mistakes of amazon?

    1. The gathering system is very good. Why? It makes you addictive to collect everything. There is some nice ore....and behind that is that Flameplant for alchemy and near that is that house with a chest full of materials.... Everything wants to be collected. Why is that good? It makes you loose yourself in the game. Thats good, because you are then more IN the game with your thoughts and not IN FRONT of a game just looking at it. And yes....gathering is not interesting for all...BUT, still an important part of it.

    2. One of the most horrible things i have to experience every day is having no vendor in the city. Only a market between players with a maximum capacity of 100 different items.When you are skilling a job like alchemy then most of the time you have to throw the potions away on the street, because most of the potions are so special in its ability that it grants you, that absolutely no one would ever buy it. If you are afraid that the people would cut all the trees around the city every hour to make money.....simply lower the prices at the vendor for raw materials but let them be high for some sword or armor that was dropped by a monster in the woods. The rest is a question of testing and balancing.

    3. The quests you can get in the cities are killing the patience of everyone after some days. The game has simply about 20 quests or so, and you have to repeat them over and over and over again. Kill 15 rabbits, get 30 iron, get 20 fish, get 50 wood. Well done.....now get 5 potions, 30 iron, kill 15 wolfes and get 40 wood.....and again.........every day.........every mission...........over and over and over again. Faction missions? There are about 5 - 10 different. You make the same missions for your faction over and over and over again. Nothing changes here. Imagine doing that for months.......lol. And yes, i know, there are some little quests here and there you can find on the map that are different, but when you do these couple of quests, then you get back to the quests in the cities. How is that supposed to hold a player for a longer time in the game?

    4. Most horrible thing for me is having only 3 abilities you can use per weapon. This looks like a system for a xbox or playstation controller in mind but not for pc-players. Thats simply boring. I am glad that AOC is different here. Imagine your mage only having teleport + fireball + a little fire nova.....nothing else.....i mean thats not a mage. Thats an mage-student in his first year or something like that. I am missing the rest of the mage here.

    5. If you make a system where you can block the attacks actively, then let the player block when he/she presses the button. What do i mean? When you klick one of your three abilities, and its something that makes for example 3 hits on the monster, then your character wont stop that until it is done. That means that you cant stop in the middle of that to block and so you catch every hit with your face during the counterattack of the monster.

    6. Movement of the monsters: I think everyone who tried to shoot an undead-humanoid with a bow in NW knows what i mean when i say that the movement of the NPCs has nothing to do with normal movement, with logical movement or anything else you would expect. Its simply frustrating. They move like someone who got too much speed, crack and other chemicals at the same time in their body and is on top of that seeing things because of too much LSD left and right of them, so that the NPC jumps around in microseconds to the side while running around faster than a cheetah. This might sound unimportant but its one more thing about NW that is simply frustrating.

    7. Ranged weapons are not allowed to hit an enemy standing in front of you. Sounds crazy right? If a Bison or a Bear as Large as a truck is standing in front of you and your whole sight is just one big bear and you shoot in the middle of that, then you miss.......every shot........sure. I can understand when you make it harder to hit or you make less damage but....nothing???

    8. Light effects of the sun! OMG! These are the best i have ever seen in a game so far. If you dont have the game then just open some video of the game on youtube and concentrate only on the lighting, especially at sunrise and sunset.....especially when you are somewhere in the woods. If the devs can do something like that in AOC that would be a big plus i think.

    9. Minimap! NW has no Minimap. I know that already from TESO when i played it whe it came out, and the reasons are mostly something like: "The player should enjoy the landscape in front of him/her that we made for them and not stare at some minimap in the corner". Well....thats not whats happening when you have no minimap. It simply means that when i have to go to a location that i can see on the map then i have to open and close the map over and over again to look which way i have to take. Thats frustrating after some time. While i open the map over and over again i am not looking at your landscape, so nothing won here. And if i dont need a special location from the map, then i dont stare at the minimap anyway, so it doesnt have any effect on my view of the landscape. So there is never a reason to not have a minimap. And if you are really against it, then make it at least toggle-on or off in the menu. Good that AOC has one.

    10. I am not sure if you want that as devs but the ressource system in NW is inverted. That means that the ressources which are the lowest and can be gathered with a level 1 character have the highest value in gold on the market. Why? Because when you want to melt your level 4 ore, you need 2 ingots of your level 3 metal. When every ingot of your level 3 metal needs 2 ingots of your level 2 ingots each, then thats already 4 of them. That means you need 8 Ingots of your level 1 metal to make one level 4 metal. And every level 1 metal needs 4 level 1 ore. That means you need 32 level-1 ore to make one level 4 metal ingot. That means that you need so much Level 1 ore all the time, that it has by far the highest demand/request, so the prices for level 1 materials are the highest and the prices for materials of the highest levels, where you invested much time to get there, are the lowest. Thats simply a brocken system, when the player gets the feeling of beeing laughed at for investing so much time.

    11. The three minigame-parts at fishing are well done. Cant say anything bad here. Really well done.

    12. Story? There is none. Sure you could invest time in reading the hundreds of text-notes that are lying around everywhere. But there is no really big story that i could tell. There is that big intro, and in the first 5 seconds of the game the big guy of the intro is dead. And then? Well....go into the city and look for something to collect.............see point 3 again :-) That means there is no connection between you and that world why you are even doing all the things. No destination of your journey. After some time you beginn to ask yourself: Why? Why am i doing anything??? Why investing more time in this game? (Thats where i am now)

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