Add-Ons

I do not want any accommodation or encouragement for add-ons in the game.
Use of add-on in WoW resulted in my account getting hacked. I do not want to have to compromise the security of my system because I feel pressured to get an add on.
I did not feel comfortable using add-ons, as some of them seemed closer to exploits than convenience enhancements.
Succeeding in the game in the many ways that one can define that should mean within the rules framework established by the game.

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Comments

Enigmatic Sage

@Taerrik The thing about QOL changes is that you put down a foundation that keeps snowballing until eventually it becomes too much.

These things sound like dependencies that mainstream games are built around to appeal for the mindless muppets that need them in order to play their game. Essentially, your target audience becomes these muppets and the amazing game that it was founded on will become a soulless husk for these people which will continue down a path of incompetent appeals and demands for continued muppet support.

Sure, some things can be added in for UI/UX but they will snowball and gradually ruin the game. You're probably used to mainstream games instead of games that encourage integrity instead of short cuts for skill issues.

Ruerik

Not sure if I should be interpreting your post about skill issue one way or another.

Or if I have no integrity because I play mainstream games? Unsure what your trying to say here, but I do play mainstream games, thats for sure, I like having people to talk to so I tend to go to bigger games.

I did say how once the addons start appearing, even the harmless ones, the cheaty ones show up very shortly after. Would be better for us if Intrepid instead engages with us frequently asking for feedback on how we interact with the game.

As for souless muppets that just follow what the weakauras/DBM/cactbot addons tell them to do and dont actually know how to play the game itself, that will happen in any game if the population is big enough for long enough, its an inevitability for large games sadly. (Maybe thats what you meant by mainstream games with no integrity?)

Enigmatic Sage

Taerrik wrote: »

As for souless muppets that just follow what the weakauras/DBM/cactbot addons tell them to do and dont actually know how to play the game itself, that will happen in any game if the population is big enough for long enough, its an inevitability for large games sadly. (Maybe thats what you meant by mainstream games with no integrity?)

that's expecting failure for the sake of it. The source of why those games continue to fail and cater to certain demographics just for subscription numbers to show their game is "financially" successful each quarter/monthly player count. They turned their games into mainstream games to get anyone to play their game for the sake of money and not integrity.

The reason those games are like that is because the devs essentially failed maintaining what made the game great in the first place. The only people left willing to play them are essentially dependant on those third part features and if they got rid of them no one would play anymore. It's too late for them.

I could go on but why waste my time on their mobile game design for dopamine hits through themepark tactics and rewards systems for participation to stimulate a feeling of success that in reality... isn't justified. They've become souless mount and dress up collecting games for the main players now.

Ruerik

I've played internet games long enough to expect the worst I suppose.

I fully expect ashes to become a mainstream game in the sense I think you are taking it. There is so much hype out there, and often times people I meet will sometimes bring up this as a thing they look forward to A high quality sandbox is lacking right now and Ashes will fill that. Probably why I feel its a matter of time before the things I've seen happen in large games happen here.

Enigmatic Sage

Taerrik wrote: »

I've played internet games long enough to expect the worst I suppose.

I fully expect ashes to become a mainstream game in the sense I think you are taking it. There is so much hype out there, and often times people I meet will sometimes bring up this as a thing they look forward to A high quality sandbox is lacking right now and Ashes will fill that. Probably why I feel its a matter of time before the things I've seen happen in large games happen here.

if it becomes a mainstream game....they have literally failed at what they're trying to create and lied to everyone for several years.

Even though many games are considered niche and that word is thrown around a lot. it is what the game is trying to be. Watering down something great for the sole purpose of success isn't true success.

Are they trying to appeal to many people? sure but that doesn't mean they have to make it a mainstream game. If they make a great game, the players will come. There will always be a fluctuation in active players from launch date to relevant significance such as promotions/expansion.

Mag7spy

Ashes won't be main stream unless it brings back the owpvp elements, makes things instanced, everyone wins, people treated like sheep, etc.

Yes it has hype, it means a lot of people will try it, it will be a game hat is not designed to be casual friendly and easy main stream kind of game. Because it is unique, it will have the chance to create a new main stream kind of trend if the game was so good and fun to retain players AND drawl casual players regardless of their difficulties. Though i doubt it will happen impossibilities sometimes still have that 5% chance, elden ring as an example. When the second elden ring game drops everyone will buy it.

BlackBrony

Damage meters are a must, otherwise the hardcore players will leave!

Mag7spy

BlackBrony wrote: »

Damage meters are a must, otherwise the hardcore players will leave!

Hardcore WoW pve instanced raiders, sure let them leave they would leave anyway for wow expansion and because of pvp.

Real hardcore players will be playing AoC though.

Noaani

BlackBrony wrote: »

Damage meters are a must, otherwise the hardcore players will leave!

This is perhaps more true than most people realize.

Hardcore players (not a term I'd use, but we all know who we are talking about) for the most part value knowledge above all else.

Combat trackers provide this.

It doesn't matter if you are PvE, PvP, buying, selling, crafting or gathering. If it uses numbers within the games systems, knowledge literally is power, and combat trackers provide that knowledge (yes, even with crafting).

Hinotori

dps meters suck.

Veeshan

Noaani wrote: »

McShave wrote: »

I hope it's ok to post video content links on the forums, but I highly recommend checking out this video. It's a video essay on the mindset of the modern mmo players. There is a large section of the video where they discuss how addons back in the vanilla days of WoW changed the mindset of players, and then it changed the mindset of the devs when they created future content. It eventually got to the point where addons that change the entire game are almost necessary for certain levels of play (i'm thinking WeakAuras if anyone has played). It's best to stay away from this and let Intrepid develop whatever tools they see fit to add into the game.

The problem with WoW is that they were actual add-ons. They were able to interact with the game client itself - which is almost never a good idea.

they also removed MMO gamers ability to think, just do what ur told by the all mighty glorious addon tell you too.........
when i played WoW i never used addon never had an issue until the addons got updated to tell everyone who not using it and people were like yeah no raid unless u use this add on, dispite never using one before every raid before hand and was never an issue

Veeshan

BlackBrony wrote: »

Damage meters are a must, otherwise the hardcore players will leave!

Hardcore WoW players will leave when they relised they have to think and not have an add on play the game for them and they relise there not as good as they think they are. Nothing to do with dmg meters

Enigmatic Sage

@Veeshan very true!
the dev's of WoW even admitted to playing leap frog with the content difficulty vs addons even though addons were/still are against TOS to the point where the players even to this day demand you use addons when raiding or you cant participate in the hand held scripted event. The games design became jeopardised due to a lack of proper actions taken.

Just proof they didn't care about what made the game great vs how much money they can retain from those willing to stick around as subscriptions and active player counts globally declined from expansion to expansion.

Pyrolol

Noaani wrote: »

Pyrolol wrote: »

Damage & healing meter is a must

Don't concern yourself too much, this already exists.

Important note for those existing though, they aren't add-ons. In the same way there is a difference between a DPS meter and a combat tracker, there is a difference between an add-on and a discrete application - all combat trackers that I know for Ashes are discrete applications, not add-ons.

Sounds good
Was more of the sense to try different builds and check the pros/cons, sure there’s other ways can do it but everyone assumed it was to flame the people struggling doing their rotations/combos

Anyways, happy to play this entire mmo with no add ons would be better to judge when the actual Alpha 2 comes out and see what final inbuilt Ui looks like

Ruerik

With the policy intrepid are suggesting, you wont know if someone is using something outside the game unless they tell you, or if its an obvious hack.

I would like to see good reporting options. Would be nice to right click report without having to stop my gameplay, open up customer support menu, upload evidence, etc.

GMs ought to be able to inspect someone if they get reported to see whats up, I shouldnt have to be detective as a gamer unless its a not obvious thing and the supporting evidence is needed.

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