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Phase I of Alpha Two testing will occur on weekends. Each weekend is scheduled to start on Fridays at 10 AM PT and end on Sundays at 10 PM PT. Find out more here.
Check out Alpha Two Announcements here to see the latest Alpha Two news and update notes.
Our quickest Alpha Two updates are in Discord. Testers with Alpha Two access can chat in Alpha Two channels by connecting your Discord and Intrepid accounts here.
Armor types, references & the case for more realism in Fantasy
Asgerr
Member, Alpha Two
For the past few years I have intermittently been working on a fantasy book of my own. One of the rabbit holes I've been going down throughout this entire experience is: clothing and armor.
Armed with what knowledge I have acquired, I then stopped to pit it against what videogames (MMOs in particular) tend to present us.
You've seen it a hundred times, your character ventures out into the wild with barely a shirt on, before fairly soon earning himself a set of leather armor. Leather armor looks and sounds cool, but admittedly it was vastly set aside in favor of cloth armor in real life.
As an MMO player, you might be thinking: "But Asgerr, cloth is for casters only, right?"
Well yes and no. Robes and tunics could indeed fit the stereotype and fantasy of the mage or caster role. However there is a second type of cloth armor, made basically by stacking layers of linen: the Gambeson.
Gambesons were not only by and far the most common type of armor in the medieval period, but it was also greatly effective. So much so in fact, that whilst its equal to leather in defense against cuts, it was vastly superior in penetration resistance (just like all those WoW neckbeard amiright?.... I'll see myself out).
Gambesons, at a moderate distance, could in fact stop a war bow shot arrow, where leather would cave and damage its wearer.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-uWDCDJD_4w&ab_channel=Shadiversity
Add to it that in my humble opinion, it looks much cooler and classier than leather armor. Also, no squeaking about as you're stalking the underbrush, hunting for your next prey, with leather armor. They'd hear your approach from a fair distance.
The second type of armor that I'd like to see further implemented is the Brigandine.
Brigandines are basically segmented laminates of steel or other metals, riveted together. Often worn over a Gambeson.
Just like this.
You know you've seen it before. All those dots that some have used to represent studded leather (which is basically just an inferior defense system to boiled leather, albeit the latter would be too rigid to wear).
Third type of armor I would love to see: the Hauberk/Halberk.
It's basically a your typical mail shirt. However unlike a regular modern day shirt, this one covers the thighs as well. You could see it as a long gambeson made of mail.
Freaking Edward III the Lionheart would wear that during the Crusader Era. And you can't tell me the Crusader Era wasn't cool in terms of armor.
The Hauberk can also, and in fact often was, paired up with a gambeson or some sort of quilted jerkin or arming doublet, for added defense against stabs or arrows.
If you've ever played the Witcher games, Vernon Roche (below) wears this combo with a fancy coat over it.
The fourth and final section of this piece, relates to what some see as accessories: Pauldrons, Greaves, Tassets, Poleyns, Gorgets, Bracers etc.
These, in MMOs are often just lobbed into the categories of Shoulders (Pauldrons), Chest (Gorgets), Legs (Poleyns, Greaves, Tassets) or Arms (Bracers).
Of course I'm not advocating for a gear system where you'd need about 20 slots to be able to equip all of these. However, I feel they should be more represented in MMOs, especially the medieval fantasy inspired ones.
Perhaps, you can even add some of those pieces to existing preset armors to exemplify the player's progression.
Take for example the progression of the Ursine Armor Set from the Witcher 3:
You don't have 20 million slots for all those pieces, but it visually represents a level up in protection, whilst retaining a great deal of realism and an aura of cool.
This could eventually lead to full plate armors, for those classes who would thrive in those compared to others. You can of course retain the fantasy aspects in their designs and compositions, but some sense of rooted in our reality I think could prove beneficial for multiple reasons, and this is the conclusion to my tirade.
Adapting realistic pieces of armor into a fantasy universe will ease the load on the artists who need to create and model the pieces, as you can basically reference existing things and add one or two fantastical touches.
Our brains better comprehend the defensive capabilities of our own historical armors than those of generic fantasy armor. Tell me you wouldn't feel safer on a battlefield wearing this:
Rather than this:
How the hell do you even lift your arms without gouging your eyes out in that thing???
So imagine the progression of your adventurer as follows:
Oh and as a PS:
That crotch flap thing? That's not a tabard. That's a monastic scapular.
A tabard is this:
And the following is a surcoat:
The important detail being this one is long and split down the middle, so that the wearer can move about without getting the fabric caught in between his legs. Also much better for sitting and riding horses.
So yes. Naming and accuracy matters. Perhaps not to all, but to some. However I feel that all fantasy should add more realism in some of the armors and weapons they present. I think the contrast between a person in an actual suit of armor facing some lovecraftian horror, sells the incredibly stacked odds far better.
The question for this discussion:
What types of realistic armor would you like to see? What level of realism would you like vs how much fantastical elements ?
Armed with what knowledge I have acquired, I then stopped to pit it against what videogames (MMOs in particular) tend to present us.
You've seen it a hundred times, your character ventures out into the wild with barely a shirt on, before fairly soon earning himself a set of leather armor. Leather armor looks and sounds cool, but admittedly it was vastly set aside in favor of cloth armor in real life.
As an MMO player, you might be thinking: "But Asgerr, cloth is for casters only, right?"
Well yes and no. Robes and tunics could indeed fit the stereotype and fantasy of the mage or caster role. However there is a second type of cloth armor, made basically by stacking layers of linen: the Gambeson.
Gambesons were not only by and far the most common type of armor in the medieval period, but it was also greatly effective. So much so in fact, that whilst its equal to leather in defense against cuts, it was vastly superior in penetration resistance (just like all those WoW neckbeard amiright?.... I'll see myself out).
Gambesons, at a moderate distance, could in fact stop a war bow shot arrow, where leather would cave and damage its wearer.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-uWDCDJD_4w&ab_channel=ShadiversityAdd to it that in my humble opinion, it looks much cooler and classier than leather armor. Also, no squeaking about as you're stalking the underbrush, hunting for your next prey, with leather armor. They'd hear your approach from a fair distance.
The second type of armor that I'd like to see further implemented is the Brigandine.
Brigandines are basically segmented laminates of steel or other metals, riveted together. Often worn over a Gambeson.
Just like this.
You know you've seen it before. All those dots that some have used to represent studded leather (which is basically just an inferior defense system to boiled leather, albeit the latter would be too rigid to wear).
Third type of armor I would love to see: the Hauberk/Halberk.
It's basically a your typical mail shirt. However unlike a regular modern day shirt, this one covers the thighs as well. You could see it as a long gambeson made of mail.
Freaking Edward III the Lionheart would wear that during the Crusader Era. And you can't tell me the Crusader Era wasn't cool in terms of armor.
The Hauberk can also, and in fact often was, paired up with a gambeson or some sort of quilted jerkin or arming doublet, for added defense against stabs or arrows.
If you've ever played the Witcher games, Vernon Roche (below) wears this combo with a fancy coat over it.
The fourth and final section of this piece, relates to what some see as accessories: Pauldrons, Greaves, Tassets, Poleyns, Gorgets, Bracers etc.
These, in MMOs are often just lobbed into the categories of Shoulders (Pauldrons), Chest (Gorgets), Legs (Poleyns, Greaves, Tassets) or Arms (Bracers).
Of course I'm not advocating for a gear system where you'd need about 20 slots to be able to equip all of these. However, I feel they should be more represented in MMOs, especially the medieval fantasy inspired ones.
Perhaps, you can even add some of those pieces to existing preset armors to exemplify the player's progression.
Take for example the progression of the Ursine Armor Set from the Witcher 3:
You don't have 20 million slots for all those pieces, but it visually represents a level up in protection, whilst retaining a great deal of realism and an aura of cool.
This could eventually lead to full plate armors, for those classes who would thrive in those compared to others. You can of course retain the fantasy aspects in their designs and compositions, but some sense of rooted in our reality I think could prove beneficial for multiple reasons, and this is the conclusion to my tirade.
Adapting realistic pieces of armor into a fantasy universe will ease the load on the artists who need to create and model the pieces, as you can basically reference existing things and add one or two fantastical touches.
Our brains better comprehend the defensive capabilities of our own historical armors than those of generic fantasy armor. Tell me you wouldn't feel safer on a battlefield wearing this:
Rather than this:
How the hell do you even lift your arms without gouging your eyes out in that thing???
So imagine the progression of your adventurer as follows:
Oh and as a PS:
That crotch flap thing? That's not a tabard. That's a monastic scapular.
A tabard is this:
And the following is a surcoat:
The important detail being this one is long and split down the middle, so that the wearer can move about without getting the fabric caught in between his legs. Also much better for sitting and riding horses.
So yes. Naming and accuracy matters. Perhaps not to all, but to some. However I feel that all fantasy should add more realism in some of the armors and weapons they present. I think the contrast between a person in an actual suit of armor facing some lovecraftian horror, sells the incredibly stacked odds far better.
The question for this discussion:
What types of realistic armor would you like to see? What level of realism would you like vs how much fantastical elements ?
4
Comments
"More realism in Fantasy"
I mean... Ashes is high magic Fantasy, so...
When I was younger I really loved the big pauldrons in wow, but now I can really appreciate a game that has realistic armor that looks amazing. I'm not such a fan of the over sized/unrealistic armors anymore.
Im all for the realistic armor with amazing design/artistic features.
The armor & weaponry in the recent Pathfinder series was excellent as well.
FFXIV and BDO are on the other end of the spectrum. Not a fan of gothic cyberpunk meets burlesque Victorianism in my mmos.