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No specific level areas and everyone playing together
Garrtok
Member
Hi,
we know, that there are no specific level areas like in most Mmos.
We know that there is some content especially for high level characters, for example bosses spawning for events or dungeons etc., but everyone is more or less playing in the same area.
That means most of the sandbox content like node wars, caravans etc. Is shared with everyone. We know that ashes will require quite some time to reach max level, so my question is what will the game do/what is planned to enable everyone playing together without blocking non maxlevel players from most of the interesting content?
Even when iam level 20 I have a fair interest in my cities caravan reaching another city, or defending my city etc, but what is the point in joining any of these activities when you die after two hits?
For me this is quite an important question that makes the games system work or break. The caravans and nodes are the key features of the game, when it's too much dominated by max level people and the rest has to play first for a month to participate in that, it's not motivating for most of the people and the result is potentially that it will fail.
we know, that there are no specific level areas like in most Mmos.
We know that there is some content especially for high level characters, for example bosses spawning for events or dungeons etc., but everyone is more or less playing in the same area.
That means most of the sandbox content like node wars, caravans etc. Is shared with everyone. We know that ashes will require quite some time to reach max level, so my question is what will the game do/what is planned to enable everyone playing together without blocking non maxlevel players from most of the interesting content?
Even when iam level 20 I have a fair interest in my cities caravan reaching another city, or defending my city etc, but what is the point in joining any of these activities when you die after two hits?
For me this is quite an important question that makes the games system work or break. The caravans and nodes are the key features of the game, when it's too much dominated by max level people and the rest has to play first for a month to participate in that, it's not motivating for most of the people and the result is potentially that it will fail.
2
Comments
I agree and wish the vertical scaling was curved in a way that more levels could play together.
I don't feel like gear and or class balance could play a role in that. Maybe with two levels difference, but not with 20.
I like being able to outplay others with pure skill.
I like when i killed a lvl 60 warrior in WoW as a lvl 47 hunter by kiteing him across the map twice before he died lol was doing likem 20% of the my normal dmg due to WoW having level difference dmg reduction :P
Of course that happend to many people, but that doesn't change that the most interesting parts in ashes are locked or at least less appealing for the majority for some time.
I think leveling up should take a long time.
Probably because I value things that are hard to earn, like fine possesions, real achievements, the strength to hold your own and pave the way for your vision, being part of something big.
You on the other hand garrtok want things handed to you.
"... it's not motivating for most people..." That's you, whinging, not a fact. The reality is that people are tired of shallow mmos.
Iam not talking about myself. So don't get insulting just because you assume that I want it easy, just because you want to feel special.
I've 2'v1ed a level 60 in classic with myself and a friend, both mid level 40 druids. I think it was a warrior but I can't quite remember. Druids though... druids in classic...
And that's not even taking into account that your chance to hit decreases against higher level players by quite a bit, their stats significantly higher and their skill ranks are higher too.
I think things will be just fine. Yea you might get 1 hit as a level 20 if your fighting against a max level player but this game is clearly HEAVILY centered around group play and I have absolutely no doubt in my mind if you have a big ol group of level 20s that you can take down a max level player. At the very least you can try and CC or heal or do a little damage, it's not like you are completely invaluable. Whats the point of even having gear, levels, skill ranks, ect if everybody is just going to get homogenized.
I say if people want that then they need to go play a match based pvp game. I'm not an elitist and I have few friends, so I'm sure i'll be getting dominated. And i'm not a masochist so I won't enjoy it, but I think I stand with the majority of AoC anticipators here when I say: I am very happy that this most likely won't be the case.
They should add events which are restricted to players below lvl 30.
Maps could have some guard towers which provide some buffs or income to the main town or visibility on map or benefits to local farms or resource regeneration.
Attacking and defending lower level towers could be restricted to low level players only. Then veterans and new low level players will interact together sooner, before max level.
What's ironic is that it actually is the source of a large amount of the motivation to level up. Get wrecked, get stronger right?
Not only that, it's a source of motivation to group up. It's a tool used to keep the MMO a multiplayer experience and not a single player one like so many others have become.
So as it is now, ashes will have a problem in achieving that. So I think it's a very valid question or discussion
Can you please stop spamming rubbish? It's a flaw compared to other pvp games so it's important to talk about it no? Be constructive.
In no mmo could you beat a person higher lv than you.
There is no such thing as lv equalization. Some mmos beat around the bush but there are always gear strengths, ability points (the more you have, the more passives you've learned, the bigger the toolkit selection and more customization you have). There always be a difference between those that are ahead of people that are "level 20".
Even mobas now have masteries and keystones and all sorts of progression gimmicks.
Mmos always had levels and strength diffetences based on who out the effort and who didnt.
Who are you to come here and say it's a flawed design? What "PvP games" are you talking about? This is an mmo. What do you mean "we know there are no specific level areas"?
Who is we?
Who is "more or less playing the same area"?
Are you making up rules now?
Thats basic knowledge about ashes of creation. Based on the rules of the game, there is always overlap between the players, no matter what level they have. Because of the design of the game, one node area has to have content for multiple level ranges, therefore you will always have maxlevel players with low level players in one area. For some reason I assumed "we" includes also you.
Iam talking for example about the open pvp of guild wars 2 (which uses up scaling) or warhammer online ( which has dedicated pvp areas for specific levels).
And yes of course someone with a higher level should be stronger. For me it's about the question if also more low level people can participate in a meaningful way in the major features like caravans and node sieges.
Forget about scaling. What overlap are you talking about? Higher lv players of a node will be at the boarders of the nodes influence, taking on the more challenging environment, to reap the best rewards, while possibly having conflicts of interests with other higher lv players. The noobs will be at the center of the node, basically around the town, taking on weak content.
There has been castle sieges and such in other mmos. If you are low level going there is a waste of time. Go xp and come back a couple months later. We are not going to bring down the power of the players that put in the effort, just so that weak players can participate in the most awesome PvP content that is sieges, which will be once in a while. Screw that. There might be some plants (cannons rams catapults) and crap like that for low level players to use. But when the higher lv comes at them, yes I expect them to lick the floor, and fast.
You want things handed to you and that's the bottom of the line. You can say all you want "it's not motivating for most players" and other lines like that, but hey.. go and look up some quotes from Steven. Be free to delude your self like some others.
Flawed system? Nah mate. You just dont agree with it. People in this day and age correlate their views with the word correct. I find many other games flawed. And my proof that they are flawed is that I dont play them anymore. Why? Because of scaling, dedicated pvp areas and other things that make the whole point of PROGRESS meaningless. And if progress is meaningless in an mmo then what's the point.
Open world pvp doesn't mean that players overlap and so there should be scaling for those that played for months and those that played for a week. Get real..
"Low lvs should participate meaningfully". Ye, they should go level and maybe fight other low lv players. Leave sieges to those with experience and gear.
Btw, AoC isn't the first game with sieges trade runs and what not. How on earth did you come with the idea that low lv players should hold their own against higher lv?
I'm done with you.
Lower level characters will have usefulness in mass combat that does not depend on their level, such as manning siege weapons, helping repair fortifications, bringing proximity-based buffs to key positions, using stealth or scaling walls. These types of things are relevant to the tide of battle and do not require the player to be max-level or have high combat stats.
Thats from the wiki and a propper answer to my question. Thanks alot for your passive aggressive answer.
With this being said,
if I (or anybody for that matter), had the choice between a LvL 20 or a LvL 50 to bring along, then pretty much everybody would choose the Level 50 and thats how it should be.