PvP and PvE gearing:

Ultravis

Hello, I am a relatively new supporter/backer of this game and have finally had enough abuse from Blizzard with the state of WoW (Specifically WoW classic as I have been playing it for 3 years).

What I wanted to talk about is the distinction between PvP and PvE gear and what I DONT want to see happen with this game; that is the clear distinction between PvP and PvE gearing with a PvP stat similar to resilience. I think vanilla wow's approach was ok with PvP gear having a bit more stamina than Raid gearing, but resilience as a stat in TBC and Wrath really ruined the PvP aspect of the game. I was never a gladiator, but I did manage to get to 2000 rating in TBC and I had all the best PvP gear each season.

Pretty much every MMO past WoW that I have played has copied wow with some sort of PvP stat and I find it to be immersion breaking, whether it was Rift, or New World as of late. I don't mind PvP being a gateway to good gear, but it has to be similar in power level to PvE gear. Two players one in PvE gear and one in PvP gear of the same item level should have an equal chance in a 1v1 where skill determines the winner. I dont mind there being minor stat differences, for example, a little more damage on the PvE gear and a little more health on the PvP gear, but I do not want to see a stat like resilience that becomes a must have in order to be competitive in PvP. In wow, it was so bad, that I couldn't even step into arena as a priest until I had a minimum of 300 resilience, with the only way of obtaining being strait PvP grinding.

I get that this is an MMO and there will be many times where better geared players will win over players in worse gear just because of better stats; I understand that there needs to be a gearing progression system. Its just that there is no clear distinction statwise between these 2 avenues of obtaining gear.

Why does this stat ruin immersion? Well, if I go and kill some big dragon and make a bunch of the best gear from PvE in the game for my character and some guy in PvP gear just strait demolishes me simply because I don't have resilience or a similar stat, well that is just plain dumb. What is the point of killing the dragons and other epic monsters if I have nothing to show for it in a PvP setting?

That is all I have. Thanks for reading....

Songcaller

The gear is pvx. There will be no disparity between pvp and pve gear. Though there will be some enhancements only available from the arena but they will be timed I think.

McShave

There is a conversation to be had between a balance of offensive stat and defensive stats. There are no PvP specific stats, as far as we know, but Steven has talked about how they will allow you to build the way you want and still be somewhat effect (assuming you are using stats that your class can use). You can go glass-canon and be able to blow up a player, but then die instantly, or you can go full defense and survive a long time, but not be able to kill anyone.

All that said, we don't actually know what the stats will be in game. Intrepid is more at a stage where they are implementing the larger systems, like node development, caravans, and naval combat.

George_Black

There wont be stats on gears that only affect player to player combat.

hleV

What issue do you have exactly with New World's gear? The stats are the same, there's only perks: for PvE you have special perks that boost your damage/defense against specific type of mob, while for PvP you choose whatever perks are best against human brain rather than AI, with the exception of Resilient perk which is a must for PvP but is useless for PvE, as it reduces critical damage against you, and mobs cannot crit.

I do however wish that the PvP/PvE segregation isn't huge when it comes to power scaling in general. You know how in MMORPGs at max level you can oneshot mobs that are much lower level? However power scaling is designed in AoC, it should apply in PvP in a similar way. That's why I don't like normalized PvP gear/stats in MMOs - you just lose that sense of progression your character has gone through, when it comes to fighting players. If player A oneshots mob X, and player B is equal to mob X in terms of power, then player A should oneshot player B (in a hypothetical situation where player B doesn't use any actions/abilities that would prevent them from taking direct hits). I'm of course generalizing here, we know that at similar power, TTK in AoC is ~45s or so (in PvP), so there probably won't be oneshots even against low levels, but the point stands.

BaSkA_9x2

Ultravis wrote: »

What I wanted to talk about is the distinction between PvP and PvE gear and what I DONT want to see happen with this game; that is the clear distinction between PvP and PvE gearing with a PvP stat similar to resilience.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the gear in Ashes won't have anything like resilience. You may want to have gear with more crit than accuracy for PvP and the opposite for PvE, but nothing stupid like how resilience works. However, there will be specific gear for activities such as fishing, gathering, etc. which provide stats that help you do those non-combat activities. So you might want to have a variety of gear sets for different activities, but unless you're min-maxing for those 1% DPS advantages, all high tier gear will hopefully be fine to use all the time.

Veeshan

George_Black wrote: »

There wont be stats on gears that only affect player to player combat.

Pvp gear tbh was just a bandaid solution to dev fuck up when it comes to TTK between PvP and PvE scenario's if done correctly TTK for mobs and players should be balanced so the gear isnt needed.

Diamaht

Yeah with no separation between pve and pvp activities their should not be a separate "PvP Stat". If that were implemented, in an open world game, it would just become the normal gear and equipment that didn't have it wouldn't be used. Even for gatherers it would be suicide to not equip pvp gear when out in the world.