Node Sidegrade - Monster Nodes
Grimm IV
Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
I've been thinking about this one for a while and I've been gone for a while too so I'm not sure if it's been suggested already. I didn't find anything from a quick search.
Anyway, here's the idea. Add an alternate node path that allows them to be controlled by monsters. Let the monster nodes grow just like other nodes, making them more complex. These monster nodes could fight nearby nodes to grow, whether that's player nodes or other monsters. This could make a dynamic world that feels very lived in. It would also give the players some more agency on the shape of Verra.
Pros
Fills in the empty places of the world in a somewhat automated way
Great PvE opportunities
- Culling a nearby node to prevent upcoming monster hordes
- Cultivate choice monster spawns
- Provides incentive to dive deep into the unexplored areas of Verra (for the larger monster nodes with better loot)
- Protecting caravans through monster territory
Ample opportunity for emergent gameplay
Constantly shifting safe routes and the need to protect them
Slows progression into the world if we have to carve out our own place first. Also gives us more investment into those earned places.
Gives a reason for node decay beyond lack of upkeep
Further differentiate the servers
Cons
Probably pretty taxing on the servers to simulate the monster interactions
Adds more complexity to balancing
Could make getting through some areas too difficult
Could mess with tailored content
Obviously there's more to the pros and cons that I haven't thought of but that's why I'm posting. Lemme know what you guys think and poke all the holes in my idea (or point me to the other thread about this that I didn't find if there is one)
Anyway, here's the idea. Add an alternate node path that allows them to be controlled by monsters. Let the monster nodes grow just like other nodes, making them more complex. These monster nodes could fight nearby nodes to grow, whether that's player nodes or other monsters. This could make a dynamic world that feels very lived in. It would also give the players some more agency on the shape of Verra.
Pros
Fills in the empty places of the world in a somewhat automated way
Great PvE opportunities
- Culling a nearby node to prevent upcoming monster hordes
- Cultivate choice monster spawns
- Provides incentive to dive deep into the unexplored areas of Verra (for the larger monster nodes with better loot)
- Protecting caravans through monster territory
Ample opportunity for emergent gameplay
Constantly shifting safe routes and the need to protect them
Slows progression into the world if we have to carve out our own place first. Also gives us more investment into those earned places.
Gives a reason for node decay beyond lack of upkeep
Further differentiate the servers
Cons
Probably pretty taxing on the servers to simulate the monster interactions
Adds more complexity to balancing
Could make getting through some areas too difficult
Could mess with tailored content
Obviously there's more to the pros and cons that I haven't thought of but that's why I'm posting. Lemme know what you guys think and poke all the holes in my idea (or point me to the other thread about this that I didn't find if there is one)
1
Comments
The buffer nodes are just nodes which do not become vassal
https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Vassal_nodes
That means when a metropolis falls, they can take it's place fast. Being taken out of that 'buffer' and entering in competition with the other lvl 5 nodes.
Any node can have this autonomous state if somehow avoids falling under the influence of another one.
When a metro falls, one of the fives will level up to take its place. But instead of just taking over the exact same set of nodes from that metro's vassal system, the new metro will pull up nodes from new places. And those new places are provided by the buffer 1s and 2s.
And in that context the suggestion for mob nodes could apply to a few of the buffer nodes which could level up to a stage 3 and block a player node from joining the newly established vassal system. At which point people would have to siege this node to let others grow and become vassals.
Or at least that's how I see it going down in my head.
When a lvl 6 falls, the lvl 5 former vassals have no reason to wait for those 20 lvl 1-2 nodes to level up.
Before the first lvl 6 appears on the map, all other nodes will have relationships.
A single isolated node can grow more or less depending how much experience it's citizens can feed into it. If nobody buys appartments there, will die of attrition.
Unless some of these 20 are lvl 5 with their own vassals, their influence will be low and any of the 2 former lvl 5 will become the new metro. That is what Steven wants to avoid. He wants to prevent players to easily predict what will happen.
why would they stay at lvl 1-2? Who will push them down or detach them from their parent nodes?
This picture shows that the largest vassal tree can have 13 modes
the game allows 5 metropolises. That means in an ideal case, we can have 5 x "13 node tree" = 65 nodes in maximum 13 size trees. Then 20 remain without a metropolis main node.
But these 20 can still be linked with each other.
At server start, as the 85 nodes start leveling up, before the first level 6 metro node appears on the map, it is possible that we will have 14 trees of up to 6 nodes each, like in this picture.
14 x "6 node" = 84 and 1 solo node
5 of the 14 nodes can grow to level 6 and take under control 5 of the remaining 9 nodes
That means we can end up with 4 x "6 node trees" + 1 solo node = 25 nodes outside of the metropolises influence.
If players attack and destroy these smaller chains, the destroyed nodes become level 1 and start filling the branches which can still receive nodes (5 of them - each metro has place for one more level 1 - 2 node)
That remaining solo node can maybe fall immediately under the influence of a metro. But can also happen that the "x" leafs of the metro trees are level 1 and the solo node is level 2 and then it remains solo.
Solo nodes can even have higher level if they were pushed to high level by former vassals, which possibly were destroyed. The citizens of those solo nodes might have a hard time preventing them to decay through attrition.
But let's say we are in the state of 5 x 13 = 65 nodes + 20 solo level 1 nodes.
We don't know what happens with these level 1 nodes . Maybe they level up if players play close to them. Or maybe some nearby higher level node will get the experience.
If a level 6 metro node falls, it's chain splits and we have only 2 level 5 nodes which can take the place of the metropolis.
So in order to have more possibilities as Steven wants, the 20 level 1 nodes must be able to grow and create their own structures: 3 x 6 + 2
That means 3 level 5 nodes to compete with the two level 5 former vassals of the metro.
However these 20 nodes will be distributed over the map in various ways, depending how the leveling happened and might be too far to link with each-other. Again this depends how big the ZoI of the lower nodes is.
Because you say you have a different understanding, I wonder if I miss important mechanics.
Maybe if a metro falls, the vassal relationships are temporarily broken?
So when I try to imagine how nodes would start growing in lvls I see these potential buffer nodes as just the ones w/o XP. Everything around them would be leveling up and when the buffers ones do get some XP - they'll be blocked by their surroundings.
Now I could be wrong in that assumption or there might just be some edge cases where the buffer nodes manage to get bunched up all together in one spot instead being spread out across the world, at which point they'd be able to grow past lvl2 w/o being blocked. But I'd need to see Intrepid's new tech demo on how this new system works to really understand if that's even a possibility.
They could even make some dungeons only spawn in higher tier monster nodes. Then even the dungeon entrances wouldn't be static between servers and there would be a reason to allow monster nodes to grow.
I mainly like this idea cause it makes Verra feel like it went on with life in our absence. We could be helping to reconnect those who remained (but this is getting away from the system itself and into story territory).
I think it would just be really cool to have monster controlled nodes that operate within the existing node system.