Stop trying to change the corruption system

GullibleSkeptic

Why are all these threads trying to change a system that hasn't been showcased let alone tested? Open world pvp in ashes sounds pretty balanced but no one can know yet. How about we let them make the system, we test it in Alpha 2 then if you don't like it you can come give constructive feedback here.

Ludullu

It's the fear of the unknown based on the knowledge of how bad "similar" things are. A ton of people think of WoW's faction-based genocidal pvp when they hear the word "pvp". And when all you know is "pvp = genocide with no penalty for the murderer" - you think that it's a bad mechanic that will kill the game.

And a ton of people think that they know the "solution" to the "problem" of the system, even though they don't truly know the system.

unknownsystemerror

NiKr wrote: »

It's the fear of the unknown based on the knowledge of how bad "similar" things are.

I cause a lot of fear.

Okeydoke

NiKr wrote: »

And a ton of people think that they know the "solution" to the "problem" of the system, even though they don't truly know the system.

I think a lot of people are envisioning it worse than it will actually be. None of us really know exactly how it's going to be.

This is all theory, that even if it was true in essence, won't be universally true. But I envision each player having a finite amount of murders that they are willing to commit over a given time frame, for many that number being 0. Others, 1, 3, 5, maybe some amount more. But I envision a tendency for players who are going to commit some amount of murder, to punch in their weight class. Why waste murder counts on randoms, low tier gatherers, and low/mid tier boss contesting when you and your guild are capable of contesting high end content. Some will punch below their weight class, but I see a tendency and compelling reasons not to.

No one knows what's in someone elses inventory. Could be a full load, could be not much at all. Some murders are absolutely not going to end up being worth it in any way, and will be more damaging to the killer than beneficial. Some kills will be all risk, no reward. This will have a chilling effect on random, wanton murder, griefing and the like.

I envision areas of the map that are relatively safe and very difficult for people to get away with murder in, and areas of the map that are not as safe. Dependent on the types of people and guilds who live in the area and population levels.

There will be certain content that is heavily, heavily contested. But a decent amount of content and ways to make money that are not so heavily contested, in some cases even very lightly contested at best.

I see a rhyme and reason to it, but with a chaotic element as well at times. Wouldn't be much fun without some level of chaos.

Other people just see chaos. Gigachad guilds with nothing to do but hunt gatherers. There may be some of that. But gigachads have other gigachads to worry about too.

All theory on my part, I don't profess this as fact.

Strevi

GullibleSkeptic wrote: »

Why are all these threads trying to change a system that hasn't been showcased let alone tested? Open world pvp in ashes sounds pretty balanced but no one can know yet. How about we let them make the system, we test it in Alpha 2 then if you don't like it you can come give constructive feedback here.

"sounds pretty balanced but no one can know yet. "

isn't this a contradiction?

"we test it in Alpha 2 then if you don't like it you can come give constructive feedback here"

I disagree on doing radical changes after Alpha 2.
Better sooner than later.
The Alpha 2 should be only about balancing, not dropping concepts and transforming the game from a PvP into a PvE game.

GullibleSkeptic

Strevi wrote: »

GullibleSkeptic wrote: »

Why are all these threads trying to change a system that hasn't been showcased let alone tested? Open world pvp in ashes sounds pretty balanced but no one can know yet. How about we let them make the system, we test it in Alpha 2 then if you don't like it you can come give constructive feedback here.

"sounds pretty balanced but no one can know yet. "

isn't this a contradiction?

"we test it in Alpha 2 then if you don't like it you can come give constructive feedback here"

I disagree on doing radical changes after Alpha 2.
Better sooner than later.
The Alpha 2 should be only about balancing, not dropping concepts and transforming the game from a PvP into a PvE game.

No that's not a contradiction I am saying it sounds as if the system will be balanced but seeing as how I nor anyone else has played it we can't judge it beyond what we have heard.
Also you are wrong on your second point you can't make radical changes on a system you haven't played it's just a bunch of people saying well in this mmo it sucked so it's gonna suck here.
Alpha 2 not a one weekend and done test. You run a weekend long test telling people to go crazy and kill everyone then take the data. Is the system working as intended are the punishment (negative xp, drop rates on death, gear drop on death, stat loss while corrupted) working as intended? If so then you run another tlregular weekend test don't tell players anything. Having experienced the negatives of the corruption system are they still slaughtering each other? If no your system is fine if yes why? What's needs to be more punishing.

GullibleSkeptic

Okeydoke wrote: »

NiKr wrote: »

And a ton of people think that they know the "solution" to the "problem" of the system, even though they don't truly know the system.

I think a lot of people are envisioning it worse than it will actually be. None of us really know exactly how it's going to be.

This is all theory, that even if it was true in essence, won't be universally true. But I envision each player having a finite amount of murders that they are willing to commit over a given time frame, for many that number being 0. Others, 1, 3, 5, maybe some amount more. But I envision a tendency for players who are going to commit some amount of murder, to punch in their weight class. Why waste murder counts on randoms, low tier gatherers, and low/mid tier boss contesting when you and your guild are capable of contesting high end content. Some will punch below their weight class, but I see a tendency and compelling reasons not to.

No one knows what's in someone elses inventory. Could be a full load, could be not much at all. Some murders are absolutely not going to end up being worth it in any way, and will be more damaging to the killer than beneficial. Some kills will be all risk, no reward. This will have a chilling effect on random, wanton murder, griefing and the like.

I envision areas of the map that are relatively safe and very difficult for people to get away with murder in, and areas of the map that are not as safe. Dependent on the types of people and guilds who live in the area and population levels.

There will be certain content that is heavily, heavily contested. But a decent amount of content and ways to make money that are not so heavily contested, in some cases even very lightly contested at best.

I see a rhyme and reason to it, but with a chaotic element as well at times. Wouldn't be much fun without some level of chaos.

Other people just see chaos. Gigachad guilds with nothing to do but hunt gatherers. There may be some of that. But gigachads have other gigachads to worry about too.

All theory on my part, I don't profess this as fact.

Completely agree I think too many people are afraid they are gonna get constantly killed for no reason when it is far more likely you will be killed because someone observed you harvesting a lot of high end gatherables. And if you see someone following you call a friend make ur way towards a node or more populated areas. Honestly I doubt u r just gonna be wondering around ashes and bam some level 50 full raid gear one shots you.

Scarbeus

"People fear what they don't understand". The only people who fully understand the corruption system are the people at Intrepid who designed it and have the most experience testing it. We'll just have to wait until we have a good amount of experience in it ourselves before voicing our opinions.

Andy

NiKr wrote: »

It's the fear of the unknown based on the knowledge of how bad "similar" things are. A ton of people think of WoW's faction-based genocidal pvp when they hear the word "pvp". And when all you know is "pvp = genocide with no penalty for the murderer" - you think that it's a bad mechanic that will kill the game.

And a ton of people think that they know the "solution" to the "problem" of the system, even though they don't truly know the system.

Then they have no clue.

Because in WoW you aren't punished for griefing/PK. It's clearly not the same. They just overreact.

Beyolf

Strevi wrote: »

GullibleSkeptic wrote: »

Why are all these threads trying to change a system that hasn't been showcased let alone tested? Open world pvp in ashes sounds pretty balanced but no one can know yet. How about we let them make the system, we test it in Alpha 2 then if you don't like it you can come give constructive feedback here.

"sounds pretty balanced but no one can know yet. "

isn't this a contradiction?

"we test it in Alpha 2 then if you don't like it you can come give constructive feedback here"

I disagree on doing radical changes after Alpha 2.
Better sooner than later.
The Alpha 2 should be only about balancing, not dropping concepts and transforming the game from a PvP into a PvE game.

The game is PvX or PvPvE not a PvP game nor a PvE and it is very well communicated since the start of the project.

Dygz

Well, that communication has been revealed as misleading hype with the addition of the Open Seas and the Node Ruins. PvX is about as meaningful as "Ashes will release before 2020".
Ashes is a PvP-centric game that requires PvPers to do some PvE. Just like every other PvP-centric.

That being said...
The Forums goes through cycles. Especially has new people join.
It's common for new PvPers to complain that Corruption is too harsh and for new PvEers to complain that Corruption is not harsh enough. But... we also have that recent Lucky Ghost video and Asmongold's reaction vid.


Corruption has to be implemented and tested before we can get any meaningful idea for how it will actually feel in the game - especially with significant design changes happening and no release date on the horizon.
But, until then... people love to theorycraft.

Dygz

Strevi wrote: »

I disagree on doing radical changes after Alpha 2.
Better sooner than later.
The Alpha 2 should be only about balancing, not dropping concepts and transforming the game from a PvP into a PvE game.

Betas are for balancing only. No new features added.
Alphas are where preliminary balancing begins - once features are implemented.
Features have to be implented first - then they will begin to be meaningfully evaluated and tweaked.
People can imagine all kinds of "problems" in their heads. Just as people can imagine the Moon is made of cheese.

Balrog21

I have to agree with an above poster, most people think of wow when it comes to pvp. This will not be a gank box where you have no repercussions for killing anyone. One of the bad things wow gave us, where you can be an asshat ten fold and feel good about yourself.

Liniker

Gamers are stupid. That's why.

akabear

Agree with OP

/ signed