Griefing & Corruption Misinformation

NyceGaming

Hello,
Over the course of the past week I’ve seen contradicting information in discord, forums, YouTube videos, and an abundant amount in YouTube comment sections when it comes to the topic corruption, griefing, and general pvp.
While I feel Intrepid has done an amazing job explaining this in various ways via interviews, AMAs, streams, forums, etc., there’s still a lot of people confused (even with the wiki existing).
While the flagging system and/or corruption as a whole is still subject to change, I’m curious if the team will do an in depth breakdown of the corruption system and methods taken to prevent griefing. There are plenty of players in my comment section and others still scared to play the game simply because the system confuses them, they were given misinformation, or they are Care Bears
While I feel like the threat of losing gear, exp grind, bounty hunters, being revealed on the map, etc is enough and has been well explained, would the team consider a stream or short video explaining they are likely not to face griefing and what measurements are being taken?

Strevi

Define griefing.
Is defeating and taking another player's drops griefing?
Is watching a player being killed by an NPC and taking his drops griefing?

Lex

NyceGaming wrote: »

While I feel Intrepid has done an amazing job explaining this in various ways via interviews, AMAs, streams, forums, etc., there’s still a lot of people confused (even with the wiki existing).
While the flagging system and/or corruption as a whole is still subject to change, I’m curious if the team will do an in depth breakdown of the corruption system and methods taken to prevent griefing.

Couldn't agree more. They probably need to do a blog article summarizing the system with some examples.

NyceGaming

Strevi wrote: »

Define griefing.
Is defeating and taking another player's drops griefing?
Is watching a player being killed by an NPC and taking his drops griefing?

I’d say no. I personally feel the term is overly used and just intended to scare people into thinking any form of pvp is griefing. For sake of argument let’s say that the players fed misinformation define griefing as “someone who deliberately irritates and harasses other players within the game (trolling) by doing things such as repeatedly targeting them, harassing, stream sniping, spawn camping, etc. A griefer derives pleasure primarily, or exclusively, from the act of annoying other users”

TheRealGodzilla

I would like some clarification on this as well. Just to clear the air for the community. I for one, have seen a lot of misinformation on recent youtube comments section as well. People saying they aren't going to play because they remember lineage 2 being full of griefers, etc even though i know you guys at intrepid have made many improvements on this system to combat it, but the general audience who only watch general mmo Youtubers who don't paint a full picture of your guys systems and are scared.

Just some clarification on some pain points i think most PvE players have;

Annoying or attacking players while purple (not red) is there basic description of 'griefing'. I describe it as being annoying, and a pest, to some degree. They are worried that they can't log in and do their own thing, and worry some PvP griefer player is going to keep them from doing what they want. I notate purple, because there is no corruption gained, unless you kill a non-combatant. So they could in theory stay purple and spam attacks on the green player without penalty. However if killed they have the whole corruption system to worry about then.

A second pain point;

If player 1 goes Red and kills a non-combatant they can just have their friend(player 2) kill them, player 1 loses exp, and have their friend pick up their gear and give it to them later, doing this does it eliminate the bounty hunter system all together?
According to the Wiki "A player may not flag on members of the same party, raid, guild or alliance"
So could they possibly still circumvent this if, they(player 1) left the party with their friend (player 2), then their friend(player 2) kills them(player 1), but was not in the same guild as them? Player 2 picks up losts items from death on player 1, and gives them back at a later date.
If this is the case, A corrupt (red player) suffers penalties at 4 times. Does that mean the corrupt player loses 12% exp? Compared to the Green Players 3% since it is 4x the penalty? How long in a reasonable number would it take to get the exp debt grinded/quested off?
I know this is a lot of moving parts, however this is what a lot of 'worry' i think is built around gaming the system.

In my opinion griefing is the senseless killing of a green player over and over again. Not a one off thing..
PvP is not griefing. Its just the repeated action. I just think PvP and PvE players alike would appreciate an in depth explanation of this system so we could stop speculating from previous games since we cannot get on the Alpha 2 and play currently to test this system.

NyceGaming

TheRealGodzilla wrote: »

I would like some clarification on this as well. Just to clear the air for the community. I for one, have seen a lot of misinformation on recent youtube comments section as well. People saying they aren't going to play because they remember lineage 2 being full of griefers, etc even though i know you guys at intrepid have made many improvements on this system to combat it, but the general audience who only watch general mmo Youtubers who don't paint a full picture of your guys systems and are scared.

Just some clarification on some pain points i think most PvE players have;

Annoying or attacking players while purple (not red) is there basic description of 'griefing'. I describe it as being annoying, and a pest, to some degree. They are worried that they can't log in and do their own thing, and worry some PvP griefer player is going to keep them from doing what they want. I notate purple, because there is no corruption gained, unless you kill a non-combatant. So they could in theory stay purple and spam attacks on the green player without penalty. However if killed they have the whole corruption system to worry about then.

A second pain point;

If player 1 goes Red and kills a non-combatant they can just have their friend(player 2) kill them, player 1 loses exp, and have their friend pick up their gear and give it to them later, doing this does it eliminate the bounty hunter system all together?
According to the Wiki "A player may not flag on members of the same party, raid, guild or alliance"
So could they possibly still circumvent this if, they(player 1) left the party with their friend (player 2), then their friend(player 2) kills them(player 1), but was not in the same guild as them? Player 2 picks up losts items from death on player 1, and gives them back at a later date.
If this is the case, A corrupt (red player) suffers penalties at 4 times. Does that mean the corrupt player loses 12% exp? Compared to the Green Players 3% since it is 4x the penalty? How long in a reasonable number would it take to get the exp debt grinded/quested off?
I know this is a lot of moving parts, however this is what a lot of 'worry' i think is built around gaming the system.

In my opinion griefing is the senseless killing of a green player over and over again. Not a one off thing..
PvP is not griefing. Its just the repeated action. I just think PvP and PvE players alike would appreciate an in depth explanation of this system so we could stop speculating from previous games since we cannot get on the Alpha 2 and play currently to test this system.

Yes! I agree with all this. Hopefully they’ve thought on all these work arounds. And yea griefing is just a repeated harassment of same player. PURE pve’ers will sometimes call one death griefing

Ludullu

The main problem with making an article on their site or a video on their YT is that until deep into alpha2 Intrepid themselves got no clue what the balancing of the system is gonna be.

They might explain the system itself, but then through testing learn that they need to tweak so much stuff that the system now works almost completely different. I get that a shitton of people got no clue how it works and even those who have some base knowledge from the L2 days don't do their due diligence (Lucky Ghost) to at least begin to understand the changes Steven has made to the system.

Though again, as Steven's comment on LG's video has shown - Intrepid themselves haven't fully cemented the design yet.

NyceGaming

NiKr wrote: »

The main problem with making an article on their site or a video on their YT is that until deep into alpha2 Intrepid themselves got no clue what the balancing of the system is gonna be.

They might explain the system itself, but then through testing learn that they need to tweak so much stuff that the system now works almost completely different. I get that a shitton of people got no clue how it works and even those who have some base knowledge from the L2 days don't do their due diligence (Lucky Ghost) to at least begin to understand the changes Steven has made to the system.

Though again, as Steven's comment on LG's video has shown - Intrepid themselves haven't fully cemented the design yet.

Well said! So I just seen in Twitter that they are indeed going to clear this up on October 28th on stream