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Hybrid Combat system
Beyolf
Member
Hello AoC team and community,
I wanted to ask what made you go into the way of hybrid combat system instead of pure action base or tab targeting, please dont get me wrong i am just curious not against it and i like the idea of hybrid combat. I just really want to understand why you choose to use such hybrid system.
Thank you in advance!
I wanted to ask what made you go into the way of hybrid combat system instead of pure action base or tab targeting, please dont get me wrong i am just curious not against it and i like the idea of hybrid combat. I just really want to understand why you choose to use such hybrid system.
Thank you in advance!
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Comments
He describes it very well.
thank you for your response, i already watched his video and i am very well aware of Narc's position of this. I am more interested in reading AoC's developers reasoning.
true , GW2 has quite good hybrid system in my opinion and it looks like AoC's developers want to expand that system so such system definitely has potential, i am just interested in their reasoning if it was ever communicated.
yea i also disagree with some of Narc's opinions and thats the reason i asked if there is a explanation from AoC's developers. I am very interested to read their reasons to choose to go into hybrid system.
It's the same reason as for why it's a pvp centric game, why you can't change your primary class, why there is no hot bikini armor like in other korean games
because Intrepid want it that way, it's Steven's vision, the guy is making the game he wants to play, and in that game, we have hybrid combat, not action combat, and not full tab combat.
It's decided with the skill and how you level up and augment it, you can't just swap at a moment's notice.
I am not asking for such things so i dont know why you even brought them up, i am not against the hybrid combat either as i said above and i am very happy with the vision which Steven have so what is your point ?
I love that the game is no korean game and thats its pvp centric ... Thats why i am here not in korean mmo forums so again what is your point?
So i am not allowed to ask for their reasoning? Ofcourse its their game and they can do what ever they want. I am just curious what is their logic behind using hybrid system whats the problem in that?
narc misses very crucial points tho. tab target systems can be abused far more than action combat and he doesnt talk about that or how you can do it. all he says is that he doesnt wanna have to aim as an archer
You don't need hardcore aiming for soft lock is the thing. It does require some sort of effort though in a much better immersive way compared to 0 effort and you click a button and turn to hit an enemy with tab.
Exactly
As long as it feels good in competitive ranked arenas I'm happy.
I dont want the game to be fps gods destroying everyone in their path with no recourse.
you are somewhat correct but...tab targetting allows for a group of archers to just click you and then you die, and theres nothing you can do about it. i allows summoners to attack you with their pets while they can be in a completely different room. it allows for player scouting (if we have commands) and a lot of other things.
I assume the summoner has to originally be within sightline to throw their pet at you. The game can be (and probably is) coded to not allow clicking people that your character cannot currently see. Also break targeting on sightline loss.
Also if youre solo vs a number of people that can one shot you with bows, you weren't gonna win anyways.
As for the scouting thing, idk maybe theres a hiding mechanic or camoflauge? idk how youd solve that. but as long as you got a tree or wall between you and the searcher they shouldnt be randomly finding you.
in tt you can target the othe rplayer, like maybe you are right outside the room they are in and they cant see you as they are fighting mobs, but you can see them. so you can target the player, go to another room, then send your summon. for tt to be fair, all these things and more need to be addressed.
you can survive archers in action combat by dodging the arrows...if you are in a siege or node wars or whatever mass pvp, tt makes melee even more useless
There should be a damage increase of course compared to tab in whatever form it takes but this isn't fully true. You do not need to give a giant damage boost nor do you need to do headshots. You use softlock it will ensure focus, but you do not need to aim like a shooter you just look towards the target you want to attack. You need to trackt hem yes, you don't need to be precise, and your attack goes towards your soft lock target.
It is impossible for it to feel like a fps, i keep getting confused where these takes are coming from.... Action combat and a FPS are two different things. One is action combat the other is a FPS or third person shooter, they do not work the same...
Aside from the soft lock concept, action combat in general is exactly like fps, only fps fires faster projectiles than we may experience in rpgs. Action combat requires you to point your cursor at an opponent (or lead an opponent) and fire the ability expecting the projectile or aoe placement to hit the point of the cursor...it literally is fps. Consider a grenade throw in any fps, that is action combat 100% as well.
If someone chooses to use a tab target ability in action combat, I don't believe there will be any "buff" to the ability because of the forced addition of difficulty. Although they did say there will be augments that will change abilities one way or the other, that is a different argument.
Technically you are right, but the main difference between ranged action combat in rpg games and FPS games is the mechanics with which hit is registered. Most of the FPS i know of use hit scan (In New World the musket also use that) which means that there is no travel time for your ammos when you click "fire" button the game makes a snapshot of the position of your cursor and the enemy position and if your cursos is in the hitbox of the enemy player it register dmg, which means that there is not much time to react, in action combat mmo rpgs thats not how it works, the ranged attacks are projectiles which have fly time and maybe also gravity depending on the weapon which means that after you shoot a projectile it first has to fly over your enemy and then calculate if it hits the enemy by caluculating if the position at which the projectile landed collide with the enemy player , which makes it much easier to avoid even without active dodge ability and it becomes harder and harder to hit someone from bigger range.
In my experience tab targeting system usually suffer from button overload (having to use 20-30+ buttons for abilities) in order to have good in depth mechanics and it forces trading damage and cooldowns so it becomes very scripted especially in PvP scenario, another think which i dont like about tab targeting in PvP is that it makes character power much bigger factor for an outcome of a fight (gear etc.).
The action combat allows much more unpredictability and outplay potential because you can avoid all of the damage by just good movement without using abilities , which for me make the combat much more engaging and fun. The problem of Action combat system is the PvE design, its really hard to make good PvE design with a lot of engaging mechanics if everything can be dodged/blocked.
Hybrid system is trying to combine the good stuff from both worlds, but so far i experienced a hybrid system only in GW2 and i think it does quite a good job, because it really gives much more outplay potential than a tab targeting system, but its not as extreme as Action combat where you can use everything in your kit and not damage your enemy even once. Also its easier to design engaging PvE around hybrid system, so i believe that's the reason they decided to go in this direction, but i am not sure that's why i asked for their reasoning since i really am just curious what was the thought process , behind their design.
I personally prefer action combat based system , but i am happy with a hybrid if it does NOT restrict too much the outplay potential and does not make the combat too scripted and it looks like thats not the case here so i think they are doing a very good job so far.