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That "Something" that would make AoC more special

MybroViajeroMybroViajero Member
edited November 2022 in General Discussion
What do great projects or people who have had different types of success in their professional or life path throughout history have in common?
A lot of effort, dedication, tolerance, passion, never giving up, adaptation and always believing in themselves, as well as many other characteristics that make those projects or people to be outstanding projects and people in success stories through the times.


There are many examples of those people (in different sectors) or projects that have been successful throughout history:

In video games could be.
-Michael Morhaime , Naoki Yoshida , Hideo Kojima , Saturo Iwata , ID SOFTWARWE , old BLIZZARD and many others.
In series or movie projects could be
- Lord of the rings , Doctor house , Interstellar , DARK , Braveheart , and many others.
In the film and related field could be.
- Meryl Streep, Quentin Tarantino , Tom Hanks , Hans Zimmer and many others.
In sports there could be.
-Maradona, Michael Jordan, Roger Federer, Serena Williams and Detroit Pistons "Bad boys" and many others.

All of them and in many more sectors have in common the above mentioned characteristics that thanks to that they were able to achieve what they have achieved.
However, each of these people or projects have something else in common and at the same time differentiate them from the rest of the people or projects to the point where it is not noticeable but it seems that these differential characteristics belong to them.

What is different about Michael Morhaime , Hideo Kojima , Meryl Streep , Hans Zimmer , Maradona , Michael Jordan , OLD BLIZZARD , The Lord of the Rings that their competitors did not have when they started competing at the beginning of their professional careers/projects ?

They have a remarkable differentiation in small details that forged them to the point that those differentiations became a strength that boosted their professional career or projects.

Maradona was a poor boy who lived in a poor neighborhood where the only fun he had was playing soccer, thanks to that he got used to play soccer in a different way since he was a child, which helped him with a lot of effort, dedication and passion, to become the best player of his generation and one of the 2 best players in the history of soccer.


So not only the fact of differentiating yourself from the competitor will make that person or project stand out, since many people or projects differentiate themselves to stand out.
The small details that forge the person or project in its growth are those differential details that make that person or project really unique.
It is not the fact of differentiating yourself for the sake of differentiating yourself, it is the fact of differentiating yourself for something and for something, everyone can differentiate themselves but not everyone can manage to have that "SOMETHING" that makes you really different and unique.
For example, Hans Zimmer's music.
Almost every movie where Hans Zimmer composes the music has a guaranteed success or a higher % of success. Hans Zimmer helps those films to have a genuine and unique differentiating factor that helps them stand out and therefore have a higher chance of success.
What are the reasons for this?
Hans Zimmer is too good at what he does, but it is thanks to his own differential characteristics that make him good at what he does and therefore stand out and unique.


Taking into account all these differential points to be remarkable and unique:

How all this could help AoC?
How can it be done to really make future players say "Hey this is AoC"?
How can it be done to inspire future AoC players?
One should try to come up with that differential "SOMETHING" that makes a project or person really unique.
For example:
- In the gathering context you could say that many people would say , " Hey AoC is copying NW" , then the obvious move would be to try to create a different gathering than NW but currently NW has the best possible gathering in MMORPGS , so what should really be done?
THE SMALL DETAILS that would gradually make the differentiation between AoC and NW gathering noticeable would be that differential "SOMETHING" that would make AoC gathering stand out from NW gathering.
That the cutting of the tree is not so real, but something more like an AoC style tree cutting or in such a case be more real, but AoC style or that the elves have the possibility of NOT cutting the tree but the option of using its sap and from there transform it into wood or things that make them not cut the tree but get wood with a more AoC style, with that differential "SOMETHING" that AoC could bring to the cutting of the trees.


-In the context of the characters, one could say that many people might compare AoC's orcs to WOW's orcs which are practically a hallmark of WOW.
If you're competing against a multi-billion dollar company with the ability to make cinematics that create orcs that evoke an incredible and respectable image, how can you compete with that?
This is where that differential "SOMETHING" shows its versatility, if before you needed small details, now what you need is a firm iron hand that makes a 360 degree turn to create unique Orcs that do not compete with WOW Orcs, but simply do not even care because such is their differentiation that no one can say "hey this looks like WOW orcs", rather they would say "hey this is an AoC orc".
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- In the context of musical environments you could say that many people might expect AoC to have amazing music, but what does that mean?
The music that AoC has been showing so far denotes hope as there is nothing concrete yet but people are still hopeful month after month for some information and it is not that many have lost faith in the development of AoC, but many more come inspired by the work, effort and passion that its developers, so you could say that that initial music that AoC has shown denotes feelings of hope.
That is that differential "SOMETHING" that AoC has been showing with their early music and that their later music should not lose.
If Intrepid wants to make for AoC a more orchestrated, calm music or would like to make a more uncontrolled, frenetic or maybe a more balanced PvX music then so be it but that it does not lose that differential "SOMETHING" that makes AoC music the music of AoC, like the hope that the initial music that AoC has been known for emits.

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-In the context of quests , one could say that many people might say that if AoC has a very large world with very long quests ( 1 hour or more ) then those quests would make people not want to keep playing as it would be very tedious to play for so long for a single objective , ( idea taken from some discussions in the discord).
How can you fight against a person's personal boredom for something necessary in the game?
Here comes into play that differential "SOMETHING" in a more emotional sense where very long missions (if any) should evoke and have a great emotional focus so that the player not only "has to do it" but "wants to do it".
For example , Hans Zimmer's music in some moments of the movie Interstellar evoke those feelings where they make the viewer more attentive to the scenes so his music generates those feelings in the viewer that makes him "want" to watch that scene more.


Like these contexts there are many more, but the idea is there, that differential "SOMETHING" is one of the many things that could help AoC for that "hey this is AoC".

It is worth noting that Intrepid for a long time with its leaders is promoting that differential "SOMETHING" as many AoC followers realize that this project has small details that its leaders and team demonstrate month after month in the monthly updates , in comments on Discord , Reddit , Twitter or in interventions with famous streamers , where you can see that the leaders of AoC are unique people with virtues and flaws but they have a common passionate goal which is to fulfill their dream of creating the MMORPG of which they can be proud and therefore all those little details are that differential "SOMETHING" that little by little the community has been noticing and for which the community is increasingly emotionally connected with AoC.




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Comments

  • AzheraeAzherae Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    I really want to have a positive reaction to this post, as your posts are often so inspiringly positive, but...

    Most of this is just random bs...

    Most people out there who succeed are lucky survivors of some system, often a fairly rigged one. Sure, they're top 5% of whatever of their field but... beyond that... dice roll.

    Convergent game evolution usually means that everything that is done perfectly by another company should just be copied OUTRIGHT and then tweaked to fit to your game's function. Anything else is usually a waste of time unless you have a lightning-bolt style epiphany. Which most don't. Better to do what you do and let the emergent properties create something good HOPEFULLY.

    Then there was the music thing... what?

    That's basically just 'stock music'. It's very good, and 'choosing the right music for the feeling of your game' IS an incredibly important thing, so it's probably not that they just picked randomly, but it is by definition 'generic, chosen to fit the form'.

    And while I have the utmost respect for Steven's vision, passion, and bringing together many great minds to make a great game...

    At the end of the day the 'something' that separated him from 'other very dedicated Game Masters who love the genre' to 'elevate' him to Sandal Lord...

    Was about 50 million things. They were very similar, but thankfully, there were many of them.

    I probably seem WAY more cynical than I actually am, but I have a reason for it. I want people to believe in things for the right reasons, not to end up with their perspectives clouded by ethereal concepts of 'that special something' that leads to 'success' or whatever. It's this mindset that traps many people into defending things that could clearly be better with a little more thought.

    The thing that will make AoC more special is skill, time, and money. Like everything else. So... not really special exactly.
    Sorry, my native language is Erlang.
    
  • MybroViajeroMybroViajero Member
    edited November 2022
    Azherae wrote: »
    I really want to have a positive reaction to this post, as your posts are often so inspiringly positive, but...

    Most of this is just random bs...

    Most people out there who succeed are lucky survivors of some system, often a fairly rigged one. Sure, they're top 5% of whatever of their field but... beyond that... dice roll.

    Convergent game evolution usually means that everything that is done perfectly by another company should just be copied OUTRIGHT and then tweaked to fit to your game's function. Anything else is usually a waste of time unless you have a lightning-bolt style epiphany. Which most don't. Better to do what you do and let the emergent properties create something good HOPEFULLY.

    Then there was the music thing... what?

    That's basically just 'stock music'. It's very good, and 'choosing the right music for the feeling of your game' IS an incredibly important thing, so it's probably not that they just picked randomly, but it is by definition 'generic, chosen to fit the form'.

    And while I have the utmost respect for Steven's vision, passion, and bringing together many great minds to make a great game...

    At the end of the day the 'something' that separated him from 'other very dedicated Game Masters who love the genre' to 'elevate' him to Sandal Lord...

    Was about 50 million things. They were very similar, but thankfully, there were many of them.

    I probably seem WAY more cynical than I actually am, but I have a reason for it. I want people to believe in things for the right reasons, not to end up with their perspectives clouded by ethereal concepts of 'that special something' that leads to 'success' or whatever. It's this mindset that traps many people into defending things that could clearly be better with a little more thought.

    The thing that will make AoC more special is skill, time, and money. Like everything else. So... not really special exactly.

    Have you heard the story of Billy Beane ?

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  • I have a big hope that Steven's touch will add all those magical special details in the future. For now, probably we will just see the main structure and the bulk of the work for the creation of the game. Once all the main body of AOC world and systems and art is done I really really hope they start adding tons of little improvements like you say that will make this game special.

  • I don’t need ‘more.’ Delivering on their current ambitions is awesome.
    AoC+Dwarf+750v3.png
  • Azherae wrote: »
    I really want to have a positive reaction to this post, as your posts are often so inspiringly positive, but...

    Then there was the music thing... what?

    That's basically just 'stock music'. It's very good, and 'choosing the right music for the feeling of your game' IS an incredibly important thing, so it's probably not that they just picked randomly, but it is by definition 'generic, chosen to fit the form'.



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  • TL:DR?
    This link may help you: https://ashesofcreation.wiki/
  • maouwmaouw Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    daveywavey wrote: »
    TL:DR?

    TL:DR - Ashes needs a market differentiator.

    Last time I checked, this was the Node system.
    I'd be happy if this continues to be their market differentiator and they build more of the game systems around it!
    That way, when the rest of the market decides it's a good idea, Ashes has the advantage of being first-to-market.

    Go Intrepid, we're rooting for you!
    I wish I were deep and tragic
  • Ashes beeing good and fun with a big playerbase would make this game already special.

  • Ashes has the bones to be great, it comes down to fostering healthy servers. Even if only 20k people play this game by end of 6 months, if they are all on 1 server the game would still feel very vibrant at least...hopefully.

    But I think @CROW3 said it well. They are doing "enough" stuff we just need them to get it over the finish line as promised and the game will be good.
  • MybroViajeroMybroViajero Member
    edited November 2022
    Yes of course I understand all that and I share it, I really like the vision that AoC has and it has been improving over the years ,b ut I think I am being misunderstood.

    I don't pretend or want AoC to have more things but that within the things that Intrepid has in mind, such as gathering, within that they create details that show "hey this is AoC". those little "things" that are differential and create that "something" different and unique.

    For example what BearMcCreary and David Swenson says in this video


    David Swenson ( creative director)
    we wanted to do something different and for and for me there's there's always there's a bit of you know trepidation in doing something like that right because it's like oh man this is call of duty and and there's a certain you know sound that is usually associated with call of duty and we want to sort of break that
    mold and do something entirely different

    BearMcCreary
    we started this whole thing wanting to take some risks wanting to do something to change the sound to be risky bold and experimental but deep down inside i'm hoping that it just becomes part of call of duty i want them to have this emotional experience and just go oh that's what call of duty sounds like because it's a feeling more than an actual sound

    David Swenson
    it's the emotions the soul of the story and and if it can accomplish that if if players will play this game and they will feel sort of infused in these in in this story and really understand and feel the emotions of these characters and if music can help that that music can can pull people along in that storytelling then then i think it was incredibly successful.
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