Nodes and Class Fantasy

pgt1027

I was wondering how the node system might intersect with class fantasy. Specifically, two node types seem to correlate pretty strongly with two class archetype's class fantasy. Specifically, the religion node with clerics and the technology nodes with mages. It could just be a few special quests or something deeper than that, but it would be really cool as a mage-archetype class to have some kind of special interaction with the "college of mages" type buildings in technology nodes or, as a cleric-archetype class, special interactions with the temples in religion nodes.

As a side note, I really hope clerics have some sort of special relationship with the religion system in general, since that's where most of their flavor comes from and what makes them more than just "heal wizards".

Ludullu

I'd prefer there to be no connections between archetypes and social organizations. Mainly because that'll become "the meta" of those organizations. People who're playing archetypes not related to the nodes would feel bad about joining those nodes because they don't benefit as much, and people who wanna optimize their gameplay would be pushed towards joining particular nodes rather than those that they might prefer themselves.

pgt1027

NiKr wrote: »

I'd prefer there to be no connections between archetypes and social organizations. Mainly because that'll become "the meta" of those organizations. People who're playing archetypes not related to the nodes would feel bad about joining those nodes because they don't benefit as much, and people who wanna optimize their gameplay would be pushed towards joining particular nodes rather than those that they might prefer themselves.

I meant something more along the lines of unique questlines rather than distinct advantages.

Ludullu

pgt1027 wrote: »

I meant something more along the lines of unique questlines rather than distinct advantages.

But those questlines would have to have some rewards, right? And usually unique quests have unique rewards.

I guess you could just have cosmetic rewards for those quests, but I doubt they'd be seen as something special or valuable, considering that anyone of that archetype can go get the quest in their related node. And then if you tie the quest to citizenships - we're back to people being pushed onto nodes that they might dislike.

pgt1027

NiKr wrote: »

pgt1027 wrote: »

I meant something more along the lines of unique questlines rather than distinct advantages.

But those questlines would have to have some rewards, right? And usually unique quests have unique rewards.

I guess you could just have cosmetic rewards for those quests, but I doubt they'd be seen as something special or valuable, considering that anyone of that archetype can go get the quest in their related node. And then if you tie the quest to citizenships - we're back to people being pushed onto nodes that they might dislike.

I don't really see it as that big of an advantage unless the reward was a BiS item.

Dezmerizing

I get what you're saying - but your idea could have the very opposite effect of what you're wishing for because your idea assumes that everyone is using the same class fantasy for each class. If anything like this is to be included, then I'd vote for it to be part of character creation OUTSIDE of class choice (like GW2, some simple questions that affect your personal story, if there would be one - one or two related to your class and then one or two related to your selected race). Why? Because there are thousand of variants to each archetype when it comes to class fantasy!

Let's go with cleric to clarify:
Cleric that choose the Summoner subclass becomes a necromancer. What if I want to be the traditional "cleric gone bad" necromancer BUT my friend wants to be more of the ritualist-/witch doctor-type of necromancer? Our third friend wants to go the Holy Summoner-route and is eagerly waiting for skins to fulfill that fantasy. When playing the same quest line, what would the game register us as? A typical good cleric guy because of cleric? The traditional Diablo necromancer because Summoner sub-class?

Basically, my vote would be "no thanks" as I dislike any assumptions made about my character's background when it comes to MMORPG quest lines. Even CRPGs are struggling to make things right when it comes to properly involving backgrounds and individual class fantasy, so I wouldnt put it up on MMORPGs to even try.

Finally, I don't think personal quests are going to be a big thing in AoC. I might be wrong (someone please point it out if I am) - and I for one loved the SWTOR class stories - but it does not seem to be a match for the game philosophy of AoC.

pgt1027

Dezmerizing wrote: »

I get what you're saying - but your idea could have the very opposite effect of what you're wishing for because your idea assumes that everyone is using the same class fantasy for each class. If anything like this is to be included, then I'd vote for it to be part of character creation OUTSIDE of class choice (like GW2, some simple questions that affect your personal story, if there would be one - one or two related to your class and then one or two related to your selected race). Why? Because there are thousand of variants to each archetype when it comes to class fantasy!

Let's go with cleric to clarify:
Cleric that choose the Summoner subclass becomes a necromancer. What if I want to be the traditional "cleric gone bad" necromancer BUT my friend wants to be more of the ritualist-/witch doctor-type of necromancer? Our third friend wants to go the Holy Summoner-route and is eagerly waiting for skins to fulfill that fantasy. When playing the same quest line, what would the game register us as? A typical good cleric guy because of cleric? The traditional Diablo necromancer because Summoner sub-class?

Basically, my vote would be "no thanks" as I dislike any assumptions made about my character's background when it comes to MMORPG quest lines. Even CRPGs are struggling to make things right when it comes to properly involving backgrounds and individual class fantasy, so I wouldnt put it up on MMORPGs to even try.

Finally, I don't think personal quests are going to be a big thing in AoC. I might be wrong (someone please point it out if I am) - and I for one loved the SWTOR class stories - but it does not seem to be a match for the game philosophy of AoC.

Well, I think this brings me back to my note about the cleric archetype having an interaction with the religion system. In fact, iirc they mentioned that evil necromancers would be aligning themselves with evil divinities somehow, which is how you get the divide between classic evil necromancers and the more holy spiritualist necromancer.

Like I said, this was actually an important part of the class fantasy for clerics in a lot of RPGs for just the reason you stated. Want to be an evil cultist? Be a cleric devoted to an evil god, demon or demon-worshiping religion. Want to be the classic goody-goody healer cleric? Devote to one of the resident good gods or good religions. Want to have a more shamanistic cleric? Dedicate to a spirit or nature-worshiping religion. And so on. The sky is really the limit on roleplay potential provided you have the appropriate gods or religions.

So, if the clerics actually do have some kind of special relationship with the religion mechanic, I think you have a built-in and flavorful solution to this problem.