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Combinations, synergies, archetype compatibilities in AoC .
MybroViajero
Member, Alpha Two
I've always wondered why a character with a specific role, for example the tank, has to do only the job of his role and stay stuck in that job.
Why in the year 2023 a tank only needs to be a punching bag ? or a mage is obliged to have one of the highest DPS and that his contribution is only that.
It seems to me that something more interesting would be to have cooperative functions/skills that enhance, change, improve the role that one chooses for the help of a partner and that in turn could also help the Hybrid combat system.
-let's imagine that a "keeper" (Summoner + tank) has the possibility of receiving an ability from the spellhunter (mage + hunter), let's say that the spellhunter launches enchanted arrows to the area where the "keeper" is and this uses an ability to make those arrows harden and become barricades to prevent mobs from passing through that area, that kind of synergies would seem extremely interesting , It would be a game changer and would lead to unique plays.
-let's imagine that an "Apostle" ( cleric + tank ) to improve one of his group healing skills has to be hit by the lightning of an Archmage ( mage + mage ) that will cause that healing skill to be launched in the form of healing rays that besides healing raise stats of the party players or damage mobs.
A specific role that also has the potential to do/generate different things thanks to the combination/synergy of skills with another player.
Many possibilities of combinations, synergies, generation of potential plays, differentiations, interesting plays, innovative possibilities, but above all many possibilities to add fun things to the already known roles.
Why in the year 2023 a tank only needs to be a punching bag ? or a mage is obliged to have one of the highest DPS and that his contribution is only that.
It seems to me that something more interesting would be to have cooperative functions/skills that enhance, change, improve the role that one chooses for the help of a partner and that in turn could also help the Hybrid combat system.
For example:Combinations, synergies, compatibilities of archetypes for the hybrid combat system
-let's imagine that a "keeper" (Summoner + tank) has the possibility of receiving an ability from the spellhunter (mage + hunter), let's say that the spellhunter launches enchanted arrows to the area where the "keeper" is and this uses an ability to make those arrows harden and become barricades to prevent mobs from passing through that area, that kind of synergies would seem extremely interesting , It would be a game changer and would lead to unique plays.
-let's imagine that an "Apostle" ( cleric + tank ) to improve one of his group healing skills has to be hit by the lightning of an Archmage ( mage + mage ) that will cause that healing skill to be launched in the form of healing rays that besides healing raise stats of the party players or damage mobs.
A specific role that also has the potential to do/generate different things thanks to the combination/synergy of skills with another player.
Many possibilities of combinations, synergies, generation of potential plays, differentiations, interesting plays, innovative possibilities, but above all many possibilities to add fun things to the already known roles.
1
Comments
I'm glad Steven thought of it, looking forward to seeing it in action in Alpha-2.
But to clear up some stuff, a mage/ranger wouldn't be shooting arrows but magic stuff, cause their base abilities come from the mage.
And the cleric/tank is not a tank. It's a cleric that will have some tanky augments, so calling it a "tank Apostle" seems a bit wrong to me.
out of jokes, thank you, the truth is that I had not noticed, the augments seem interesting to me and may also be something to consider for synergies, compatibility.
A lot of potential for archetypes/classes.
I remember back in L2 (which was somewhat rudimentary compared to what Stephen is doing) I was able to put together some unusual combinations onto my Cardinal (a healer very weak in PvP) such that there were some PvP classes, such as daggers, who I could often beat in the monthly PvP arena contests.
This was made a bit easier because so many people imitate what is advertised as the 'best build' rather than trying to figure things out for themselves.
I get the idea in general and am not opposed completely but, again, it seems what we will get with Ashes is a game that focuses on Strong Class Identity - which I am not sure you took into account. A primary Cleric with a Tank augmentation is not a tank. It's a healer with some augmentation to his Cleric abilities that enhance defense. The primary class you pick will determine the role(s) you can take on in a group and from all we know it won't change due to an augmentation and there won't be completely new skills to acquire from an augmentation.
With that being said: Synergies are absolutely a brilliant idea to give players and the classes they choose a bigger impact in a group setting, as seen in the day-night-cycle showcase between the Fighter and the Cleric. And having combos like that across the board will be what makes group content not only more fun and socially engaging but also more important. In certain dungeons with a lot of small creatures, you will probably want especially the strong AoE synergies.
If a lighting AoE spell of an Archemage could power other magic classes skills that would be awesome, though. And I'd love to see some nasty one target synergy, where Tanks can get 100% crit chance or double the CC duration on targets the Rouge has poisoned beforehand.
Absolutely agree, I would love to see different combinations of attacks/skills that different aqueotypes and classes could do.
Of course this all remains in a very low expectation, I do not want to think of super long wombo combos just I would like to see combinations of attacks/skills, synergies between 1 or two .
Great point, @tautau.
To add to this, I personally hope Steven and the Intrepid Combat Team mix it up with different raid requirements for different bosses.
Not all bosses should be a faceroll for players deciding to go all in on dual secondaries (Tank-Tank; Cleric-Cleric).
A few (not all) boss mechanics should be harder for players in dual roles and easier for players that chose a different secondary archetype.
An example would be a boss mechanic penalty when an overhealing threshold is reached.
Augments, as described, are not just flavor. That will be part of it, but the plan is that they will change your skills enough to matter. A short-ranged attack turned into a snipe. In some cases they "drastically change the ability", and in other cases "they are creating entirely new skills" but "keep obviously some identity with what that primary active ability was". They're not just going to make a fireball turn from blue to red, or add a sparkly trail to a charging attack.
But my expectation is that they won't all be that dramatic (as the developers have hinted) and certainly you are not going to get "80% of the 2nd classes abilities". And they won't actually be "64 classes" even though they have chosen that misleading label.
I agree with you that I'd love it if they were that strong. I don't expect them to be. But I do expect them to matter. I don't expect a Cleric/Tank to become a Tank, or become a third thing that is extremely distinct from Clerics and Tanks. But I do expect you to be able to make your Cleric very Tanky.
This is what I imagine augments will be like. Let's say you are playing a Rogue and you like it overall but have frustrations. You like the stealth and the overall feel of the class, but having to get in close is annoying. You're not particularly tough, so you wade into a group using stealth, pop out and try to burn them down, but you consistently end such fights barely hanging on because you are so squishy and you have a lot of downtime as you recover from each encounter. In a lot of games you reroll a different character, or do a full respec, or just grit your teeth and live with it. But maybe in this game you don't have to. Instead you can...
1) Take Ranger as your second archetype, and snipe at people from ranged stealth, so you can whittle them down immensely before you get close enough to be hurt.
2) Take Tank as your second archetype, and boost your defenses through augments so that you end the fight with more health.
3) Take Cleric as your second archetype, and do self-healing during the fight to keep your health up.
4) Take Mage as your second archetype, and freeze enemies so they can't gang up on you.
5) Take Summoner as your second archetype, and summon a shadow creature companion that helps keep some of the enemies off of you so that you don't take as much damage.
That's the kind of thing I expect from the class system. They can help mitigate some of the weaknesses, or enhance an archetype's strengths, all while adding some extra flavor.