What kind of dungeons do you like?

Arya_Yeshe

Tell us what dungeons did you like from other games.

I liked Fractals quit a lot, from Guild Wars 2, because in Fractals you can't survive just by having a good party composition, good gear and spamming skills. This is because in Fractals you have to be aware of the surroundings at all times and each dungeon early on will bring you the mechanics about that particular dungeon with mini-bosses, mechanisms and traps. In fractals anything can kill your entire party

Fractals feels like you are getting yourself into the dungeon olympics. I like those dungeons full of mechanisms trying to kill you, stuff to be activated or you die, lots of traps, lots of dodging and jumping. It's almost as if the dungeon itself is angry at you

In Fractals, the decisive momments are very punctuated, when shit will go down there's voices announcing stuff, there's big and loud machinery starting to work, or something big jumps to your platform, etc... in Fractals there's no way you will get sleeply

Entering a Fractal feels like entering a trap base, just like those trap bases in RUST and other games

Birthday

Fractals sounds very fun.

I really like Remnants from the Ashes. It gives every boss a very unique personality and require very different approaches to win.

I hate it when all raids feel pretty much the same - have good gear and spam abilities. Thats something i noticed about most dungeons and MMOs to be true. Or they all require pretty much the aame approaches

Ludullu

L2's dungeons with some additional mechanics.

Azherae

Dungeons with ecology where it feels like the mobs in it actually could live there normally, with the bosses being the guards, protectors, mutant superorganisms, or hierarchy.

Dungeons that are too large sometimes break my immersion, because I'm picky.

Mechanics don't matter as much, I like variance there, particularly if it matches the mobs.

Random groups of enemies just standing there waiting for me to kill them for loot or run through them on the way to the designated 'boss room' just tends to make me want to go play a MOBA.

Well, to avoid going into another FFXI-rant...

My favorite 'dungeons' in BDO for this purpose are Pila Ku Jail, Roud Sulfur Mine, and to some extent Gahaz Bandit Lair.

Most others feel utterly unrealistic, and honestly Gahaz would fall into that too if I didn't accept that BDO's design requires that there be thousands of bandits just so the gameplay 'works'.

Arya_Yeshe

WoW''s dungeons high point is the atmosphere, I remember the Scarlet Monastery had mobs whispiring about torturing you and finding your dirtiest secrets, they used to say that in a pervy way, I think those voices were removed from the game. This was in Vanilla Wow, then much later when I played TBC, I don't remember hearing those voices in that dungeon anymore.

In Wow, the The Culling Of Stratholme was just amazing, the atmosphere again was as good as if it was done by George Lucas, lmao

Shadowfang Keep and Karazhan were amazing too

What was great about WoW dungeons, to me, it was almost always the atmosphere and the mobs looked like they really lived there, the mobs were well settled in and this made a huge difference in the atmosphere.

I'm not a huge fan of WoW dungeons tough, it had too many wipes, too many mob pulls, you could go afk if you weren't in the boss... and it was EXTREMELY GEAR BASED.

Lash

Lived in atmosphere. No gamified speed runs with a loot chest at the end where that is the only loot in the entire thing. No literal trash mobs that drop nothing. Rare spawn mobs or gatherables. Large and sprawling (non-linear) with secret or alternate pathing. Lore/story is shown not told.

-T0Mb-

Arya_Yeshe wrote: »

WoW''s dungeons high point is the atmosphere, I remember the Scarlet Monastery had mobs whispiring about torturing you and finding your dirtiest secrets, they used to say that in a pervy way, I think those voices were removed from the game. This was in Vanilla Wow, then much later when I played TBC, I don't remember hearing those voices in that dungeon anymore.

In Wow, the The Culling Of Stratholme was just amazing, the atmosphere again was as good as if it was done by George Lucas, lmao

Shadowfang Keep and Karazhan were amazing too

What was great about WoW dungeons, to me, it was almost always the atmosphere and the mobs looked like they really lived there, the mobs were well settled in and this made a huge difference in the atmosphere.

I'm not a huge fan of WoW dungeons tough, it had too many wipes, too many mob pulls, you could go afk if you weren't in the boss... and it was EXTREMELY GEAR BASED.

You said very well about the atmosphere!

I loved Vanilla WoW's dungeons especially low level dungeons.
Wailing Caverns, The Deadmines and Shadowfang Keep were my favorites!

Chicago

Subway and twmple of three winds from anarchy online, super old game but really fun!

McShave

I like dungeons that tell a story about the world that you are in. WoW is a good example for those.

One thing I cannot get over is the open world pvp aspect of the dungeons. I don't know how that will affect the average player's dungeon experience. Depending on how heavy you get corruption, players might have a default stance of dont fight other parties. Or it might be a pvp fest 24/7 in there. I'm hoping for some middle ground. How the pvp plays out will determine what kind of dungeon layout is best, the difficulty of boss fights, how many mobs are in the dungeon, etc.

Also, I would like dungeons to be a meeting place for players. For example, when you go to a dungeon, you will meet many players sitting outside the dungeon waiting for party members or looking for a party. This would give the server a sense of community and over time you may start remembering other player's names and characters.

Arya_Yeshe

McShave wrote: »

I like dungeons that tell a story about the world that you are in. WoW is a good example for those.

One thing I cannot get over is the open world pvp aspect of the dungeons. I don't know how that will affect the average player's dungeon experience. Depending on how heavy you get corruption, players might have a default stance of dont fight other parties. Or it might be a pvp fest 24/7 in there. I'm hoping for some middle ground. How the pvp plays out will determine what kind of dungeon layout is best, the difficulty of boss fights, how many mobs are in the dungeon, etc.

Also, I would like dungeons to be a meeting place for players. For example, when you go to a dungeon, you will meet many players sitting outside the dungeon waiting for party members or looking for a party. This would give the server a sense of community and over time you may start remembering other player's names and characters.

Well, in AoC 80% of the dungeons will be open-world and 20% instanced, that's what the wiki says.

To me it is pretty annoying having pockets with no mobs and random people running around doing random things. I'm not worried about the PvP part tough, since Corruption is overly punitive.

Once I created a new concept never seen before in any game called "gated dungeons" that could potentially balanc things out in open world dungeons:
https://forums.ashesofcreation.com/discussion/54431/gated-dungeons-a-new-concept

But I'm not an Intrepid dev, so my opinion is not that important

Ludullu

McShave wrote: »

Or it might be a pvp fest 24/7 in there.

Yes

Gospell

Arya_Yeshe wrote: »

Well, in AoC 80% of the dungeons will be open-world and 20% instanced, that's what the wiki says.

Just an awesome solution that has been making me happy for a long time. I hope these 20% are just singleplayer quests.

Arya_Yeshe wrote: »

To me it is pretty annoying having pockets with no mobs

What game are you talking about? For example, in L2, if you farm a spot too quickly, then the mobs start spawning faster, an incredibly convenient system, right? )

Arya_Yeshe wrote: »

and random people running around doing random things.

People always and everywhere do strange things, it doesn't matter if it's a dungeon or something else, it doesn't depend on anything

Arya_Yeshe wrote: »

I'm not worried about the PvP part tough, since Corruption is overly punitive.

People don't care about punitive. People want fun and they get it. This is fck awesome by the way....
And no one canceled twinks) So you should be afraid xD

Arya_Yeshe wrote: »

Once I created a new concept never seen before in any game called "gated dungeons" that could potentially balanc things out in open world dungeons:

In all options, I saw only "We are the first, please developers protect us from other groups or pvp player, because we want to safely kill mobs"
You write that the idea is not security? But this is not so, you propose to protect the first group.
I'll tell you that the strongest wins and if the spot is busy just pick it up, you can't pick it up, then go to another place and become stronger, find your group / clan and already go back there and pick up the spot. The whole point of MMOs is competition, no need to come up with some tricky mechanics and simplify the game, there are already enough casual MMOs

Arya_Yeshe wrote: »

But I'm not an Intrepid dev, so my opinion is not that important

To be honest, no offense. I'm glad you're not one of the developers

Drachenpaladin

Ther sould be bosses with actual mechanics - like big AOE zones with %damage and some abilitys that HAVE to be interruptet/Blocked. If every enemy is just an other meatshield it feels just boring to fight them and the only one thats have to work would be the healer.

Terrifying_Truth

Diablo 2 - Monastery Barracks


Diablo 2 - Arcana Sanctuary

Dezmerizing

Arya_Yeshe wrote: »

WoW''s dungeons high point is the atmosphere, I remember the Scarlet Monastery had mobs whispiring about torturing you and finding your dirtiest secrets, they used to say that in a pervy way, I think those voices were removed from the game. This was in Vanilla Wow, then much later when I played TBC, I don't remember hearing those voices in that dungeon anymore.

Ah Yes. Interrogator Vidgas from SM graveyard c: ... "Tell me... Tell me everything!" "Naughty secrets!" "I'll rip the secrets from your flesh!"
... Yeah, the dude is really one of the best examples of voice acting that WoW has. I still remember his tone/voice clearly, despite it being so many years ago. :'] and I mean, it is almost as iconic as: "Arise, my champion!" - "At your side, my lady!"

I have very fond memories of the *music* in old WoW Dungeons. Shadowfang Keep and Karazhan in particular had amazing soundtracks that really put the mood i the right place when you went there. I really hope Ashes audio team can deliver some amazing music and ambience in general!!!

Arya_Yeshe

@Dezmerizing haha yesss! Interrogator Vidgas

I am curious about who at Blizzard is responsible for creating the atmospheric experience of WoW's dungeons. I wonder if they drew inspiration from techniques used in movies, books, theater, or other. However, I decided to stop playing WoW because the game required an excessive amount of grinding, even for PvP, which would have taken years to achieve

Dezmerizing

@Arya_Yeshe - I'd like to believe all of the above contribute to these masterpieces! I listen a lot to game music composers (and I use them when I DM TT-rpgs), including some from WoWs team ... Unfortunately I do not know who made the SFK or Karazhan theme. :C

My favorite game composer of all time is Justin Bell (Pillars of Eternity) - his music is basically what made PoE my favorite game of all time!

Yulivee

Yeah, some of the early WoW Dungeons were amazing.
But I really disliked the one-way-road dungeons that became the standard later on. Imho it is ok to have some of these (especially for beginners) but I cannot state enought how great the dungeons were that felt like real open places where your group was able to find their own way.
Shadowfang Keep was great (you could even see the surounding area or jump from the walls) and the BlackrockDepths (BRD) were the height of dungeon design if you ask me. This thing was a whole city underground with interconnections everywhere. Dozens of quests an own faction and the thing was even the way to the first raid (MoltenCore) and the only place to smelt a certain ore. Simply great.
Not just a "go in, follow the way while killing everything on it, get loot, leave" thing.

akabear

Hope one day there will be an MMO with dungeons similar to how Everquest Next were proposing.

From memory, but happy to be wrong, the dungeons were somewhat player determined. And even if the memory is not quite correct, still would want similar.

Through player mining the dungeons were dug out and as they increased in size so did what would be found and inhabited. Got larger and perhaps larger mobs and bosses would inhabit and fortunes found. Go deeper and the risk and reward increased.

That kind of dungeon, I would like to see, player crafted with all the trappings of a dungeon / mine perhaps prepared from materials gathered elsewhere and crafted in town and brought into the dungeon / mine to enhance and build! (bridges, gates, drawbridges, reinforcement, paths etc)

Arya_Yeshe

akabear wrote: »

That kind of dungeon, I would like to see, player crafted with all the trappings of a dungeon / mine perhaps prepared from materials gathered elsewhere and crafted in town and brought into the dungeon / mine to enhance and build! (bridges, gates, drawbridges, reinforcement, paths etc)

This sounds amazing!

Remembers me a bit of that single player game, Dungeon Keeper, I have Dungeon Keeper 1 and 2 on Steam and finished both again not a long time ago. Both are still great games even for 2023.

Roxi

I would like to see at least one dungeon that appeared at a high level of Nod development in the form of a "conditionally impassable" dungeon deep into -100 ... -1000 ... -100000 floors. So that all over the world of Verra, legends would circulate about a group of adventurers who were able to descend below everyone and explore.
and then there would be another unit that managed to break this record. and to take refuge in the bowels of the PK... to smell the danger in the air. So the life of an adventurer is worth nothing there. There were ambushes, traps and rivers of blood. So only there you can find the dust of a rare resource.

Arya_Yeshe

Roxi wrote: »

I would like to see at least one dungeon that appeared at a high level of Nod development in the form of a "conditionally impassable" dungeon deep into -100 ... -1000 ... -100000 floors. So that all over the world of Verra, legends would circulate about a group of adventurers who were able to descend below everyone and explore.
and then there would be another unit that managed to break this record. and to take refuge in the bowels of the PK... to smell the danger in the air. So the life of an adventurer is worth nothing there. There were ambushes, traps and rivers of blood. So only there you can find the dust of a rare resource.

THIS

Terrifying_Truth

Roxi wrote: »

I would like to see at least one dungeon that appeared at a high level of Nod development in the form of a "conditionally impassable" dungeon deep into -100 ... -1000 ... -100000 floors. So that all over the world of Verra, legends would circulate about a group of adventurers who were able to descend below everyone and explore.
and then there would be another unit that managed to break this record. and to take refuge in the bowels of the PK... to smell the danger in the air. So the life of an adventurer is worth nothing there. There were ambushes, traps and rivers of blood. So only there you can find the dust of a rare resource.

I just arrived in the AoC community and I am trying to keep up with the massive amounts of information and ideas.

Hands down, this idea was the one that caught my attention. Would be really great if a dungeon opens up when a node reaches maximum level and this dungeon could have a thousand floors, it should be unbeatable.

Good job!

Roxi

Roxi wrote: »

I would like to see at least one dungeon that appeared at a high level of Nod development in the form of a "conditionally impassable" dungeon deep into -100 ... -1000 ... -100000 floors. So that all over the world of Verra, legends would circulate about a group of adventurers who were able to descend below everyone and explore.
and then there would be another unit that managed to break this record. and to take refuge in the bowels of the PK... to smell the danger in the air. So the life of an adventurer is worth nothing there. There were ambushes, traps and rivers of blood. So only there you can find the dust of a rare resource.

groups that have been able to penetrate the deepest into the dungeon will be able to record using the "cartographer" profession to record the area explored and sell the map in Nod. So that the other group, using the one who can read this card, does not drive themselves into a dead end ...

Arya_Yeshe

Roxi wrote: »

Roxi wrote: »

I would like to see at least one dungeon that appeared at a high level of Nod development in the form of a "conditionally impassable" dungeon deep into -100 ... -1000 ... -100000 floors. So that all over the world of Verra, legends would circulate about a group of adventurers who were able to descend below everyone and explore.
and then there would be another unit that managed to break this record. and to take refuge in the bowels of the PK... to smell the danger in the air. So the life of an adventurer is worth nothing there. There were ambushes, traps and rivers of blood. So only there you can find the dust of a rare resource.

groups that have been able to penetrate the deepest into the dungeon will be able to record using the "cartographer" profession to record the area explored and sell the map in Nod. So that the other group, using the one who can read this card, does not drive themselves into a dead end ...

A dungeon that big would be a ton of work for Intrepid, what if this dungeon could be accessed by all T6 nodes? I would rather having one massive fantastic dungeon with 1000 floors, than having 85 dungeons with 15 floors.

Also, it would be hilarious entering the same dungeon from many places around the world, just to find it infested with enemy guilds and enemy node citizens

If there was a dwarven city deep inside, would be cool having storages that can never be destroyed.

Ehrgeiz

WoW classic had the best dungeons ever and BRD was the peak.

Heljy

Ehrgeiz wrote: »

WoW classic had the best dungeons ever and BRD was the peak.

Thank you ! :') what nostalgic memories. That said, I recently did all the Classis + BC dungeons with a friend. It was very cool but a bit dated and lifeless. That says what atmosphere and consistency in the environments