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Phase I of Alpha Two testing will occur on weekends. Each weekend is scheduled to start on Fridays at 10 AM PT and end on Sundays at 10 PM PT. Find out more here.
Check out Alpha Two Announcements here to see the latest Alpha Two news and update notes.
Our quickest Alpha Two updates are in Discord. Testers with Alpha Two access can chat in Alpha Two channels by connecting your Discord and Intrepid accounts here.
When was Rogue reveal supposed to be?
Rym
Member, Alpha Two
I know it was meant to be after Mage, either the very next livestream or after the world boss preview.
The mage reveal looked neat, but left me somewhat disappointed in the playstyle of the mage and with a lot of concerns about it's viability in PvP.
As I'm either maining assassins or mages in my games I'm very interested in seeing the rogue reveal. Was it meant to be this month or next month?
The mage reveal looked neat, but left me somewhat disappointed in the playstyle of the mage and with a lot of concerns about it's viability in PvP.
As I'm either maining assassins or mages in my games I'm very interested in seeing the rogue reveal. Was it meant to be this month or next month?
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Comments
It will ambush us when we least expect it.
Out of nowhere, it will crit our heart.
Can I invite you to explain why it wouldn't be viable in PvP?
I thought much the same thing. Seems mostly a glass cannon with little defense. The Ice abilities that can lead to rooting, Sleep for CC (seems weak for PvP IMO), and shield bubble. Dont seem to be enough to deal with players kits that have high DPS and ground closing skills.
For me, I would like to see Blink for instance to drop a snare AoE at the point of launch. (Maybe that will come with sub classes) For a PvP game, the Mage kit really lacks much for dealing with what a mage would face in PvP. Focus fire. All the PvP games I have played, healers and highest end DPS always get focus fired. Quick and easy to kill with the fastest way to change the battle outcome. I just didnt see anything that made me go, ya that class will rock in PvP.
Can you please point to current classes in the game that can blow mage up like a glass cannon and has more chase? Please mention the skills they are using to do that.
This is purely my my 20+ years off MMO experience. Let me turn it around. What in the Mage makes you think it would be awesome in large scale PvP encounters? 10-100 people encounters? Also, are you saying its not a Glass Cannon? If yes, what in the demo of the class makes you think that?
My 20+ years of experience says we need to see the full kit and not a lvl 15 mage... My experience says in any mmorpg a lvl 15 is not giving an idea of what any class can do for serious concerns.
I get i follow the game too much but based on what they are saying you can go mage/ tank which pushes you more towards the tank archetype meaning you are going to have more skills that will make you tanky. Even with your suggestion about blink having more effects is already inline with what they have said the game will work when you have access to your actual class.Right now we aren't seeing the classes we get, which wont be until we see mage / tank, cleric/mage etc.
Rather then assuming things won't work and trying to compare end game mmorpgs to what you see from a lvl 15 without seeing the in game classes. Mention things you would like to see added to combat issues you could see in the future or tools you might like the mage to have. You don't need to come from a negative angle to start a conversation.
That isnt more or less what you said.
Before you start writing off entire classes, @nanfoodle, remember these showcases are still of a game that’s in Alpha.
As always, Steven gave full disclosure in the stream that there’s still plenty of balancing to do … especially around group play.
Whether players want to listen to Steven is a topic for another separate discussion.
Yep, would like to see Bard too. Seeing it before Rogue would be even better.
Let me help you, as I said a few posts ago "(Maybe that will come with sub classes)"
The team is working hard on the Rogue archetype, and is excited to show it off as soon as it's ready! We haven't announced any dates for when we'll feature the Rogue on a livestream, so stay tuned to our socials for when the day comes!
Not writing anything off, as you said we have not seen the entire package. Again, I'm just agreeing with the OP. What we seen so far does not lend much to PvP.
The orb spell alone is very very strong for group pvp. It alone will make the mage viable if the damage is any bit competitive.
I see the mage taking on a more traditional role in PvP - the glass cannon on the back line being protected by a melee fighter who can keep enemies from getting to the caster too quickly. Find the right time to cast a shield, run in, get off a blizzard while another player slows the enemy, blink out and go back to ranged attacks. That kind of thing. It’ll be a bit more methodical than modern solo mage play, I think.
The post you quoted and then said that it is "more or less what you said" was saying that first and foremost, we have seen a showcase of an alpha build of the class, with the notion of subclasses being thrown in as an afterthought.
The only comment I made in regards to the word "afterthought" was in relation to you adding in your thoughts about mage subclasses after presenting the bulk of your thoughts - making those comments of yours an afterthought.
Taking a leaf from you, feel free to quote me where I said that you said anything about PvP being an afterthought.
Do you have any mode where you dont attack peoples comments and instead ask questions or have conversations? I have said many things on the Mage class I would like to see added or improved. Do you have any suggestions or feedback on what I hope gets added to the class. Or you just here for semantics? Cuse, I dont see that helping the devs make a better game. Im not here to be a forum warrior. You can play that with someone else.
Well, I have a few thoughts on that.
First, skills are something like 50% of a characters overall strength. Just because there is no wide array of defensive skills doesn't mean they pop on touch. Especially when wearing a good plate armor or so.
Second, the game is not balanced yet, but it is also not meant to be balanced from a 1v1 perspective. Instead we probably have to consider how much synergy the mage will have with other classes to increase his survival chances when meeting his natural enemies - assassin types.
Third, if we take the 1v1 perspective, the mage has more than enough mobility to and fire power to keep a bruiser archetype at arms length and chunk them down with combos. Rock-paper-scissors, for now, seems to apply.
Fourth, we haven't seen the full skill kit. Not only because at least one element has been missing (fire) but also because the character display as far as I am aware the skills shown were not representative for what the mage skill set would in total be composed of at lets say lv 15, as this was the level prior reveals have been allocated at. The skills were specifically chosen to primarily display the elemental status mechanics.
And lastly, it seems worth remembering that we have to exclude the possible effects things like talents have on skills. I wouldn't be surprised if mobility skill cooldowns, ranges or e.g. slow from chill stacks could be added by investing talent points into those skills. We haven't seen any of this yet and I suspect we won't until A2.
Suffice to say, the showcase might not be the best foundation on which to make that judgement, even though I understand that you would want to do so. This imo was not a FULL class reveal but a base mechanics reveal, just like with all the others prior.
Agreed. Yet IS asks for feedback and has a thread enterally for that. I wish they had went a little deeper into some of the things you mentioned, as I have allot of questions in that area as well.
For me, I am not a big 1v1 player. Im all about large encounters, like in ESO Cyrodiil and DAoC Battle Grounds. Most of my feedback is towards that area of game play. Where classes like this are either too powerful or just a fly to swat out of the way.
I dont agree with your feedback that you think the Mage has solid mobility, as I think that where is at its weakest. Correct me if I am wrong but one Blink spell does not make solid Mobility. If I remember right, with my WoW Mage, I had Blink and my Strider ability to get away, both on different timers. I also had a few skills that snared or rooted. Cone of cold, Ice Spells (all had snare or root) as well. And it was allot to keep melee classes off my toes and most PvP games I have played gave them Wizard/Mage classes just as many options. I just dont see that here but as you said, maybe that comes from other areas.
Okay, I might need to clarify this further. "Mobility" in a character referred to them being able to move, which includes skills but is not limited to it. And without this being a separate point, I say again that it made sense to only show 1 mobility skill because the showcase was about the elemental empowerment mechanics, rather than a full explanation of the full skill set. Positioning will be key with a mage of that I am pretty sure and that is because they have superior damage potential but they obviously sacrifice defense for that and some mobility, which puts them below other classes without becoming the bottom in terms of mobility.
"Solid mobility" meant that full leveled Mages will probably 2-3 mobility skills, are able to move even during channeled skills and have passive CC elements to. I think that provides some decent mobility when looking at other classes like the tank or the cleric.
And honestly, I am not sure what the expectation is here. A mage with the damage potential of that class can't have mobility like a rouge or fighter, that would break the games balance. So even though I agree that the mage will be probably in the middle range when it comes to mobility, I think that is exactly where good game design should put them, since there cant be a good game with classes that have no weaknesses.
IMO secondary and augments are going to add significant depth to skills. For example, what if a Mage/Rogue has an augment to Blink that stealths you for 2-3 seconds after it moves you. PvP viability goes from "meh" to "Whoa!"
You simply miss the whole picture. Mobility can be gained by taking away someone elses that's being a threat. I'm talking about the entire tool kit shown, not just the single blink spell. As a whole and as someone who has played many Mage type classes in PvP and PvE. This Ashes Mage looks like something I would be happy to play in PvE. My feedback to IS, I don't see it as yet, a class that will shine in PvP.
IMHO I think it would be better designed that way from the ground up, as this is a PvX game, over (and let me be clear) adding it latter with skill trees and sub classes. To do that, you would need to tweek just a little bit. PvP games that don't design all their classes with that in mind. Fail as a whole or some classes are just ignored. Like the DAoC Paladin, no one played one end game.
Not yet, no.
I'll wait until I am hands on with it. By doing that, I am waiting until the class is in a state Intrepid want consider viable to play, and I am not forming any opinions based on how the class looks (which I don't care about), but rather will form my entire opinion based on how the class plays (which I do care about).
To me, this seems logical.
Intrepid have already shown a willingness to trash something if it isn't working, so any argument that alpha 2 is too late holds no weight.
Honestly, the notion of having an opinion on the progress of any class in Ashes at this point is just baffling to me.
Lol