Ashes Of Creation Content Release

With soo much promised for ashes such as far as systems and content; How would you feel about some promised features not being available at launch, but added in future free base game updates. This is assuming it’s nothing major like naval content, an archetype, or nodes for example would be missing.
There’s obvious drawbacks to this as we’ve seen major developers neglect a game at release with a promise to fix it later (insert game example here). Games that just needed a little more time in the oven.
There’s also the consensus that so many of AOCs systems are interconnected and rely on one another by brilliant design.
However what if it was small systems such as combat pets as a rough example.
NOTE: This is not something I’m asking for or wanting, but felt it was a good topic of discussion as I feel that if AOC releases with even 75% of what it’s promised, it’ll be better than most (if not all) games on the market.
-Nyce

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Comments

Azherae

For me, Combat Pets are, in fact, the thing I'd be fine to do without.

Even if they were 'cheap' to make, conceptually, if they actually help at all, and aren't specifically a class feature, then I feel like they'd be among the most chaotic and troublesome contributors to balance issues, and take up a lot of time.

But I don't have a strong basis for this perception other than intuition and some experiences that I really don't think apply to this specific thing.

NyceGaming

OlympusBurns wrote: »

The Ranger archetype. I’m not really interested in it and I don’t know anyone who wants it. Pretty useless class imo.

Lol I can’t tell if you’re being serious

NyceGaming

Jamation wrote: »

The log out button. I don't see why I would need it.

🔥 👏 AGREED

NyceGaming

Raven016 wrote: »

There is nothing I would delay.
Every feature may be important for someone.
They already excluded hardcore PvE and PvPers with the PvX approach. At least the middle layer should have no reason to leave to another MMO.

But wouldn’t pvx be INCLUSIVE of both?

OlympusBurns

NyceGaming wrote: »

OlympusBurns wrote: »

The Ranger archetype. I’m not really interested in it and I don’t know anyone who wants it. Pretty useless class imo.

Lol I can’t tell if you’re being serious

Hah goteeeem

Dygz

I mean... "Naval Content" was a Kickstarter add-on.
I think the way it's been implemented, Open Seas has to be available at launch.
If Nodes are not avialable at launch - the game inherently fails.

RocketFarmer

Ashes isn’t beholden to a board. It will release with the systems and features that are ready when they decide they are ready for release.

I think Alpha 2 will be used to determine what is going to be in the release and what comes later. They’ve already indicated what won’t be in the Alpha 2 launch. Some of those things at Alpha 2 launch may not make it to release, and some things added in after Alpha 2 launch may. No way to predict what will be in or out at this point for release - except the no-brained features that make Ashes a viable MMORPG. Nodes is obviously one of those since it’s what separates Ashes from other games. But an Alpha is an Alpha for a reason. Just like a writer, you have to kill your darlings if they just don’t fit the story.

Raven016

NyceGaming wrote: »

Raven016 wrote: »

There is nothing I would delay.
Every feature may be important for someone.
They already excluded hardcore PvE and PvPers with the PvX approach. At least the middle layer should have no reason to leave to another MMO.

But wouldn’t pvx be INCLUSIVE of both?

No. When Steven was asked what AoC does to retain WoW and FFIV players, he said 'that's the rub' is a PvX game.

But that hardcore PvPers will not like PvX is my opinion. Maybe the deep ocean could offer something but is not the core game.

Depraved

im a hardcore pvper and i like pvx.

i guess there are different types of hardcore pvpers

Mag7spy

Raven016 wrote: »

NyceGaming wrote: »

Raven016 wrote: »

There is nothing I would delay.
Every feature may be important for someone.
They already excluded hardcore PvE and PvPers with the PvX approach. At least the middle layer should have no reason to leave to another MMO.

But wouldn’t pvx be INCLUSIVE of both?

No. When Steven was asked what AoC does to retain WoW and FFIV players, he said 'that's the rub' is a PvX game.

But that hardcore PvPers will not like PvX is my opinion. Maybe the deep ocean could offer something but is not the core game.

This is something people try to say to push for more PvE and reduce pvp. Hardcore pvpers want pvx, and are not taken back by corruption and needing to guild dec for wars and more focused pvp.

This is what we prefer, unlimited pvp isn't what most people want as it brings issues. Every game has limits to control how much of it happens so you don't get a high lvl camping the starting area and killing everyone without limits.

Raven016

Mag7spy wrote: »

Raven016 wrote: »

NyceGaming wrote: »

Raven016 wrote: »

There is nothing I would delay.
Every feature may be important for someone.
They already excluded hardcore PvE and PvPers with the PvX approach. At least the middle layer should have no reason to leave to another MMO.

But wouldn’t pvx be INCLUSIVE of both?

No. When Steven was asked what AoC does to retain WoW and FFIV players, he said 'that's the rub' is a PvX game.

But that hardcore PvPers will not like PvX is my opinion. Maybe the deep ocean could offer something but is not the core game.

This is something people try to say to push for more PvE and reduce pvp. Hardcore pvpers want pvx, and are not taken back by corruption and needing to guild dec for wars and more focused pvp.

I was not saying it to push in any direction.
But we will see soon what happens and how Steven will balance the game.

Solvryn

Raven016 wrote: »

NyceGaming wrote: »

Raven016 wrote: »

There is nothing I would delay.
Every feature may be important for someone.
They already excluded hardcore PvE and PvPers with the PvX approach. At least the middle layer should have no reason to leave to another MMO.

But wouldn’t pvx be INCLUSIVE of both?

No. When Steven was asked what AoC does to retain WoW and FFIV players, he said 'that's the rub' is a PvX game.

But that hardcore PvPers will not like PvX is my opinion. Maybe the deep ocean could offer something but is not the core game.

I've been hardcore at PvE and PvP before WoW or FF14.

So I'm not sure what you mean, really I don't consider either of those titles hardcore.

Raven016

Solvryn wrote: »

Raven016 wrote: »

NyceGaming wrote: »

Raven016 wrote: »

There is nothing I would delay.
Every feature may be important for someone.
They already excluded hardcore PvE and PvPers with the PvX approach. At least the middle layer should have no reason to leave to another MMO.

But wouldn’t pvx be INCLUSIVE of both?

No. When Steven was asked what AoC does to retain WoW and FFIV players, he said 'that's the rub' is a PvX game.

But that hardcore PvPers will not like PvX is my opinion. Maybe the deep ocean could offer something but is not the core game.

I've been hardcore at PvE and PvP before WoW or FF14.

So I'm not sure what you mean, really I don't consider either of those titles hardcore.

That was a miscalculation. Maybe I shouldn't have used the word hardcore.
Now I have to face the players who love AoC and consider themselves hardcore

I meant to say that there are players who want just PvP (no 45 days leveling by PvE), and dislike corruption style game mechanics, if the penalties are that excessive that you can kill another player only if he agrees to flag himself as combatant.
And once they win, they get maybe very little. The opponent keeps a large part of the inventory, keeps the gold, his gear... Depending how corruption is balanced, the game can feel to PvE for some PvPers while many PvEers will find other things to complain about.

So the PvX will push away some PvPers and some PvEers.
The middle layer might be large or thin.
I think was larger years ago but now is thin. I hope I'm wrong and we will have at least 10 servers in each region to chose from, when the game is released.

Another thing I am curious is how the action combat will be mixed with the tab targeting and if both sides will be satisfied.

Solvryn

Raven016 wrote: »

Solvryn wrote: »

Raven016 wrote: »

NyceGaming wrote: »

Raven016 wrote: »

There is nothing I would delay.
Every feature may be important for someone.
They already excluded hardcore PvE and PvPers with the PvX approach. At least the middle layer should have no reason to leave to another MMO.

But wouldn’t pvx be INCLUSIVE of both?

No. When Steven was asked what AoC does to retain WoW and FFIV players, he said 'that's the rub' is a PvX game.

But that hardcore PvPers will not like PvX is my opinion. Maybe the deep ocean could offer something but is not the core game.

I've been hardcore at PvE and PvP before WoW or FF14.

So I'm not sure what you mean, really I don't consider either of those titles hardcore.

That was a miscalculation. Maybe I shouldn't have used the word hardcore.
Now I have to face the players who love AoC and consider themselves hardcore

I meant to say that there are players who want just PvP (no 45 days leveling by PvE), and dislike corruption style game mechanics, if the penalties are that excessive that you can kill another player only if he agrees to flag himself as combatant.
And once they win, they get maybe very little. The opponent keeps a large part of the inventory, keeps the gold, his gear... Depending how corruption is balanced, the game can feel to PvE for some PvPers while many PvEers will find other things to complain about.

So the PvX will push away some PvPers and some PvEers.
The middle layer might be large or thin.
I think was larger years ago but now is thin. I hope I'm wrong and we will have at least 10 servers in each region to chose from, when the game is released.

Another thing I am curious is how the action combat will be mixed with the tab targeting and if both sides will be satisfied.

I love both because OWPvP is where iron sharpens iron. Battleground only cats aren’t hardcore to me, they’re safe players.

But I think people will find PvX enjoyable.

Depraved

Solvryn wrote: »

Raven016 wrote: »

Solvryn wrote: »

Raven016 wrote: »

NyceGaming wrote: »

Raven016 wrote: »

There is nothing I would delay.
Every feature may be important for someone.
They already excluded hardcore PvE and PvPers with the PvX approach. At least the middle layer should have no reason to leave to another MMO.

But wouldn’t pvx be INCLUSIVE of both?

No. When Steven was asked what AoC does to retain WoW and FFIV players, he said 'that's the rub' is a PvX game.

But that hardcore PvPers will not like PvX is my opinion. Maybe the deep ocean could offer something but is not the core game.

I've been hardcore at PvE and PvP before WoW or FF14.

So I'm not sure what you mean, really I don't consider either of those titles hardcore.

That was a miscalculation. Maybe I shouldn't have used the word hardcore.
Now I have to face the players who love AoC and consider themselves hardcore

I meant to say that there are players who want just PvP (no 45 days leveling by PvE), and dislike corruption style game mechanics, if the penalties are that excessive that you can kill another player only if he agrees to flag himself as combatant.
And once they win, they get maybe very little. The opponent keeps a large part of the inventory, keeps the gold, his gear... Depending how corruption is balanced, the game can feel to PvE for some PvPers while many PvEers will find other things to complain about.

So the PvX will push away some PvPers and some PvEers.
The middle layer might be large or thin.
I think was larger years ago but now is thin. I hope I'm wrong and we will have at least 10 servers in each region to chose from, when the game is released.

Another thing I am curious is how the action combat will be mixed with the tab targeting and if both sides will be satisfied.

I love both because OWPvP is where iron sharpens iron. Battleground only cats aren’t hardcore to me, they’re safe players.

But I think people will find PvX enjoyable.

agreed

Vaknar

This question was almost set up like a Dev Discussion! So, I'm curious to see what people say! It's almost the anti-thesis to the last Dev Discussion on In-Game Content, in a way

Be sure to check that out if you haven't already, folks! https://forums.ashesofcreation.com/discussion/56073/dev-discussion-54-in-game-content/p1

3Earthling3

Azherae wrote: »

For me, Combat Pets are, in fact, the thing I'd be fine to do without.

Even if they were 'cheap' to make, conceptually, if they actually help at all, and aren't specifically a class feature, then I feel like they'd be among the most chaotic and troublesome contributors to balance issues, and take up a lot of time.

But I don't have a strong basis for this perception other than intuition and some experiences that I really don't think apply to this specific thing.

Totally agree.

Combat pets seem like they can be a mess both with screen clutter and balance. Hoping pets don’t actually add too much in terms of combat.

Kilion

Just from the depth with which Intrepid intents to interconnect the systems I find it hard to imagine many systems that are "optional", though there certainly are some that might have less of an impact. The monster coin system probably will be more important for events than we might think - my assumption here is just because it has the potential to add greater depth to events like sieges or POI invasion events. Fishing as popular as it may be might also be a mechanic that COULD be added later but obviously that would reduce the immersion greatly. Animal husbandry might also be something that is not necessary for the core loops of the game but again - tons of immersion would be lost. Same could be said about the season systems.

But I think going through the list it becomes clear that while these systems aren't directly making the game unplayable, they are critical when it comes to determining the quality of the game and it could be argued that many games failed or never really took off because they tried to release early with barely more than the

NyceGaming

Dygz wrote: »

I mean... "Naval Content" was a Kickstarter add-on.
I think the way it's been implemented, Open Seas has to be available at launch.
If Nodes are not avialable at launch - the game inherently fails.

Agreed! Huge part of the game’s core

NyceGaming

Vaknar wrote: »

This question was almost set up like a Dev Discussion! So, I'm curious to see what people say! It's almost the anti-thesis to the last Dev Discussion on In-Game Content, in a way

Be sure to check that out if you haven't already, folks! https://forums.ashesofcreation.com/discussion/56073/dev-discussion-54-in-game-content/p1

I figured this would be great for the team especially in terms of project management, content prioritization, timelines, and feedback 😄 I just know it’s perhaps something devs couldn’t ask without sending people into a panic so I figured I would lol.

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