Making death punishments more interactive and social

Ashes of Creation seems to following the idea that players should be punished upon death. Part of this punishments comes in the form of experience debt that must be worked off before continuing the leveling process. Some people find this system will be annoying and will hate that they will have so much time wasted. I suggest a modification to the experience debt system to make it less severe while promoting social interactions.

I believe that when a player dies a party member or guild member should be able to loot the "ashes" from that person's corpse. The person with the ashes would then carry the ashes to a nearby respawn point where the person would be reformed from those ashes. If a person if respawned this way, their experience debt would be either prevented, or significantly reduced.

This would make the system more interactive and promote playing with other players. There is still a punishment, which is the time wasted running to the respawn point and back. However, this punishment is much less severe than the max experience. This method would not always be viable if you have friends who died in the middle of a dangerous pack of mobs. Thus players have the choice to either instantly respawn at the nearest point and gain experience debt, or hopefully get saved by a friend.

What are your thoughts?

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Comments

Songcaller

Good luck. Steven played L2 and believes it was fun to grind death duties back for a month before returning to raid.

Liniker

I prefer just grinding off my negative xp, worked great in L2

Songcaller

Liniker wrote: »

I prefer just grinding off my negative xp, worked great in L2

Got to farm Glint anyway lol.

J_mac_

Neurath wrote: »

Good luck. Steven played L2 and believes it was fun to grind death duties back for a month before returning to raid.

I never played L2, would it actually take a month?

Songcaller

J_mac_ wrote: »

Neurath wrote: »

Good luck. Steven played L2 and believes it was fun to grind death duties back for a month before returning to raid.

I never played L2, would it actually take a month?

Depends how good or bad you were. Everything is relative lol.

Edit: It also depends how much you play of course.

Ludullu

J_mac_ wrote: »

I never played L2, would it actually take a month?

A raid encounter could lead to the loss of weeks of XP progress, because you'd die a ton of times.

As for social side of it, L2 had that too. Healers' rezz would give you back a portion of your XP, so quite a lot of people would just lie dead and shout in chat "looking for a healer rezz, will pay".

Ashes should just have smth similar. Solos should farm weak mobs that can't kill them. If they risk harder mobs - they risk dying with higher penalties.

Songcaller

NiKr wrote: »

J_mac_ wrote: »

I never played L2, would it actually take a month?

A raid encounter could lead to the loss of weeks of XP progress, because you'd die a ton of times.

As for social side of it, L2 had that too. Healers' rezz would give you back a portion of your XP, so quite a lot of people would just lie dead and shout in chat "looking for a healer rezz, will pay".

Ashes should just have smth similar. Solos should farm weak mobs that can't kill them. If they risk harder mobs - they risk dying with higher penalties.

it will be sociable though because you should be farming with your guildies/raid members for Glint/XP Debt removal after raids too. I did request Cleric Res gives back xp debt after death before though.

CROW3

It would be kind of fun to throw your buddy’s ashes off a cliff…

Ludullu

CROW3 wrote: »

It would be kind of fun to throw your buddy’s ashes off a cliff…

Chicago

Jesus if steven said the earth was flat liniker would be in her listing reasons and trying to convince us that steven is right, does this guy even think for himself or just make comments on every post telling us why L2 was the greatest game of all time and steven is the almighty

Ludullu

Chicago wrote: »

L2 was the greatest game of all time

Liniker

Chicago wrote: »

Jesus if steven said the earth was flat liniker would be in her listing reasons and trying to convince us that steven is right, does this guy even think for himself or just make comments on every post telling us why L2 was the greatest game of all time and steven is the almighty

@Chicago so you mad because I dont like same shit you like in a video game?

OP asked for our thoughts, I simply replied, how about you stfu, stop reading my comments and just give your own thoughts and feedback instead of policing mine

Enigmatic Sage

i'm no stranger to having to play the game to regain what was lost. Not really a punishment in my opinion. Afaik, you wont drop down in levels using experience bar as example. The level is essentially a check point system.

https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Death_penalties

ironically if non combat is normal, and combatant is half, i would expect to die more as a combatant from gankers and what not so it's not really an advantage aside from other variables. Especially in a solo play perspective.

Group play is encouraged, safety in numbers.

Sylvanar

NiKr wrote: »

Ashes should just have smth similar. Solos should farm weak mobs that can't kill them. If they risk harder mobs - they risk dying with higher penalties.

This lowers my enthusiasm towards questing and leveling in AoC by a lot. One of my favorite part about leveling in WoW was leveling up by doing Orange/Red quests exclusively. Made the whole experience far more interesting than leveling by grinding boring yellow/green/grey quests. As a rogue it was fun to sneak around high level mobs and going straight for the throat of the boss who needed to be killed, popping my cooldowns, revising rotations and throwing that in the face of my friends playing other classes that they cant do the same. Did I mention soloing elites of the same level as well. Btw I am talking about Vanilla and TBC.

Anyway, if the risk of dying to mobs gonna be high, I hope the rewards would be worth it as well so that players can justify leveling via harder quests as well.

Enigmatic Sage

@Sylvanar choice is yours if you want to "risk" doing more difficult quests. I've also seen a rogue pretty much solo a raid boss in BT back when TBC was considered retail because they stacked dodge and used many personals lol.

Ludullu

Sylvanar wrote: »

As a rogue it was fun to sneak around high level mobs and going straight for the throat of the boss who needed to be killed, popping my cooldowns, revising rotations and throwing that in the face of my friends playing other classes that they cant do the same. Did I mention soloing elites of the same level as well. Btw I am talking about Vanilla and TBC.

Sounds like some casual easy soloable stuff, instead of anything hard. Absolutely against anything of value being soloable or easy

Nova_terra

NiKr wrote: »

Sylvanar wrote: »

As a rogue it was fun to sneak around high level mobs and going straight for the throat of the boss who needed to be killed, popping my cooldowns, revising rotations and throwing that in the face of my friends playing other classes that they cant do the same. Did I mention soloing elites of the same level as well. Btw I am talking about Vanilla and TBC.

Sounds like some casual easy soloable stuff, instead of anything hard. Absolutely against anything of value being soloable or easy

Could not agree with this more. If any content of "value" is cheeseable that is a huge miss in my mind. Sure if a Rogue can skip some trash mobs/grey mobs to solo an tier2 or 3 mob than that's fine but. Definitely a different game than TBC WoW.

ArnasPanika

Chicago wrote: »

Jesus if steven said the earth was flat liniker would be in her listing reasons and trying to convince us that steven is right, does this guy even think for himself or just make comments on every post telling us why L2 was the greatest game of all time and steven is the almighty

but he's right tho... 🙄

Sylvanar

NiKr wrote: »

Sounds like some casual easy soloable stuff, instead of anything hard. Absolutely against anything of value being soloable or easy

I did say deaths were involved, hence the excitement for being able to do it solo. Its easy to say things are easy when I can't really prove otherwise. If it wasn't meant to be solo-able it just wouldn't be possible to do solo, regardless of skill. I dunno if you have played WoW or not but it was considered pretty hard to kill an elite of same level with subpar grey gear while leveling - at least before 'heroic' classes were introduced.

Also I am referring to questing and leveling. I dunno what "valuables" I am suppose to gather during that process that I couldn't have gathered by doing that a couple of levels later in an easier way if they were in fact so valuable.

By asking for better risk-reward (which is a core pillar of AoC) in this aspect, I was referring to getting more quantity of drops or currency rather than valuable legendry item/recipes or flying mounts you might be thinking of. Basically that the player level is considered somewhere in those calculations.

What's casual and easy is killing weak mobs, solo or not.

Sylvanar

Enigmatic Sage wrote: »

@Sylvanar choice is yours if you want to "risk" doing more difficult quests. I've also seen a rogue pretty much solo a raid boss in BT back when TBC was considered retail because they stacked dodge and used many personals lol.

Taking risk is always a players choice in AoC. Better reward for that risk is what AoC is all about though. I am fine with death penalties if I fall short, after all its just a game, I don't die irl. If I hesitate to push boundaries here I might as well just sleep.

As far as soloing raid bosses goes, that is just exploiting game mechanics the way the devs did not intend. It could be considered skill but then hacking the game to solo the entire raid should be considered in-game skill as well.

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