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Travel Times
nanfoodle
Member, Founder, Kickstarter, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
I get mounts will get faster and add new skills to help like gliding. Spending 30-45 min to travel across a map, does not feel great. We did this a few times now and once the team broke up just as we got there and had to travel another 30 min to another team that was so badly run, I was earning EXP debt faster then anything. We need faster travel systems, even buying fast horses that are one time rides to different hubs, like DAoC that you could jump off anywhere on the path. Cart systems, or just make the low level mount go faster.
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I like the idea of severely restricted fast travel, truly I do. But the current situation doesn't seem practical. I joined a group farming Church of 7 when I was in Miraleth, and it took me like 15-20 minutes and one death (damn wolves) to get there. I wasn't attuned to a nearby emberspring, so had to basically start my journey again.
Needs to be re-thought, at least a little.
Yeah, man. Like right now, for a light taste of the map, it's 55 square kilometers. The Witcher 3 is 136km/2 World of Warcraft is 207km/2. This map is a third or a quarter of those huge ass games... for a teaser! That is honestly hilarious, and awesome.
That said, I don't mind the travel time as it is currently, but unless other options are added once the entire map is available, or unless sailing is really fast, then yeah, i could see a lot of problems arising from travel time being too long.
Unless they're going for an actual world/continent feel. Node conflicts will be localized, politics will be localized, and threats from afar will likely be less of a concern because of logistics and manpower concerns. That said, if you want to go outside of that familiar sphere, it will be a crazy journey, and the culture where you go may be very different.
My speculation sounds enticing in a fantasy sort of way. I'm not sure how it would survive against reality.
No you dont.
I'll copy paste the comment I made in a similar thread.
Players will ALWAYS be unhappy with the speed of travel and ENDLESSLY clamour for faster transportation.
It's ridiculous, short-sighted, selfish behavior.
Don't fight to eliminate content, fight to make that content more fun.
Don't enjoy travel? Well come up with ideas on how to make travel more fun. Don't argue that travel should be removed.
The people who argue for mounts, for faster mounts, for flying mounts.. these people are the same people who eventually become the people who shout that, "there's no content in this game"
They are the reason we ended up with Dalaran in WoW, with it's portals to every region in the game. Everyone just hearthing to Dalaran and portaling wherever they want to go, then flying straight to the destination.
Retail WoW is a hub-game, like Monster Hunter or Destiny. You hang out in the hub, get teleported or teleport to your destination, do the content, then teleport back. That's not an open world social sandbox mmo.
They are the reason we ended up with the LFG auto-dungeon-party system that teleports you to the dungeon instead of having to interact with the community and journey to the dungeon to do it.
These people are the reason why classic WoW was so very much requested.
These are the people who endlessly tormented the New World devs and community complaining about having to travel everywhere and "needing" mounts.
When the world is made based on a speed of travel, and then you increase that speed, the world and content becomes smaller and more trivial.
These people are the reason why Ashes is a breath of fresh air, with it avoiding these anti-social, anti-immersion systems.
Inconvenience is gameplay.
I'm here for the old school MMO as well but the travel time s out of wack with Ashes. This is not the breath of fresh air you are calling it. Even old school MMO had limited ways to get places faster. Like DAoC horses you could pay to travel faster. I have traveled from one end of the A2 map to the other. I spent about 4hr doing just that.
The problem is compounded, as camps are very far appart with very little in between. If every 15 to 20 min you had a POI to play at. Sure the speed would be fine. It's just not. Need to check 3 camps for a team and that's an evening of game play for a casual. That won't fly.
I rode from the western node to the heartwood tree in 15-20 minutes using the road. Not even a straight line! That's from the edge of the map to the center. There is no way it took you 4 hours to get from one end to the other unless you were stopping along the way.
I walked acccross every corner to do that. It's what I did on the spot test two weeks ago. Have you even been to the big red wall that stops you from traveling further? I have.
Once Caravan starts - the risk of travel time and the reward is the only thing I am worried. I hope it hits the right spot (reward) for long journeys.
People are impatient and MMORPG isn't suited for the 2hr gamers either. This may not be the game for you. Fuck fast movement, fast travel.
Everquest - From Halas to Gnome City was like 2.5hr. If you missed the boat to get to the 2nd continent, you had to wait 40 min for it to come back!
Eventually, just like EQ, AoC will have spell casters create portals to some locations to assist with travel and I am okay with that, as long as those portals are very limited.
Please don't change Ashes. I love this long journey. Just need more danger while traveling.
And if a group decides they are going to make the longer trek, only to find it's already over-populated, then it seems like that's a scenario they are trying to promote as a PVP "opportunity." I'm personally less in love with that idea, but I get it.
This game will not make it without casuals.
I understand why you think that, but it's always been stated and a intended design that citizens in a node on one side of the world might never see a node on the other side (except for Max tier science nodes allowing fast travel)
That's why they actually tripled the intended game map size a year ago or two
You are coming in to the game with a false notion that you are going to see all the content. Unless you nolife the game and/or play as a traveling merchant, you likely aren't.
It's why nodes investing into better roads, caravanseries, and building ports along the ocean is such a big deal, and they wouldn't be a big deal if travel was easy.
They've already stated the intention is for every node to have plentiful content around it, furthered by their regional world storylines that actually affect the region.
You are conditioned by previous games to expect certain things. Ashes, again, is a fresh air because they're trying to break the stale mould.
Steven has already talked about air ships, portals between science nodes, flight paths between nodes and family summoning. Asking for fast horse routes are not outside the current design. Or faster mounts.
Steven has been very open about this game not being for casual or for the masses. They are not seeking to beat WoW or be a WoW killer or have the most userbase. They have been very transparent of that fact throughout the years. He has stated he is fine this game being a niche game for a niche audience.
There is going to be a massive rude awakening for a lot of gamers.
Steven has been clear that this game is also for casuels. No MMO can make it without them. What he said this game will not be for everyone. The norm about 70-80% of a MMOs population is casual.
You nailed it—the instant travel systems in other MMOs, like WoW’s flying, have diminished the sense of a vast world ready for exploration. Players asked for faster travel for years, only to later say the game no longer feels like an expansive world with magic and mystery. In Ashes of Creation, I want fast travel to remain limited, allowing players to experience the full journey instead of skipping to the end.
I’m fully on board with what Ashes already has planned for academic nodes reaching Metropolis stage, where there’s a carefully thought-out system for travel within their vassal networks, even across seas. Airships connecting scientific metropolises will help players move between nodes without undercutting the journey itself. However, it’s essential that this travel isn’t instantaneous—nothing in the game should teleport players to a destination in the blink of an eye.
Imagine watching your journey unfold from the airship’s deck, getting to see the world of Verra pass by in real time. This setup would provide efficient travel for those aligned with scientific metropolises while keeping them connected to the world. Being able to look out over forests, mountains, and seas below would add to the feeling of travel, preserving the sense of distance and immersion that Ashes of Creation has emphasized.
I’d also like to see some wagon or carriage travel on land to provide quicker node-to-node travel along established roads without making it instant. Even for personal transportation options like mounts, a stamina bar for sprinting, tied to a unique skill or resource, could add a layer of resource management that makes travel more engaging. In Ashes of Creation, inconvenience is gameplay—it’s a fundamental part of what makes exploration and progression in a world with meaningful scale.
Now on the other side of the coin I played a Sorc in EQ and since there was only 2 porting classes at the time it made being a Sorc a great asset I cant tell you how many times I got tells from people asking for help to get somewhere or gathering the guild for a raid in some out of the way spot. It was fun and made the druid and sorc more important in the game. I have no issues if somewhere along the line Ashes gives 1 class like mage / mage the ability to portal to a limited number of locations making them a must for any guild or for groups trying to fight somewhere. For the vast majority of us we will still be riding horses around and sometimes yelling for a mage to portal us for X amount of gold somewhere.
As long as the possible fast travel option is contained in a class and they never add a hub for fast travel that anyone can use. Along with keeping the number of locations very limited that a Mage could travel to I don't see a real problem in fact i see the opposite, another economic opportunity for players.
"You can fast Travel 3 times total per RL day and not more than once every game day" is fine with me.
Not really related to Travel times, per se, and I don't actually love Fast Travel or anything, but if one was ever going to compromise, I feel this one could maybe work even in Ashes.
That said, I don't see how that would work for AoC without imposing serious travel restrictions on what you could carry through so the world economy design and risk/reward intent isn't destroyed. And you'd have to consider the impact on PVP.
I'm sure there are ways they could handle this, but every MMO I've played that had fast-travel also had some sort of exploit tied to it (at least at launch). For a game this early in development I'm fine with them leaving it out for now. Plus there will be a quicker type of travel system once nodes get advanced enough. And there is supposed to be node upgrade choices that speed up travel within their jurisdiction.
Then its not for them, lets not dumb down every single game so the "casuals" can play in their 1-2 hour window.
Travel times are perfect, the scale of the world is a character of its own and that shouldn't change. You're not supposed to bounce around every part of the map every day. Its supposed to be an RPG and a journey.
Devs, DO NOT change travel times. You have the perfect amount of travel time right now, and as more content gets added in, that will hopefully silence the complainers (usually they complain anyways).
I do remember they mentioning certain materials can't get teleported. so after a raid of a world boss is done, you're stuck on foot to get to safety. Therefor locking your entire raid to protect you.
this was maybe 3-4 years ago on a dev talk. So they do intend to make certain resources not allowed to be teleported. So that would be awesome, a valheim-esque fast travel that doesnt benefit gatherers or special loot drops
Casual vs. hardcore players
The multiple progression paths in Ashes of Creation are designed to suit different playstyles and offer different "lanes" for players depending on the time they have available to play.[66][67][68][69]
Some progression paths will be more immediately achievable, which are more suited to casual players.[67]
Triggered events such as cravans and sieges will allow casual players to participate in impactful events without significant time investment.[70]
Lower level characters will have usefulness in mass combat that does not depend on their level, such as manning siege weapons, helping repair fortifications, bringing proximity-based buffs to key positions, using stealth or scaling walls. These types of things are relevant to the tide of battle and do not require the player to be max-level or have high combat stats.[71]
There are events that are happening in the world in the game that you won't need to be a hardcore player to impact and join. For example, the triggered events from the PvE standpoint against the cities; the trades of the caravans; those natural battlegrounds that exist; the castle sieges you can login for. There is a lot of systems that are at play where a person can simply log in, participate, have fun, be impactful and then log out.[70] – Steven Sharif
Other progression paths will require a significant time investment, which casual players will take longer to achieve than hardcore players.[67]
The contribution of a large mass of casual players working together may have a greater impact on node progression than hardcore players. Hardcore players may be able to progress into to late-game content faster than casual players, but may lack the numbers to influence the nodes in those locations as quickly as the larger population of casual players.[67]
Traditionally in MMORPGs you're going to see a larger population of casual players than you do of hardcore players; and that's just the way the cookie crumbles from a population standpoint. And because of that and the way that nodes collect experience and advance as a result of player activity, those casual players will actually have more impact on node progression than the hardcore players will: at least as I predict, because of the sheer quantity disproportionate between the two different groups of people... You may see in Ashes the smaller hardcore group of players progress further into the late-game content, right. But they don't have the numbers to influence the nodes in those locations as quickly as the more casual... larger population has near the outskirts.[67] – Steven Sharif
When the game is released and 10000 aktiv players are on the map they will spread out and search there home.
After finding your home you will Mostly stay in this area. I think it is not realy wanted that you are running to 10 different grinding spots at the same day just because you changed 1 group member
You and your guild will mostly stay near 1 metropolis and play around the nodes there.
You will be grinding and gathering in this area and it will feel like YOUR home.
Only for some big expeditions at the weekends or so you are your group/guild will trael around the world to other metropolises or areas to fight for worldbosses or caravans
AoC is not a game like new world where you casually teleport around the world without thinking why you een did that. if you travel somewhere it shuld have a meaning and not just to bring 5 ores from node 1 to node 2 because it feels better to have them all there
As I said above, Steven has already talked about air ships, portals between science nodes, flight paths between nodes and family summoning. Asking for fast horse routes are not outside the current design. Matter of fact its a gold sink and only needs to be slightly faster then mounts by says 10-20% You would need to be in a node to use it and it would only go from node to node. So it wont get you everywhere easier. Letting people hop off the house at any time would make this work much like it did it DAoC. That game also kept fast travel in a minimum.
I think i get it.
It is a Spot-Test and to many People moving around TO QUICKLY -> meaning things are rendering in and out for them fast -> could crash the Server.
This is why the Mountspeed is atrocious compared to the former Presentations. I think we will get faster Mount Speed only in Phase Two or Three.
✓ Occasional Roleplayer
✓ Kinda starting to look for a Guild right now. (German)
Could a potential solution perhaps not be quicker travel, but travel not needing player monitoring?
Perhaps mayors could agree on routes with guarded escort caravans that the players can utilize for a cheap cost? Public transportation if you will. One that can still be attacked by enemy players, but the guards make that much less likely (and probably often safer than travelling alone).
Otherwise, I suppose BDOs solution of "auto walking" (on roads) would be a viable option?
You can fast "recall" by dieng but that costs some of your materials so yea this one hurts
But i think its wanted in the form of worldbosses or stealen goods in your inventory.
If you steal dropped cargo from caravans or get a super rare material from a worldboss fight you would just press Return and your loot would be saved.
If you need to run home the "loosers" from the last fight get a chance to take the item back before you reach your home. i think that is the reason why there is no return teleport.
And with dieng you get a respawn.
i for myself was farming mobs on the east of the map and then found a group near my home. i sold my glint and just died.
i lost some exp but thats it. i was instant home
i dont want fast travels in this game and i dont want AUTO travel. thats just shit seeing everyone riding afk the same way. and this would only end with PKler camping the afk routes killing the afks
Just a reminder to all that even though this page starts by saying there will be no 'Go to Waypoint' mechanics, that has been mentioned as an option.
https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Player_movement#Public_transportation