mainedutch wrote: Β» Miller5862 wrote: Β» Lark Wyll wrote: Β» I don't understand why a movement speed penalty should be applied to corrupted players. there shouldnt be one. period and just having found out people were banned for pvping asmon i dont see this game being worth a dang for pvp players. They weren't PvPing Asmon they we're griefing the fuck out of him. I don't even like the guy but at least I'm smart enough to understand the difference between preventing someone playing the game and PvPing them. It's wild some people can even have this take.
Miller5862 wrote: Β» Lark Wyll wrote: Β» I don't understand why a movement speed penalty should be applied to corrupted players. there shouldnt be one. period and just having found out people were banned for pvping asmon i dont see this game being worth a dang for pvp players.
Lark Wyll wrote: Β» I don't understand why a movement speed penalty should be applied to corrupted players.
This game is intended to be PvX, so you must allow PvP to happen open world naturally. Corruption is just stopping it all together (it's intentionally overturned right now, I know).
Miller5862 wrote: Β» mainedutch wrote: Β» Miller5862 wrote: Β» Lark Wyll wrote: Β» I don't understand why a movement speed penalty should be applied to corrupted players. there shouldnt be one. period and just having found out people were banned for pvping asmon i dont see this game being worth a dang for pvp players. They weren't PvPing Asmon they we're griefing the fuck out of him. I don't even like the guy but at least I'm smart enough to understand the difference between preventing someone playing the game and PvPing them. It's wild some people can even have this take. they are allowed to kill whoever they want thats the entire point of a karma system.. you can be the bad guy.
Uncommon Sense wrote: Β» Miller5862 wrote: Β» Lark Wyll wrote: Β» I don't understand why a movement speed penalty should be applied to corrupted players. there shouldnt be one. period and just having found out people were banned for pvping asmon i dont see this game being worth a dang for pvp players. The simple solution is don't get corrupted... Like why is that so hard to understand. This is essentially an opt in out system within an grey area. The only people bitching about it is the ones who know they'll get account banned for violating terms of service. It needs tweaking sure but the corruption system is viable and it performs the risk/reward mechanic in a PVX game as stated from its Kick Starter design principle.
Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» "If you don't put yourself at an obvious disadvantage you can't complain" You mean like the disadvantage that the pve gatherer without gear that does not like nor ever engage in pvp has that you are complaining you cannot roll up on and force into pvp without incurring a penalty? As previously mentioned, a lot of people on Resna run around flagged during test so stop complaining about PVP not happening and pull up those big boy/girl panties and flag up if you want pvp. For someone stating they are a hardcore PVPr, it sounds more like you want to handpick your battles where you always have the advantage rather than staying flagged like the true hardcores so perhaps think about changing that title to you being a 'select my own battle' PVPr or pseudo-hardcore PVPr? π At first, I was opposed to any opt out mechanic or penalty for pvp but upon experiencing the first three weekends of test, I see how Steven's corruption system can prevent griefing and large guilds always holding the best resource spots simply due to numbers.
Dolyem wrote: Β» "If you don't put yourself at an obvious disadvantage you can't complain"
Dolyem wrote: Β» It takes a smooth brain to not see the bigger picture of testing an exploitive method of gameplay. If I can take the PvP out of the PvX system design for me to be at risk while adventuring, that's an issue.
And ain't that cute, someone is actually testing a system instead of pissing about and you think you're some hardcore gamer π
edit edit: I am also a hardcore PvPer, but as is, I fully plan to utilize corruption as a shield while gathering and PVEing, and utilizing an alt or guildie with bounty hunting to just immediately track down my killer and get 4x rewards. But I doubt I will ever actually get PKed due to the overly severe consequences. Have plenty of other things I plan to test as well but thatll be for phase 3
Corruption should deter griefing. It shouldn't deter PvP, nor allow for anyone to opt-out of it.
Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» It takes a smooth brain to not see the bigger picture of testing an exploitive method of gameplay. If I can take the PvP out of the PvX system design for me to be at risk while adventuring, that's an issue. Exploitive method is simply your negative title to make it sound like the corruption system prevents pvp and you need to utilize an 'exploitive method' to get it which you absolutely do not. And for the record, I don't consider baiting someone into pvp where they kill you exploitive as they ultimately make the decision to attack. I also do not think the system prevents pvp, I think it just forces more pvp between players that want/enjoy PVP and less on those that do not like or want pvp. And ain't that cute, someone is actually testing a system instead of pissing about and you think you're some hardcore gamer π I have not stated I am a hardcore gamer, is this deflection or projection? Oh wait, it was YOU stating you were a hardcore PVPr and me that stated that the hardcore PVPrs actually flag up on my server, they do not stay unflagged and complain about PVP not happening. I see why the callout might be triggering to you. edit edit: I am also a hardcore PvPer, but as is, I fully plan to utilize corruption as a shield while gathering and PVEing, and utilizing an alt or guildie with bounty hunting to just immediately track down my killer and get 4x rewards. But I doubt I will ever actually get PKed due to the overly severe consequences. Have plenty of other things I plan to test as well but thatll be for phase 3 I am curious, from your hardcore PVP perspective, why not just flag up when the person in this β¬οΈ scenario flags to kill you so you actually engage in some pvp rather than just waiting to die? I have never seen the 'wait to die' hardcore PVP approach ever, this is a new one for me. I mean, if he/she flags and you flag, no penalty, just pvp and isn't this your actual goal, some PVP? Or are you the type of hardcore PVPr that would rather talk about PVP than actually engage in it? I mean, in the scenario you give above, just bait people into flagging so you can flag and PVP, right? Corruption should deter griefing. It shouldn't deter PvP, nor allow for anyone to opt-out of it. Corruption does deter griefing, it also deters (does not prevent) people from forcing non-combatants that might not have gear or even pvp experience into PVPing if they do not want to. You can still kill non-combatants, you will just incur a heavy penalty for doing so. You keep mentioning the option to 'opt out' and if people could actually opt out in this game, you would not be able to target nor kill them. π² This is a risk/reward system where you can make the choice to engage and kill the non-combatant or walk away and pull up those big boy panties, flag yourself and look for people that want to pvp or even rat around and flag when you see someone also flagged that you think you can possible handle. Steven has already stated that the corruption system is 'overtuned' for this alpha so we know that the penalties incurred for killing someone will be revised but until then, just flag against those that are flagged and get your PVP on hardcore PVPr. π
Dolyem wrote: Β» Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» It takes a smooth brain to not see the bigger picture of testing an exploitive method of gameplay. If I can take the PvP out of the PvX system design for me to be at risk while adventuring, that's an issue. Exploitive method is simply your negative title to make it sound like the corruption system prevents pvp and you need to utilize an 'exploitive method' to get it which you absolutely do not. And for the record, I don't consider baiting someone into pvp where they kill you exploitive as they ultimately make the decision to attack. I also do not think the system prevents pvp, I think it just forces more pvp between players that want/enjoy PVP and less on those that do not like or want pvp. And ain't that cute, someone is actually testing a system instead of pissing about and you think you're some hardcore gamer π I have not stated I am a hardcore gamer, is this deflection or projection? Oh wait, it was YOU stating you were a hardcore PVPr and me that stated that the hardcore PVPrs actually flag up on my server, they do not stay unflagged and complain about PVP not happening. I see why the callout might be triggering to you. edit edit: I am also a hardcore PvPer, but as is, I fully plan to utilize corruption as a shield while gathering and PVEing, and utilizing an alt or guildie with bounty hunting to just immediately track down my killer and get 4x rewards. But I doubt I will ever actually get PKed due to the overly severe consequences. Have plenty of other things I plan to test as well but thatll be for phase 3 I am curious, from your hardcore PVP perspective, why not just flag up when the person in this β¬οΈ scenario flags to kill you so you actually engage in some pvp rather than just waiting to die? I have never seen the 'wait to die' hardcore PVP approach ever, this is a new one for me. I mean, if he/she flags and you flag, no penalty, just pvp and isn't this your actual goal, some PVP? Or are you the type of hardcore PVPr that would rather talk about PVP than actually engage in it? I mean, in the scenario you give above, just bait people into flagging so you can flag and PVP, right? Corruption should deter griefing. It shouldn't deter PvP, nor allow for anyone to opt-out of it. Corruption does deter griefing, it also deters (does not prevent) people from forcing non-combatants that might not have gear or even pvp experience into PVPing if they do not want to. You can still kill non-combatants, you will just incur a heavy penalty for doing so. You keep mentioning the option to 'opt out' and if people could actually opt out in this game, you would not be able to target nor kill them. π² This is a risk/reward system where you can make the choice to engage and kill the non-combatant or walk away and pull up those big boy panties, flag yourself and look for people that want to pvp or even rat around and flag when you see someone also flagged that you think you can possible handle. Steven has already stated that the corruption system is 'overtuned' for this alpha so we know that the penalties incurred for killing someone will be revised but until then, just flag against those that are flagged and get your PVP on hardcore PVPr. π Thats a lot of words. You still dont seem to understand the entire point of why I am doing what I am doing. I have been actively deterring PvP engagements by not fighting back. The threat of corruption scares people off. And on the rare occasion I do get PKed, I would say 4 times out of 5 I still come out on top by snagging their gear with a revenge kill by me or a guildy. Try to argue about me not being a hardcore PvPer all you want. I am not pushing to be a hardcore PvPer in the Alpha Test. I am testing the flaws in the system which I have been predicting for years now. One of us is obviously just here to play and it aint me. And the very fact that this Test phase carries little to no risk due to the inevitable wipe, players dont give a crap about gear loss despite the corruption punishments. So to say corruption is working well right now is laughable considering the variables. Once players dont have a server wipe to worry about, corruption will be the ultimate shield against PvP if the punishments are too severe for a couple PKs that wouldnt be considered griefing (excessive PKing).
Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» It takes a smooth brain to not see the bigger picture of testing an exploitive method of gameplay. If I can take the PvP out of the PvX system design for me to be at risk while adventuring, that's an issue. Exploitive method is simply your negative title to make it sound like the corruption system prevents pvp and you need to utilize an 'exploitive method' to get it which you absolutely do not. And for the record, I don't consider baiting someone into pvp where they kill you exploitive as they ultimately make the decision to attack. I also do not think the system prevents pvp, I think it just forces more pvp between players that want/enjoy PVP and less on those that do not like or want pvp. And ain't that cute, someone is actually testing a system instead of pissing about and you think you're some hardcore gamer π I have not stated I am a hardcore gamer, is this deflection or projection? Oh wait, it was YOU stating you were a hardcore PVPr and me that stated that the hardcore PVPrs actually flag up on my server, they do not stay unflagged and complain about PVP not happening. I see why the callout might be triggering to you. edit edit: I am also a hardcore PvPer, but as is, I fully plan to utilize corruption as a shield while gathering and PVEing, and utilizing an alt or guildie with bounty hunting to just immediately track down my killer and get 4x rewards. But I doubt I will ever actually get PKed due to the overly severe consequences. Have plenty of other things I plan to test as well but thatll be for phase 3 I am curious, from your hardcore PVP perspective, why not just flag up when the person in this β¬οΈ scenario flags to kill you so you actually engage in some pvp rather than just waiting to die? I have never seen the 'wait to die' hardcore PVP approach ever, this is a new one for me. I mean, if he/she flags and you flag, no penalty, just pvp and isn't this your actual goal, some PVP? Or are you the type of hardcore PVPr that would rather talk about PVP than actually engage in it? I mean, in the scenario you give above, just bait people into flagging so you can flag and PVP, right? Corruption should deter griefing. It shouldn't deter PvP, nor allow for anyone to opt-out of it. Corruption does deter griefing, it also deters (does not prevent) people from forcing non-combatants that might not have gear or even pvp experience into PVPing if they do not want to. You can still kill non-combatants, you will just incur a heavy penalty for doing so. You keep mentioning the option to 'opt out' and if people could actually opt out in this game, you would not be able to target nor kill them. π² This is a risk/reward system where you can make the choice to engage and kill the non-combatant or walk away and pull up those big boy panties, flag yourself and look for people that want to pvp or even rat around and flag when you see someone also flagged that you think you can possible handle. Steven has already stated that the corruption system is 'overtuned' for this alpha so we know that the penalties incurred for killing someone will be revised but until then, just flag against those that are flagged and get your PVP on hardcore PVPr. π Thats a lot of words. You still dont seem to understand the entire point of why I am doing what I am doing. I have been actively deterring PvP engagements by not fighting back. The threat of corruption scares people off. And on the rare occasion I do get PKed, I would say 4 times out of 5 I still come out on top by snagging their gear with a revenge kill by me or a guildy. Try to argue about me not being a hardcore PvPer all you want. I am not pushing to be a hardcore PvPer in the Alpha Test. I am testing the flaws in the system which I have been predicting for years now. One of us is obviously just here to play and it aint me. And the very fact that this Test phase carries little to no risk due to the inevitable wipe, players dont give a crap about gear loss despite the corruption punishments. So to say corruption is working well right now is laughable considering the variables. Once players dont have a server wipe to worry about, corruption will be the ultimate shield against PvP if the punishments are too severe for a couple PKs that wouldnt be considered griefing (excessive PKing). It takes a lot of words when people circle and points have to be repeated. π You are correct, it makes absolutely no sense why someone that claims to be a hardcore PVPr that wants PVP would allow someone to flag on them and stand there and be killed when their goal is supposedly pvp and they would have no penalty for doing so against someone that flags on them. It seems your excuse is that you are attempting to prove something with this sort of 'testing'? Suggesting you are playing as a non-combatant and people are scared to attack you due to penalties demonstrates that Steven's plan to promote more flagged open world pvp and disincentivize both griefers and PKrs is working. I did find it odd that you would state that the threat of corruption scares people off and it was only on rare occasion you would get attacked and then a few sentences later, claim that this test phase carries little to no risk due to wipes and players not giving a crap about gear in test so which is it- players are afraid to attack you due to corruption or corruption doesn't matter as players don't care about losing gear due to test and the upcoming wipe? Your words go from past tense to present and at this point, I am not even certain you have engaged in pvp during this test or even picked up gear from a red or that you even want pvp. π² You did throw me off by implying that I am here for gaming and not testing. Inquiring minds want to know, where did you pull this priceless idea from, me simply opposing something you have said? π€£ And who claimed corruption is working well right now? I have stated repeatedly it is not working as intended and have provided multiple examples. I have also stated that it is currently overtuned which points to penalties being less severe down the road. I simply see some benefit to the core mechanic Steven is putting in place. π€£ Again, your suggestion that corruption will be the perfect shield against pvp is goofy considering we know it is overtuned now and will lessen and we also know that it will deter those that seek out non-combatants and guide them toward actual pvp players that are or will flag for combat. I understand that engaging against someone that flags up for pvp might be scary for some, but I encourage you to give it a try.
Rumlox wrote: Β» i posted this in another thread but ill post it here also I think that if the current system is close to what they ultimately want, they should just turn off PvP unless players actively flag for it. Right now, the only people who engage in open-world PvP are griefers on alts. The current system encourages players to be as annoying as possible in order to bait others into killing them. The PvP meta right now is essentially about pulling mobs into a groupβs AoE to wipe them, and then looting the corpses. If you kill the person doing the training, you risk losing three pieces of gear. I don't want to encourage griefing, but if you can't kill someone who is intentionally being disruptive, what's the point of open-world PvP? Intrepid talks about conflict and risk vs. reward, but whoβs going to take the risk of losing three pieces of gear for a fight? Right now, all you have to do is leave your mount out. If you get attacked, you can stand next to it, and the cleave kills the mount, causing them to go corrupt. Then your group can kill them without even flagging for PvP. Killing someone should carry risk, but the current penalties are too harsh. If you canβt kill the group that just sits on top of your group to farm kills, or the guy who trains mobs on you, or the one looting your tankβs corpse right in front of you, then whatβs the point of having open-world PvP at all? You should be able to kill a few people without the fear of losing gear or getting severe debuffs. The downsides of corruption at level 1 should be more like what we see at corruption level 3. I also think Blight should only apply to kills made while already corrupt. You should be able to kill players who earn it, but going full "murder hobo" should come with significant consequences.
Dolyem wrote: Β» Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» It takes a smooth brain to not see the bigger picture of testing an exploitive method of gameplay. If I can take the PvP out of the PvX system design for me to be at risk while adventuring, that's an issue. Exploitive method is simply your negative title to make it sound like the corruption system prevents pvp and you need to utilize an 'exploitive method' to get it which you absolutely do not. And for the record, I don't consider baiting someone into pvp where they kill you exploitive as they ultimately make the decision to attack. I also do not think the system prevents pvp, I think it just forces more pvp between players that want/enjoy PVP and less on those that do not like or want pvp. And ain't that cute, someone is actually testing a system instead of pissing about and you think you're some hardcore gamer π I have not stated I am a hardcore gamer, is this deflection or projection? Oh wait, it was YOU stating you were a hardcore PVPr and me that stated that the hardcore PVPrs actually flag up on my server, they do not stay unflagged and complain about PVP not happening. I see why the callout might be triggering to you. edit edit: I am also a hardcore PvPer, but as is, I fully plan to utilize corruption as a shield while gathering and PVEing, and utilizing an alt or guildie with bounty hunting to just immediately track down my killer and get 4x rewards. But I doubt I will ever actually get PKed due to the overly severe consequences. Have plenty of other things I plan to test as well but thatll be for phase 3 I am curious, from your hardcore PVP perspective, why not just flag up when the person in this β¬οΈ scenario flags to kill you so you actually engage in some pvp rather than just waiting to die? I have never seen the 'wait to die' hardcore PVP approach ever, this is a new one for me. I mean, if he/she flags and you flag, no penalty, just pvp and isn't this your actual goal, some PVP? Or are you the type of hardcore PVPr that would rather talk about PVP than actually engage in it? I mean, in the scenario you give above, just bait people into flagging so you can flag and PVP, right? Corruption should deter griefing. It shouldn't deter PvP, nor allow for anyone to opt-out of it. Corruption does deter griefing, it also deters (does not prevent) people from forcing non-combatants that might not have gear or even pvp experience into PVPing if they do not want to. You can still kill non-combatants, you will just incur a heavy penalty for doing so. You keep mentioning the option to 'opt out' and if people could actually opt out in this game, you would not be able to target nor kill them. π² This is a risk/reward system where you can make the choice to engage and kill the non-combatant or walk away and pull up those big boy panties, flag yourself and look for people that want to pvp or even rat around and flag when you see someone also flagged that you think you can possible handle. Steven has already stated that the corruption system is 'overtuned' for this alpha so we know that the penalties incurred for killing someone will be revised but until then, just flag against those that are flagged and get your PVP on hardcore PVPr. π Thats a lot of words. You still dont seem to understand the entire point of why I am doing what I am doing. I have been actively deterring PvP engagements by not fighting back. The threat of corruption scares people off. And on the rare occasion I do get PKed, I would say 4 times out of 5 I still come out on top by snagging their gear with a revenge kill by me or a guildy. Try to argue about me not being a hardcore PvPer all you want. I am not pushing to be a hardcore PvPer in the Alpha Test. I am testing the flaws in the system which I have been predicting for years now. One of us is obviously just here to play and it aint me. And the very fact that this Test phase carries little to no risk due to the inevitable wipe, players dont give a crap about gear loss despite the corruption punishments. So to say corruption is working well right now is laughable considering the variables. Once players dont have a server wipe to worry about, corruption will be the ultimate shield against PvP if the punishments are too severe for a couple PKs that wouldnt be considered griefing (excessive PKing). It takes a lot of words when people circle and points have to be repeated. π You are correct, it makes absolutely no sense why someone that claims to be a hardcore PVPr that wants PVP would allow someone to flag on them and stand there and be killed when their goal is supposedly pvp and they would have no penalty for doing so against someone that flags on them. It seems your excuse is that you are attempting to prove something with this sort of 'testing'? Suggesting you are playing as a non-combatant and people are scared to attack you due to penalties demonstrates that Steven's plan to promote more flagged open world pvp and disincentivize both griefers and PKrs is working. I did find it odd that you would state that the threat of corruption scares people off and it was only on rare occasion you would get attacked and then a few sentences later, claim that this test phase carries little to no risk due to wipes and players not giving a crap about gear in test so which is it- players are afraid to attack you due to corruption or corruption doesn't matter as players don't care about losing gear due to test and the upcoming wipe? Your words go from past tense to present and at this point, I am not even certain you have engaged in pvp during this test or even picked up gear from a red or that you even want pvp. π² You did throw me off by implying that I am here for gaming and not testing. Inquiring minds want to know, where did you pull this priceless idea from, me simply opposing something you have said? π€£ And who claimed corruption is working well right now? I have stated repeatedly it is not working as intended and have provided multiple examples. I have also stated that it is currently overtuned which points to penalties being less severe down the road. I simply see some benefit to the core mechanic Steven is putting in place. π€£ Again, your suggestion that corruption will be the perfect shield against pvp is goofy considering we know it is overtuned now and will lessen and we also know that it will deter those that seek out non-combatants and guide them toward actual pvp players that are or will flag for combat. I understand that engaging against someone that flags up for pvp might be scary for some, but I encourage you to give it a try. A lot of words again. Pointless insults. The point of corruption is to deter griefing. Not pvp. All I am proving through what i am doing is that I am able to waltz around gathering, and even infringe on other areas for gathering and xp grinds occupied by players who want to fight for them, and I'm able to punish them for fighting for them by not fighting back at all and simply focus on taking things. They kill me, they lose more stuff when I kill them after. It's a shield against PvP, not just griefing. You'll see it more once people actually have something more permanent to deal with.
Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» It takes a smooth brain to not see the bigger picture of testing an exploitive method of gameplay. If I can take the PvP out of the PvX system design for me to be at risk while adventuring, that's an issue. Exploitive method is simply your negative title to make it sound like the corruption system prevents pvp and you need to utilize an 'exploitive method' to get it which you absolutely do not. And for the record, I don't consider baiting someone into pvp where they kill you exploitive as they ultimately make the decision to attack. I also do not think the system prevents pvp, I think it just forces more pvp between players that want/enjoy PVP and less on those that do not like or want pvp. And ain't that cute, someone is actually testing a system instead of pissing about and you think you're some hardcore gamer π I have not stated I am a hardcore gamer, is this deflection or projection? Oh wait, it was YOU stating you were a hardcore PVPr and me that stated that the hardcore PVPrs actually flag up on my server, they do not stay unflagged and complain about PVP not happening. I see why the callout might be triggering to you. edit edit: I am also a hardcore PvPer, but as is, I fully plan to utilize corruption as a shield while gathering and PVEing, and utilizing an alt or guildie with bounty hunting to just immediately track down my killer and get 4x rewards. But I doubt I will ever actually get PKed due to the overly severe consequences. Have plenty of other things I plan to test as well but thatll be for phase 3 I am curious, from your hardcore PVP perspective, why not just flag up when the person in this β¬οΈ scenario flags to kill you so you actually engage in some pvp rather than just waiting to die? I have never seen the 'wait to die' hardcore PVP approach ever, this is a new one for me. I mean, if he/she flags and you flag, no penalty, just pvp and isn't this your actual goal, some PVP? Or are you the type of hardcore PVPr that would rather talk about PVP than actually engage in it? I mean, in the scenario you give above, just bait people into flagging so you can flag and PVP, right? Corruption should deter griefing. It shouldn't deter PvP, nor allow for anyone to opt-out of it. Corruption does deter griefing, it also deters (does not prevent) people from forcing non-combatants that might not have gear or even pvp experience into PVPing if they do not want to. You can still kill non-combatants, you will just incur a heavy penalty for doing so. You keep mentioning the option to 'opt out' and if people could actually opt out in this game, you would not be able to target nor kill them. π² This is a risk/reward system where you can make the choice to engage and kill the non-combatant or walk away and pull up those big boy panties, flag yourself and look for people that want to pvp or even rat around and flag when you see someone also flagged that you think you can possible handle. Steven has already stated that the corruption system is 'overtuned' for this alpha so we know that the penalties incurred for killing someone will be revised but until then, just flag against those that are flagged and get your PVP on hardcore PVPr. π Thats a lot of words. You still dont seem to understand the entire point of why I am doing what I am doing. I have been actively deterring PvP engagements by not fighting back. The threat of corruption scares people off. And on the rare occasion I do get PKed, I would say 4 times out of 5 I still come out on top by snagging their gear with a revenge kill by me or a guildy. Try to argue about me not being a hardcore PvPer all you want. I am not pushing to be a hardcore PvPer in the Alpha Test. I am testing the flaws in the system which I have been predicting for years now. One of us is obviously just here to play and it aint me. And the very fact that this Test phase carries little to no risk due to the inevitable wipe, players dont give a crap about gear loss despite the corruption punishments. So to say corruption is working well right now is laughable considering the variables. Once players dont have a server wipe to worry about, corruption will be the ultimate shield against PvP if the punishments are too severe for a couple PKs that wouldnt be considered griefing (excessive PKing). It takes a lot of words when people circle and points have to be repeated. π You are correct, it makes absolutely no sense why someone that claims to be a hardcore PVPr that wants PVP would allow someone to flag on them and stand there and be killed when their goal is supposedly pvp and they would have no penalty for doing so against someone that flags on them. It seems your excuse is that you are attempting to prove something with this sort of 'testing'? Suggesting you are playing as a non-combatant and people are scared to attack you due to penalties demonstrates that Steven's plan to promote more flagged open world pvp and disincentivize both griefers and PKrs is working. I did find it odd that you would state that the threat of corruption scares people off and it was only on rare occasion you would get attacked and then a few sentences later, claim that this test phase carries little to no risk due to wipes and players not giving a crap about gear in test so which is it- players are afraid to attack you due to corruption or corruption doesn't matter as players don't care about losing gear due to test and the upcoming wipe? Your words go from past tense to present and at this point, I am not even certain you have engaged in pvp during this test or even picked up gear from a red or that you even want pvp. π² You did throw me off by implying that I am here for gaming and not testing. Inquiring minds want to know, where did you pull this priceless idea from, me simply opposing something you have said? π€£ And who claimed corruption is working well right now? I have stated repeatedly it is not working as intended and have provided multiple examples. I have also stated that it is currently overtuned which points to penalties being less severe down the road. I simply see some benefit to the core mechanic Steven is putting in place. π€£ Again, your suggestion that corruption will be the perfect shield against pvp is goofy considering we know it is overtuned now and will lessen and we also know that it will deter those that seek out non-combatants and guide them toward actual pvp players that are or will flag for combat. I understand that engaging against someone that flags up for pvp might be scary for some, but I encourage you to give it a try. A lot of words again. Pointless insults. The point of corruption is to deter griefing. Not pvp. All I am proving through what i am doing is that I am able to waltz around gathering, and even infringe on other areas for gathering and xp grinds occupied by players who want to fight for them, and I'm able to punish them for fighting for them by not fighting back at all and simply focus on taking things. They kill me, they lose more stuff when I kill them after. It's a shield against PvP, not just griefing. You'll see it more once people actually have something more permanent to deal with. Sorry if my reference to you circling and my needing to repeat points results in more words and this was insulting but honestly, this last post of yours is the same as previous so please refer back to my other replies for a valid rebuttal. (As you seem to be keeping track, only 45 words this time, less than yours) π
Dolyem wrote: Β» Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» It takes a smooth brain to not see the bigger picture of testing an exploitive method of gameplay. If I can take the PvP out of the PvX system design for me to be at risk while adventuring, that's an issue. Exploitive method is simply your negative title to make it sound like the corruption system prevents pvp and you need to utilize an 'exploitive method' to get it which you absolutely do not. And for the record, I don't consider baiting someone into pvp where they kill you exploitive as they ultimately make the decision to attack. I also do not think the system prevents pvp, I think it just forces more pvp between players that want/enjoy PVP and less on those that do not like or want pvp. And ain't that cute, someone is actually testing a system instead of pissing about and you think you're some hardcore gamer π I have not stated I am a hardcore gamer, is this deflection or projection? Oh wait, it was YOU stating you were a hardcore PVPr and me that stated that the hardcore PVPrs actually flag up on my server, they do not stay unflagged and complain about PVP not happening. I see why the callout might be triggering to you. edit edit: I am also a hardcore PvPer, but as is, I fully plan to utilize corruption as a shield while gathering and PVEing, and utilizing an alt or guildie with bounty hunting to just immediately track down my killer and get 4x rewards. But I doubt I will ever actually get PKed due to the overly severe consequences. Have plenty of other things I plan to test as well but thatll be for phase 3 I am curious, from your hardcore PVP perspective, why not just flag up when the person in this β¬οΈ scenario flags to kill you so you actually engage in some pvp rather than just waiting to die? I have never seen the 'wait to die' hardcore PVP approach ever, this is a new one for me. I mean, if he/she flags and you flag, no penalty, just pvp and isn't this your actual goal, some PVP? Or are you the type of hardcore PVPr that would rather talk about PVP than actually engage in it? I mean, in the scenario you give above, just bait people into flagging so you can flag and PVP, right? Corruption should deter griefing. It shouldn't deter PvP, nor allow for anyone to opt-out of it. Corruption does deter griefing, it also deters (does not prevent) people from forcing non-combatants that might not have gear or even pvp experience into PVPing if they do not want to. You can still kill non-combatants, you will just incur a heavy penalty for doing so. You keep mentioning the option to 'opt out' and if people could actually opt out in this game, you would not be able to target nor kill them. π² This is a risk/reward system where you can make the choice to engage and kill the non-combatant or walk away and pull up those big boy panties, flag yourself and look for people that want to pvp or even rat around and flag when you see someone also flagged that you think you can possible handle. Steven has already stated that the corruption system is 'overtuned' for this alpha so we know that the penalties incurred for killing someone will be revised but until then, just flag against those that are flagged and get your PVP on hardcore PVPr. π Thats a lot of words. You still dont seem to understand the entire point of why I am doing what I am doing. I have been actively deterring PvP engagements by not fighting back. The threat of corruption scares people off. And on the rare occasion I do get PKed, I would say 4 times out of 5 I still come out on top by snagging their gear with a revenge kill by me or a guildy. Try to argue about me not being a hardcore PvPer all you want. I am not pushing to be a hardcore PvPer in the Alpha Test. I am testing the flaws in the system which I have been predicting for years now. One of us is obviously just here to play and it aint me. And the very fact that this Test phase carries little to no risk due to the inevitable wipe, players dont give a crap about gear loss despite the corruption punishments. So to say corruption is working well right now is laughable considering the variables. Once players dont have a server wipe to worry about, corruption will be the ultimate shield against PvP if the punishments are too severe for a couple PKs that wouldnt be considered griefing (excessive PKing). It takes a lot of words when people circle and points have to be repeated. π You are correct, it makes absolutely no sense why someone that claims to be a hardcore PVPr that wants PVP would allow someone to flag on them and stand there and be killed when their goal is supposedly pvp and they would have no penalty for doing so against someone that flags on them. It seems your excuse is that you are attempting to prove something with this sort of 'testing'? Suggesting you are playing as a non-combatant and people are scared to attack you due to penalties demonstrates that Steven's plan to promote more flagged open world pvp and disincentivize both griefers and PKrs is working. I did find it odd that you would state that the threat of corruption scares people off and it was only on rare occasion you would get attacked and then a few sentences later, claim that this test phase carries little to no risk due to wipes and players not giving a crap about gear in test so which is it- players are afraid to attack you due to corruption or corruption doesn't matter as players don't care about losing gear due to test and the upcoming wipe? Your words go from past tense to present and at this point, I am not even certain you have engaged in pvp during this test or even picked up gear from a red or that you even want pvp. π² You did throw me off by implying that I am here for gaming and not testing. Inquiring minds want to know, where did you pull this priceless idea from, me simply opposing something you have said? π€£ And who claimed corruption is working well right now? I have stated repeatedly it is not working as intended and have provided multiple examples. I have also stated that it is currently overtuned which points to penalties being less severe down the road. I simply see some benefit to the core mechanic Steven is putting in place. π€£ Again, your suggestion that corruption will be the perfect shield against pvp is goofy considering we know it is overtuned now and will lessen and we also know that it will deter those that seek out non-combatants and guide them toward actual pvp players that are or will flag for combat. I understand that engaging against someone that flags up for pvp might be scary for some, but I encourage you to give it a try. A lot of words again. Pointless insults. The point of corruption is to deter griefing. Not pvp. All I am proving through what i am doing is that I am able to waltz around gathering, and even infringe on other areas for gathering and xp grinds occupied by players who want to fight for them, and I'm able to punish them for fighting for them by not fighting back at all and simply focus on taking things. They kill me, they lose more stuff when I kill them after. It's a shield against PvP, not just griefing. You'll see it more once people actually have something more permanent to deal with. Sorry if my reference to you circling and my needing to repeat points results in more words and this was insulting but honestly, this last post of yours is the same as previous so please refer back to my other replies for a valid rebuttal. (As you seem to be keeping track, only 45 words this time, less than yours) π Nah you just talk a lot without making any real argument. You seem angry that I am working against the system instead of flagging for some reason, like actually testing the system is offensive or something. "Just Flag Bro" nah, I'll just take stuff until people get tired of it and kill me, then I'll take even more stuff by locking in that x4 loot and gear.
If you are not running around always flagged up, you have little room to complain that pvp is not happening frequent enough.
Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» It takes a smooth brain to not see the bigger picture of testing an exploitive method of gameplay. If I can take the PvP out of the PvX system design for me to be at risk while adventuring, that's an issue. Exploitive method is simply your negative title to make it sound like the corruption system prevents pvp and you need to utilize an 'exploitive method' to get it which you absolutely do not. And for the record, I don't consider baiting someone into pvp where they kill you exploitive as they ultimately make the decision to attack. I also do not think the system prevents pvp, I think it just forces more pvp between players that want/enjoy PVP and less on those that do not like or want pvp. And ain't that cute, someone is actually testing a system instead of pissing about and you think you're some hardcore gamer π I have not stated I am a hardcore gamer, is this deflection or projection? Oh wait, it was YOU stating you were a hardcore PVPr and me that stated that the hardcore PVPrs actually flag up on my server, they do not stay unflagged and complain about PVP not happening. I see why the callout might be triggering to you. edit edit: I am also a hardcore PvPer, but as is, I fully plan to utilize corruption as a shield while gathering and PVEing, and utilizing an alt or guildie with bounty hunting to just immediately track down my killer and get 4x rewards. But I doubt I will ever actually get PKed due to the overly severe consequences. Have plenty of other things I plan to test as well but thatll be for phase 3 I am curious, from your hardcore PVP perspective, why not just flag up when the person in this β¬οΈ scenario flags to kill you so you actually engage in some pvp rather than just waiting to die? I have never seen the 'wait to die' hardcore PVP approach ever, this is a new one for me. I mean, if he/she flags and you flag, no penalty, just pvp and isn't this your actual goal, some PVP? Or are you the type of hardcore PVPr that would rather talk about PVP than actually engage in it? I mean, in the scenario you give above, just bait people into flagging so you can flag and PVP, right? Corruption should deter griefing. It shouldn't deter PvP, nor allow for anyone to opt-out of it. Corruption does deter griefing, it also deters (does not prevent) people from forcing non-combatants that might not have gear or even pvp experience into PVPing if they do not want to. You can still kill non-combatants, you will just incur a heavy penalty for doing so. You keep mentioning the option to 'opt out' and if people could actually opt out in this game, you would not be able to target nor kill them. π² This is a risk/reward system where you can make the choice to engage and kill the non-combatant or walk away and pull up those big boy panties, flag yourself and look for people that want to pvp or even rat around and flag when you see someone also flagged that you think you can possible handle. Steven has already stated that the corruption system is 'overtuned' for this alpha so we know that the penalties incurred for killing someone will be revised but until then, just flag against those that are flagged and get your PVP on hardcore PVPr. π Thats a lot of words. You still dont seem to understand the entire point of why I am doing what I am doing. I have been actively deterring PvP engagements by not fighting back. The threat of corruption scares people off. And on the rare occasion I do get PKed, I would say 4 times out of 5 I still come out on top by snagging their gear with a revenge kill by me or a guildy. Try to argue about me not being a hardcore PvPer all you want. I am not pushing to be a hardcore PvPer in the Alpha Test. I am testing the flaws in the system which I have been predicting for years now. One of us is obviously just here to play and it aint me. And the very fact that this Test phase carries little to no risk due to the inevitable wipe, players dont give a crap about gear loss despite the corruption punishments. So to say corruption is working well right now is laughable considering the variables. Once players dont have a server wipe to worry about, corruption will be the ultimate shield against PvP if the punishments are too severe for a couple PKs that wouldnt be considered griefing (excessive PKing). It takes a lot of words when people circle and points have to be repeated. π You are correct, it makes absolutely no sense why someone that claims to be a hardcore PVPr that wants PVP would allow someone to flag on them and stand there and be killed when their goal is supposedly pvp and they would have no penalty for doing so against someone that flags on them. It seems your excuse is that you are attempting to prove something with this sort of 'testing'? Suggesting you are playing as a non-combatant and people are scared to attack you due to penalties demonstrates that Steven's plan to promote more flagged open world pvp and disincentivize both griefers and PKrs is working. I did find it odd that you would state that the threat of corruption scares people off and it was only on rare occasion you would get attacked and then a few sentences later, claim that this test phase carries little to no risk due to wipes and players not giving a crap about gear in test so which is it- players are afraid to attack you due to corruption or corruption doesn't matter as players don't care about losing gear due to test and the upcoming wipe? Your words go from past tense to present and at this point, I am not even certain you have engaged in pvp during this test or even picked up gear from a red or that you even want pvp. π² You did throw me off by implying that I am here for gaming and not testing. Inquiring minds want to know, where did you pull this priceless idea from, me simply opposing something you have said? π€£ And who claimed corruption is working well right now? I have stated repeatedly it is not working as intended and have provided multiple examples. I have also stated that it is currently overtuned which points to penalties being less severe down the road. I simply see some benefit to the core mechanic Steven is putting in place. π€£ Again, your suggestion that corruption will be the perfect shield against pvp is goofy considering we know it is overtuned now and will lessen and we also know that it will deter those that seek out non-combatants and guide them toward actual pvp players that are or will flag for combat. I understand that engaging against someone that flags up for pvp might be scary for some, but I encourage you to give it a try. A lot of words again. Pointless insults. The point of corruption is to deter griefing. Not pvp. All I am proving through what i am doing is that I am able to waltz around gathering, and even infringe on other areas for gathering and xp grinds occupied by players who want to fight for them, and I'm able to punish them for fighting for them by not fighting back at all and simply focus on taking things. They kill me, they lose more stuff when I kill them after. It's a shield against PvP, not just griefing. You'll see it more once people actually have something more permanent to deal with. Sorry if my reference to you circling and my needing to repeat points results in more words and this was insulting but honestly, this last post of yours is the same as previous so please refer back to my other replies for a valid rebuttal. (As you seem to be keeping track, only 45 words this time, less than yours) π Nah you just talk a lot without making any real argument. You seem angry that I am working against the system instead of flagging for some reason, like actually testing the system is offensive or something. "Just Flag Bro" nah, I'll just take stuff until people get tired of it and kill me, then I'll take even more stuff by locking in that x4 loot and gear. Oops, you did it again. π Just as a reminder, it was YOU that first reached out and quoted a post I made that was not replying to you or anyone else in particular. The post simply stated: If you are not running around always flagged up, you have little room to complain that pvp is not happening frequent enough. I stand by this statement as I have had no issues finding pvp during alpha and I have not once turned red. For people that actually like to engage in pvp and not just talk about it on the forums, we are getting our fill in test. Understand that I do not care if you want to use the current corruption system to avoid pvp to get gear, I don't even care if you kill horses or go in and rat loot from people that are actually pvping, it just seems odd that for someone that declared themselves a hardcore PVPr, you are intentionally avoiding it but hey, to each his/her own.
Dolyem wrote: Β» Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» Its_Me wrote: Β» Dolyem wrote: Β» It takes a smooth brain to not see the bigger picture of testing an exploitive method of gameplay. If I can take the PvP out of the PvX system design for me to be at risk while adventuring, that's an issue. Exploitive method is simply your negative title to make it sound like the corruption system prevents pvp and you need to utilize an 'exploitive method' to get it which you absolutely do not. And for the record, I don't consider baiting someone into pvp where they kill you exploitive as they ultimately make the decision to attack. I also do not think the system prevents pvp, I think it just forces more pvp between players that want/enjoy PVP and less on those that do not like or want pvp. And ain't that cute, someone is actually testing a system instead of pissing about and you think you're some hardcore gamer π I have not stated I am a hardcore gamer, is this deflection or projection? Oh wait, it was YOU stating you were a hardcore PVPr and me that stated that the hardcore PVPrs actually flag up on my server, they do not stay unflagged and complain about PVP not happening. I see why the callout might be triggering to you. edit edit: I am also a hardcore PvPer, but as is, I fully plan to utilize corruption as a shield while gathering and PVEing, and utilizing an alt or guildie with bounty hunting to just immediately track down my killer and get 4x rewards. But I doubt I will ever actually get PKed due to the overly severe consequences. Have plenty of other things I plan to test as well but thatll be for phase 3 I am curious, from your hardcore PVP perspective, why not just flag up when the person in this β¬οΈ scenario flags to kill you so you actually engage in some pvp rather than just waiting to die? I have never seen the 'wait to die' hardcore PVP approach ever, this is a new one for me. I mean, if he/she flags and you flag, no penalty, just pvp and isn't this your actual goal, some PVP? Or are you the type of hardcore PVPr that would rather talk about PVP than actually engage in it? I mean, in the scenario you give above, just bait people into flagging so you can flag and PVP, right? Corruption should deter griefing. It shouldn't deter PvP, nor allow for anyone to opt-out of it. Corruption does deter griefing, it also deters (does not prevent) people from forcing non-combatants that might not have gear or even pvp experience into PVPing if they do not want to. You can still kill non-combatants, you will just incur a heavy penalty for doing so. You keep mentioning the option to 'opt out' and if people could actually opt out in this game, you would not be able to target nor kill them. π² This is a risk/reward system where you can make the choice to engage and kill the non-combatant or walk away and pull up those big boy panties, flag yourself and look for people that want to pvp or even rat around and flag when you see someone also flagged that you think you can possible handle. Steven has already stated that the corruption system is 'overtuned' for this alpha so we know that the penalties incurred for killing someone will be revised but until then, just flag against those that are flagged and get your PVP on hardcore PVPr. π Thats a lot of words. You still dont seem to understand the entire point of why I am doing what I am doing. I have been actively deterring PvP engagements by not fighting back. The threat of corruption scares people off. And on the rare occasion I do get PKed, I would say 4 times out of 5 I still come out on top by snagging their gear with a revenge kill by me or a guildy. Try to argue about me not being a hardcore PvPer all you want. I am not pushing to be a hardcore PvPer in the Alpha Test. I am testing the flaws in the system which I have been predicting for years now. One of us is obviously just here to play and it aint me. And the very fact that this Test phase carries little to no risk due to the inevitable wipe, players dont give a crap about gear loss despite the corruption punishments. So to say corruption is working well right now is laughable considering the variables. Once players dont have a server wipe to worry about, corruption will be the ultimate shield against PvP if the punishments are too severe for a couple PKs that wouldnt be considered griefing (excessive PKing). It takes a lot of words when people circle and points have to be repeated. π You are correct, it makes absolutely no sense why someone that claims to be a hardcore PVPr that wants PVP would allow someone to flag on them and stand there and be killed when their goal is supposedly pvp and they would have no penalty for doing so against someone that flags on them. It seems your excuse is that you are attempting to prove something with this sort of 'testing'? Suggesting you are playing as a non-combatant and people are scared to attack you due to penalties demonstrates that Steven's plan to promote more flagged open world pvp and disincentivize both griefers and PKrs is working. I did find it odd that you would state that the threat of corruption scares people off and it was only on rare occasion you would get attacked and then a few sentences later, claim that this test phase carries little to no risk due to wipes and players not giving a crap about gear in test so which is it- players are afraid to attack you due to corruption or corruption doesn't matter as players don't care about losing gear due to test and the upcoming wipe? Your words go from past tense to present and at this point, I am not even certain you have engaged in pvp during this test or even picked up gear from a red or that you even want pvp. π² You did throw me off by implying that I am here for gaming and not testing. Inquiring minds want to know, where did you pull this priceless idea from, me simply opposing something you have said? π€£ And who claimed corruption is working well right now? I have stated repeatedly it is not working as intended and have provided multiple examples. I have also stated that it is currently overtuned which points to penalties being less severe down the road. I simply see some benefit to the core mechanic Steven is putting in place. π€£ Again, your suggestion that corruption will be the perfect shield against pvp is goofy considering we know it is overtuned now and will lessen and we also know that it will deter those that seek out non-combatants and guide them toward actual pvp players that are or will flag for combat. I understand that engaging against someone that flags up for pvp might be scary for some, but I encourage you to give it a try. A lot of words again. Pointless insults. The point of corruption is to deter griefing. Not pvp. All I am proving through what i am doing is that I am able to waltz around gathering, and even infringe on other areas for gathering and xp grinds occupied by players who want to fight for them, and I'm able to punish them for fighting for them by not fighting back at all and simply focus on taking things. They kill me, they lose more stuff when I kill them after. It's a shield against PvP, not just griefing. You'll see it more once people actually have something more permanent to deal with. Sorry if my reference to you circling and my needing to repeat points results in more words and this was insulting but honestly, this last post of yours is the same as previous so please refer back to my other replies for a valid rebuttal. (As you seem to be keeping track, only 45 words this time, less than yours) π Nah you just talk a lot without making any real argument. You seem angry that I am working against the system instead of flagging for some reason, like actually testing the system is offensive or something. "Just Flag Bro" nah, I'll just take stuff until people get tired of it and kill me, then I'll take even more stuff by locking in that x4 loot and gear. Oops, you did it again. π Just as a reminder, it was YOU that first reached out and quoted a post I made that was not replying to you or anyone else in particular. The post simply stated: If you are not running around always flagged up, you have little room to complain that pvp is not happening frequent enough. I stand by this statement as I have had no issues finding pvp during alpha and I have not once turned red. For people that actually like to engage in pvp and not just talk about it on the forums, we are getting our fill in test. Understand that I do not care if you want to use the current corruption system to avoid pvp to get gear, I don't even care if you kill horses or go in and rat loot from people that are actually pvping, it just seems odd that for someone that declared themselves a hardcore PVPr, you are intentionally avoiding it but hey, to each his/her own. Again. Playing vs testing. I'm using corruption in a way that it isn't meant to be used. You're stuck on this "real pvpers flag 24/7" BS. I shouldnt be able to choose differently, that should be a given for everyone at equal or similar levels. All corruption should do is protect low levels, and prevent camping. I shouldn't be able to use corruption the way I am using it. Stop acting like a child.
